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Should the NHS cover the costs of sex change?
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Original post by Beebumble
Maybe if everyone thought like you that would be the case but fortunately not everyone does.
As for life choice. Those with real medical knowledge will disagree.
As for life choice. Those with real medical knowledge will disagree.
You think of the prejudice still around about homosexuals, changing gender is a mind **** for most people.
I would never EVER date a girl who used to be a boy, and to be honest from programmes I've seen it's obvious anyway. It's a waste of tax payers money. I might hate myself and how I look to the point of suicide, will the nhs pay for a total reconstruction of myself? Nope.
It's ridiculous.
Original post by tinman1
You think of the prejudice still around about homosexuals, changing gender is a mind **** for most people.
I would never EVER date a girl who used to be a boy, and to be honest from programmes I've seen it's obvious anyway. It's a waste of tax payers money. I might hate myself and how I look to the point of suicide, will the nhs pay for a total reconstruction of myself? Nope.
It's ridiculous.
I would never EVER date a girl who used to be a boy, and to be honest from programmes I've seen it's obvious anyway. It's a waste of tax payers money. I might hate myself and how I look to the point of suicide, will the nhs pay for a total reconstruction of myself? Nope.
It's ridiculous.
Most of them are not obvious. I've met a few.
Original post by tinman1
You think of the prejudice still around about homosexuals, changing gender is a mind **** for most people.
I would never EVER date a girl who used to be a boy, and to be honest from programmes I've seen it's obvious anyway. It's a waste of tax payers money. I might hate myself and how I look to the point of suicide, will the nhs pay for a total reconstruction of myself? Nope.
It's ridiculous.
I would never EVER date a girl who used to be a boy, and to be honest from programmes I've seen it's obvious anyway. It's a waste of tax payers money. I might hate myself and how I look to the point of suicide, will the nhs pay for a total reconstruction of myself? Nope.
It's ridiculous.
Prejudice towards homosexuals is slowly dying out and more and more people are becoming tolerant. Like I said not everyone is like you and you don't have a medical condition that needs to be rectified.
Of course the NHS should pay. Heath is about more than just survival, it's about quality of life - otherwise why do we spend all this money on painkillers for terminal patients?
If there is a sound medical reason for doing something, then the NHS should be prepared to do it. That is why it exists.
If there is a sound medical reason for doing something, then the NHS should be prepared to do it. That is why it exists.
Original post by Converse Rocker
I don't really get this. If someone feels trapped in the wrong body, I would have thought it could quite easily push them to depression. Also, without trying to sound insensitive, obesity is often caused by the person themselves, which feeling trapped in the wrong gender isn't, surely.
Prioritise treating terminal illness and the like though.
Prioritise treating terminal illness and the like though.
I never did understand the concept of being trapped in the wrong body, i mean being trapped in another body suggests you were in another body before your body now.
but whatever i've never gone through that so i wouldn't know
Original post by bottled
I never did understand the concept of being trapped in the wrong body, i mean being trapped in another body suggests you were in another body before your body now.
but whatever i've never gone through that so i wouldn't know
but whatever i've never gone through that so i wouldn't know
Maybe trapped is the wrong word; I honestly know very little about it.
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by bottled
I never did understand the concept of being trapped in the wrong body, i mean being trapped in another body suggests you were in another body before your body now.
but whatever i've never gone through that so i wouldn't know
but whatever i've never gone through that so i wouldn't know
Does this logic also apply when somebody says they're trapped doing the wrong degree? Is it impossible to recognise that something can be changed for the better without having already experienced what you would change to?
Original post by mmmpie
Does this logic also apply when somebody says they're trapped doing the wrong degree?
Not really no.. One's a university degree, one of which you can open a textbook and look through what you might have to expect, and talk to other people about it.
The other one seems to harbour some other more serious issues
any illness through no fault or choosing of a person that can be life threatening should be treated by the nhs. 50% of all gender dysphoria people have attempted to take their life before the age of 20. Simply because they do not identify outside to the person they really are inside and also because a large part of society can not accept them for who they are and that is not the person with the gender issues fault either. Gender dysphoric people are from all walks of life from low earning incomes to high earning incomes so would have contributed a lot more in tax money to society in their life times than 10,000 for their operation.
Should a person that beats up a transexual because they do not inderstand it or afraid of it, that has not worked all their life when they are capable of working. Instead of contributing to society they have only taken from it all their life. Surely costing the tax payer far more than 10,000. What of these people? There are far more of these people than transgendered costing far more than a mere 1 million over 10 years.
should this person also be given the right to vote against sex change operations being carried out on the NHS budget as well? For if it were not for people like this in society there would be less pressure on the transexual to look so convincing as the sex they identify to be as to avoid any discrimination as they live as how they identify themselves to be. But I must note: the majority of depression is be caused by the fact that they are in the wrong body. Despite any pressure or opposition from tans phobic society. It is this fact that being stuck in the wrong body can make someone a dis functional and un-contributing members of society. If they receive the sex change then they can continue being positively active working members contributing to tax which helps more people of all kinds on the nhs. I would expect they would have payed for the 10,000 cost of operation 10 times over by contributing as an active positive member of society for the remainder of their lives.
if people dis-agree with the sex change operation being carried out on the NHS the only way it will save the tax payer money is to sentence them to taking their own lives. Or force them to pay for it themselves by any means possible. This could mean that they become negative members of society as they are unable to get a normal job as they try to remain true to who they are. They would have to find any means of raising the money to Sex change or take their own life.
Where as if they receive the sex change on nhs I'm sure that by being a positive contributing happy member of society they would undoubtedly cover the 10,000 cost plus much more just by income tax for the remainder of their positive working lives.
when faced with debates as complex as this I don't think people should be so quick to decide unless they are willing to learn a lot more about gender identity dysphoria or any other serious potentially life threatening conditions people are born with through no choice of their own. Everyone has a right to some form of NHS help to improve the quality and well being of their lives wherever possible.
my belief is that is better to use tax payers money to maintain positive contributing members of society that will go on working and contributing ultimately paying for their own treatment and paying for others who need nhs treatment of all kinds. Rather than create negative members of society that won't end up contributing and will end up costing tax payers a lot more over their negative lifetime.
freedom of speech is like having the freedom to express your own identity. Imagine you are not allowed to express your true opinion unless you could raise 10.000 first.
I wish everyone well and good fortune here!
Should a person that beats up a transexual because they do not inderstand it or afraid of it, that has not worked all their life when they are capable of working. Instead of contributing to society they have only taken from it all their life. Surely costing the tax payer far more than 10,000. What of these people? There are far more of these people than transgendered costing far more than a mere 1 million over 10 years.
should this person also be given the right to vote against sex change operations being carried out on the NHS budget as well? For if it were not for people like this in society there would be less pressure on the transexual to look so convincing as the sex they identify to be as to avoid any discrimination as they live as how they identify themselves to be. But I must note: the majority of depression is be caused by the fact that they are in the wrong body. Despite any pressure or opposition from tans phobic society. It is this fact that being stuck in the wrong body can make someone a dis functional and un-contributing members of society. If they receive the sex change then they can continue being positively active working members contributing to tax which helps more people of all kinds on the nhs. I would expect they would have payed for the 10,000 cost of operation 10 times over by contributing as an active positive member of society for the remainder of their lives.
if people dis-agree with the sex change operation being carried out on the NHS the only way it will save the tax payer money is to sentence them to taking their own lives. Or force them to pay for it themselves by any means possible. This could mean that they become negative members of society as they are unable to get a normal job as they try to remain true to who they are. They would have to find any means of raising the money to Sex change or take their own life.
Where as if they receive the sex change on nhs I'm sure that by being a positive contributing happy member of society they would undoubtedly cover the 10,000 cost plus much more just by income tax for the remainder of their positive working lives.
when faced with debates as complex as this I don't think people should be so quick to decide unless they are willing to learn a lot more about gender identity dysphoria or any other serious potentially life threatening conditions people are born with through no choice of their own. Everyone has a right to some form of NHS help to improve the quality and well being of their lives wherever possible.
my belief is that is better to use tax payers money to maintain positive contributing members of society that will go on working and contributing ultimately paying for their own treatment and paying for others who need nhs treatment of all kinds. Rather than create negative members of society that won't end up contributing and will end up costing tax payers a lot more over their negative lifetime.
freedom of speech is like having the freedom to express your own identity. Imagine you are not allowed to express your true opinion unless you could raise 10.000 first.
I wish everyone well and good fortune here!
In short. Yes.
I did think about leaving this thread as most of the posts in it were so old but thought I may as well reply as someone else did recently. As a man who was born biologically female and currently at the very beginning stages of medically transitioning I must ask that people consider all elements of this before they jump to such quick assumptions about it being a choice, something people can easily live with or whatever else.
I completely agree.
The process to undergo a 'sex change' is not easy. There is months and months of therapy required before you are even considered for hormones, whereby you then have to wait up to a year or more once more to receive them, thereby having waited up to two years already. Then there is the wait for any kind of surgery which takes years again, and there isn't just one surgery of course (depending which gender someone is transitioning to, it varies how many procedures can be done and not all trans individuals do have all of the available surgeries). Some people can wait ten years plus for everything to be finished. Then there is the case of taking hormones for the rest of your life to add on.
It isn't something which is taken into lightly by anyone. Not if they know what is involved. I didn't chose to be like this, I come from a really low income family, everything I have I have worked hard to get, I am going to university this year with only money I am able to get grants and loans for because we can not afford to do it any other way.
I suffer from severe depression due to my gender issues. It is true that getting medical treatment doesn't always solve it for everyone, but it certainly makes things a hell of a lot easier in the long run for everyone. Personally, I find it hard to even apply for jobs at the minute as I haven't had my name changed legally, I am lucky that I 'pass' as the right gender fairly well but I know a lot of people that don't. If it was something people could chose to 'be like' or not, I could safely say I myself would NOT pick it and most others I know would say the same.
Even the money claims are ridiculous (as the media, surprise surprise, are not always truthful!). If you want to know more about that though I can easily provide you with rough figures that are a hell of a lot closer to what has been brandished about.
Apologies for the long reply, and that it is so late after it was first started, but reading some of the stuff on here I felt it had to be said - if only to educate one or two people.
I did think about leaving this thread as most of the posts in it were so old but thought I may as well reply as someone else did recently. As a man who was born biologically female and currently at the very beginning stages of medically transitioning I must ask that people consider all elements of this before they jump to such quick assumptions about it being a choice, something people can easily live with or whatever else.
Original post by Shaw123
when faced with debates as complex as this I don't think people should be so quick to decide unless they are willing to learn a lot more about gender identity dysphoria or any other serious potentially life threatening conditions people are born with through no choice of their own. Everyone has a right to some form of NHS help to improve the quality and well being of their lives wherever possible.
I completely agree.
The process to undergo a 'sex change' is not easy. There is months and months of therapy required before you are even considered for hormones, whereby you then have to wait up to a year or more once more to receive them, thereby having waited up to two years already. Then there is the wait for any kind of surgery which takes years again, and there isn't just one surgery of course (depending which gender someone is transitioning to, it varies how many procedures can be done and not all trans individuals do have all of the available surgeries). Some people can wait ten years plus for everything to be finished. Then there is the case of taking hormones for the rest of your life to add on.
It isn't something which is taken into lightly by anyone. Not if they know what is involved. I didn't chose to be like this, I come from a really low income family, everything I have I have worked hard to get, I am going to university this year with only money I am able to get grants and loans for because we can not afford to do it any other way.
I suffer from severe depression due to my gender issues. It is true that getting medical treatment doesn't always solve it for everyone, but it certainly makes things a hell of a lot easier in the long run for everyone. Personally, I find it hard to even apply for jobs at the minute as I haven't had my name changed legally, I am lucky that I 'pass' as the right gender fairly well but I know a lot of people that don't. If it was something people could chose to 'be like' or not, I could safely say I myself would NOT pick it and most others I know would say the same.
Even the money claims are ridiculous (as the media, surprise surprise, are not always truthful!). If you want to know more about that though I can easily provide you with rough figures that are a hell of a lot closer to what has been brandished about.
Apologies for the long reply, and that it is so late after it was first started, but reading some of the stuff on here I felt it had to be said - if only to educate one or two people.
Yes as Gender Idenity Disorder is a recognised disorder, people that want to change their gender should be allowed via the NHS as they are going to contribute to society more if they are comfortable in their body and not depressed.
However the person MUST be a consenting adult, as in the case of David Reimer and the results of Reiner and Gaerhearts study, the person must always be able to understand what they are going through.
However the person MUST be a consenting adult, as in the case of David Reimer and the results of Reiner and Gaerhearts study, the person must always be able to understand what they are going through.
Original post by khala
If thay feel depressed as a result they should be treated with help of a psychiatrist. The fact that they use a psychological problem to fund an operation as a way to solve it is wrong. For example i may feel insecurity and unconfident in myself the way to solve that isn't by getting multiple operations, plus like transgenders it isn't my fault i was born in this body which is ugly. See where im coming from surgery isnt the answer, but i would gladly agree for their funding of a psychiatrist.
its not a psychological problem! Gender dysphoria is a medical condition. And affects to their mental state (e.g depression) stem from this. Youre acting as if treating their symptom will make everything better.. you need to help treat the cause of their suffering. And comparing the feeling of being 'trapped in your own body' (as many people refer to it) to some minor insecurities is absurd.
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by tinman1
You think of the prejudice still around about homosexuals, changing gender is a mind **** for most people.
I would never EVER date a girl who used to be a boy, and to be honest from programmes I've seen it's obvious anyway. It's a waste of tax payers money. I might hate myself and how I look to the point of suicide, will the nhs pay for a total reconstruction of myself? Nope.
It's ridiculous.
I would never EVER date a girl who used to be a boy, and to be honest from programmes I've seen it's obvious anyway. It's a waste of tax payers money. I might hate myself and how I look to the point of suicide, will the nhs pay for a total reconstruction of myself? Nope.
It's ridiculous.
Wow how vein and closed minded is that? I hope that anytime you have issues in your life you are met with the same repsonse. If people have issues then they are their own it is no one's place to undermine and ridicule those issues.
No. Not at all. Yes it’s something they want but it’s their choice so they should have to pay for it. Especially when someone like my self works for a living and can’t even afford to pay for dental care because that isn’t on the nhs and that’s a necessity to everyone
Their not trapped in the wrong gender there is no wrong gender if you dont like it see a therapist they will talk some sence onto that ****ed up mind of theirs
do you think somebody who is suicidal should be able to access medication? or somebody with an eating disorder to get help? well mix them and thats something lije dysphoria its living hell please dont preach about what you are not aware, why shouldnt we have able to live life how we want too? we oay the taxes too, arse
I think the NHS should pay for the transition. As a trans person I know what it is like to have depression about my body, gender disphoria ext. most transgender people end up killing themselves and then everyone wonders why some people commit suicide. I have not had any Sergery but I really want to but don’t have the money to. I deal with depression and such , I don’t think it’s right for trans people to have to go through it. I wouldn’t wish it upon my worst enemy. So yes I think NHS should pay for transition as not all people have the money to pay for it.
You need help bro
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