Turkey joining the EU with 4.4 million newcomers in 15 years + & Opinion poll

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I agree with you in the case of Macedonia, Ukraine and Bosnia, but why should Serbia, with its recent history (yes, I am fully aware of Turkey's history before anyone brings it up), be allowed to join before Turkey. Similarly, Belarus is a dictatorship with a lower press freedom than Russia, explain why it should be allowed to join before Turkey.

My point is, European nations should have all joined or rejected the opportunity before an Asian nation is allowed to join. After Turkey joins, Armenia, Georgia and Azerbaijan eventually will. The Eurasian prophecy isn't looking so stupid now.

The next nations to join should be: Croatia (who will join next year), Iceland, Macedonia, Serbia, Montenegro and Bosnia.

The only issue with Serbia is their relationship with Kosovo. The wars during the break-up of Yugoslavia have nothing to do with the current government, so we can't hold that against them. If I recall correctly, Serbia were being held back for not doing enough to find the war criminal (Mladic) from the Bosnian massacre. Fortunately, they captured him in 2011.

The Dutch government refused to ratify the agreement while Ratko Mladić was not captured. He was captured in Serbia on 26 May 2011, removing the main obstacle for obtaining candidate status.

Turkey currently have a border dispute with Cyprus, so they won't be joining any time soon. That is why Serbia should, and probably will, join before Turkey.

(edited 11 years ago)

Reply 61

Clessus

Original post by Formerly Helpful_C

Fair enough, although Serbia still has a territorial dispute over Kosova, and Cyprus was allowed to join, despite its border dispute with Turkey.

Reply 62

Formerly Helpful_C

Original post by Clessus

Fair enough, although Serbia still has a territorial dispute over Kosova, and Cyprus was allowed to join, despite its border dispute with Turkey.

Yes, but who is going to veto Serbia's accession? Who will veto Turkey? Cyprus.

Reply 63

Rakas21

I am a strong proponent OF Turkey's eventual assecion to the EU.

Economically the EU will see a net benefit from Turkish membership, Turkey will in 15 years have the largest population in the EU and have an economy around the $2tn mark assuming that we see an average of 6% growth for 15 years (this is what they experienced pre-2008), additionally by that time per capita values should not be far off the EU average.

Far from being a basket case, Turkey is already the 6th largest economy in the EU although it is still underdeveloped.

Politically the case is cloudier, whilst Turkey seems fine with Euro/political union membership it is a muslim state and would yield a large amount of political power.

Reply 64

Clessus

Original post by Formerly Helpful_C

Yes, but who is going to veto Serbia's accession? Who will veto Turkey? Cyprus.

True, although a suitable punishment for this intransigence may be recognition of the TRNC. We cannot allow Cyprus to persue the same destructive regional policy as Greece. Likewise if Serbia join too soon they will likely do everything possible to prevent Kosova and possibly Bosnia from joining.

Reply 65

Formerly Helpful_C

Original post by Clessus

Personally, Kosovo should never be allowed to join. I don't recognise them as an independent country. What do they have to offer, though? Nothing.

Reply 66

bishbash72

Original post by Risserd

they have, in fact this is probably the reason they want them part of the EU. since the EU ismrun by liberals and christian-democrats

You what?

Reply 67

Clessus

Original post by Formerly Helpful_C

Personally, Kosovo should never be allowed to join. I don't recognise them as an independent country. What do they have to offer, though? Nothing.

Your own personal opinion on Kosova is irrelevent, the fact remains that the vast majority of the EU does recognise Kosova. If Kosova should not be allowed to join because it "has nothing to offer", then neither should Bosnia as it, thanks to Serbian aggression, is a barely functional state.

Reply 68

internetguru

Turkey are our allies so naturally we should support their plight for EU membership if that is what
their people really want. I feel the UK should leave though.

Reply 69

The_Male_Melons

Original post by Huz

your way of thinking is just bizarre.

Why would it be? Please explain. I find this notion of millions turks comming bizzare too. Turkey is one fast economically growing countries in the world. We are in the recession. Why would anyone want to come to the UK? Please explain?
Furthermore, I sense, personally, that most people are against the idea as has been stated in this thread that somehow it is wrong cos Turkey is a Muslim country. My response is so what? Who cares?

Reply 70

Formerly Helpful_C

Original post by Clessus

Serbian aggression? Ha. It was Bosnian Serbs and Bosnian Croats who were the attacking forces. Sure, they were supplied and supported by Serbia and Croatia, but what do you expect? The break-up of a nation is never an easy thing.

Two problems, though. The first - Bosnia is actually a pretty functional state, that is highly development (ranked 74th in 2011, Serbia is 59th). The second - Serbia has suffered more, as a result, than Bosnia. Have you forgotten about the Americ - sorry, NATO bombing campaign of 1999? Nearly every other nation was against it, but who cares about that? Serbia has done well to recover from every blow it has received.

Of what importance was that building? None. Yet it was struck 12 times, but managed to stay standing.

By the way, why do you call it Kosova? Unless you're Albanian, there is no need. It's Kosovo.

Reply 71

Steve1654

Don't know what to think about this.. Do we really need anymore countries to contribute to the eurozone crisis? Anyone know what kind of effects them joining would have on us economically positively and negatively? :smile:

Reply 72

Bulbasaur

"We need more immigration". I lol'd.

Reply 73

sucess

the racists are coming out

Reply 74

Clessus

I'm aware that this is off-topic, and that this thread is about Turkey's entry into the EU, but I feel compelled to respond.

Original post by Formerly Helpful_C

Belgrade did far more than simply arm and finance the Bosnian Serbs, it also exercised effective military control over them (not sure about Zagreb). That is not to mention direct Serb....I mean "Yugoslav" intervention in the first months of the war, which helped give the Bosnian Serbs a strong advantage early on. No nation break up is easy, but it would have been much easier if Serbia hadn't tried to annex huge chucnks of its neighbour's territory.

Two problems, though. The first - Bosnia is actually a pretty functional state, that is highly development (ranked 74th in 2011, Serbia is 59th)

I ment in terms of its political system. In which case, yes, it is a barely functional state, with the disgusting Republika Srpska abomination having a stranglehold over it.

The second - Serbia has suffered more, as a result, than Bosnia.

Can you possibly for one second be morally serious as a human being and say that? Lets see how Serbia has suffered more than Bosnia...

Have you forgotten about the Americ - sorry, NATO bombing campaign of 1999?

Oh come on...that's the best you got? That hardly compares to the genocidal campaign of ethnic cleansing that the Serbs committed in Bosnia and Kosova, and was in fact a response to said campaign. That's a bit like comparing the Bombing of Dresden (a crime, yes) to the Holocaust (like some German apologists try to do), or Operation Storm (a completely legitimate military action), to Srebrenica, like Serb apologists try to do.

Nearly every other nation was against it, but who cares about that?

Exactly, who cares? I dont. The whole working through the UN approach did nothing for the people of Rwanda and Bosnia and it has done nothing for the people of Sudan. If it comes to defying the UN or preventing genocide, I will choose defying the UN every time.

Blair and Clinton had many flaws, but they deserve credit for acting in Kosova, and for defying the arms embargo against Bosnia, in stark contrast to the absolutely shameful behaviour of the Major government in regards to Croatia and Bosnia.

I also note your rather selective condemnation of unilateral actions. The self-declared sovereign state of Serbia attacked the internationally recognised sovereign states of Slovenia, Croatia and Bosnia without UN approval as well you know. :wink:

Serbia has done well to recover from every blow it has received.

Good for them. :smile:

By the way, why do you call it Kosova? Unless you're Albanian, there is no need. It's Kosovo.

Kosovo is simply the Serbian word adopted into English, and thus not one I recognise.

(edited 11 years ago)

Reply 75

The_Mighty_Bush

Do we really need more EU members? The single currency is already slowly collapsing, we don't need another large country to be added to the EU to make it less stable.

Reply 76

Alpharius

Loaded poll in favour of not agreeing.

Turkey would be a good addition. Their economy is a large one, and their ties could help break down the barriers between western and eastern culture. Their location is a very good one in regards to trade (land/sea), in that sense Anatolia has always been a key area of territory for trade.

So long as they let go of the part of Cyprus they have occupied, I'll be very supportive of it.

As for immigrants, most will go to Germany. There is a massive Turkish presence already in Germany, and with the free movement afforded by EU membership, I can only see the majority of their immigrants heading to Deutschland.

(edited 11 years ago)

Reply 77

Frazeled

Original post by Formerly Helpful_C

No, they shouldn't be allowed to join before some European nations (Serbia, Macedonia, Ukraine, Belarus, Bosnia, etc.).

Belarus is such a poor country and the laws there are terible along with the hospitals they use ancient out of date equipment and its advised if you go over their to get medical insurance so in case of a emergency you can be flown to a country that has decent doctors ( you can be a doctor with the equivalent of d grades over their) and good medical equipment. The risk of geting hep c rabbies and other illnesses when over there is high to plus the food is terible . If we allowed them in to the eu three quarters of the country would be over here i hope it never happens