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The bumper thread of University League Tables discussion - includes an info post

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I'm a Brit who's lived abroad all my life, and in the US, nobody has ever heard of UCL. Ever. Most think I'm talking about UCLA. They have heard about Imperial college and LSE though.
UCL just doesn't stand out in any way. It has a boring name and it's a general university similar to oxbridge, but its reputation is miles below. Hence it has no distinguishing aspects. Imperial and LSE can compete with oxbridge in their respective areas of expertise. UCL cannot compete with oxbridge or lse or imperial.
Do you think one would rather do economics at UCL than LSE?
That one would do mech engineering at UCL than Imperial?
UCL is just an average university.

Has anyone heard of Manchester (the university of, not the football club), in America?

Reply 2201

Onewingedangel

Original post by Tsunami2011

I agree that it may not be as known as either LSE or Imperial, but UCL isn't an average university in comparison to the universities on offer in the UK or even the world. What if you want to study History? or English? LSE and Imperial offers a narrow amount of subjects, so UCL is a popular destination for students who want to be in London.

Well obviously compared to most universities in the world, UCL will be stellar, but I'm talking in relation to your Princetons, Yales, MITs... etc.
UCL is a notch below, unlike what the QS world rankings seems to report.

Reply 2202

sixdaysinthesun

Original post by sarah1345

Has anyone heard of Manchester (the university of, not the football club), in America?

As an American, I can tell you that the only schools most Americans have heard of are Oxbridge and LSE, not even Imperial or any of the other London Unis.

Reply 2203

whyumadtho

Original post by Onewingedangel

How no?
The only UK universities that have international renown are Oxford, Cambridge, LSE, Imperial college.
Nobody outside the UK recognizes UCL.

Proof? You understand what 'average' means, don't you? By no account is UCL average.

In terms of American universities, you can't discount the overriding significance of cultural hegemony in their international reputation. The average person knows of American universities because of their frequent portrayal in films and TV programmes.

Reply 2204

Onewingedangel

Original post by sarah1345

Has anyone heard of Manchester (the university of, not the football club), in America?

Outside academia, I very much doubt it. Though I do know that Manchester has a very strong reputation in Asia, as do red bricks like Sheffield, much more so than they do in the UK itself.

Reply 2205

Valh

Original post by Onewingedangel

How no?
The only UK universities that have international renown are Oxford, Cambridge, LSE, Imperial college.
Nobody outside the UK recognizes UCL.

I'm international too and people recognize Oxford and Cambridge but rarely LSE/Imperial/UCL. But we are both just speaking from anecdotal evidence.

Reply 2206

Sharri5

Original post by sarah1345

Certainly for Undergraduate level, UK universities are renowned around the world as being leaders in this field. Perhaps for postgraduate, the US certainly leads the way however.

Britain does well when you consider the billions American universities receive.

Nope, they may lead but they're not better than american unis.

(edited 12 years ago)

Reply 2207

Onewingedangel

Original post by sarah1345

I agree with this actually.
When it comes to undergraduate study, universities like oxford and cambridge are miles ahead of the joke undergraduate programs they have at places like yale and harvard.

Reply 2208

sarah1345

Original post by Sharri5

Nope, they may lead but they're not better than american unis.

To be honest, you can't say American unis. They have plenty of **** party universities you know, similar to our ex-polys, but we have less, and are a relatively new addition to the British education system.

In America, as long as you have money you'll go to uni. If you took all of our unis, against all of theirs, we'd probably win considering the size of our system. It's tiny to America, yet plenty of universities punch above their weight.

but yes, obviously their top unis are better than our top ones.

Reply 2209

ShredMaster

Original post by Onewingedangel

Stop talking rubbish. Thanks. This is almost as bad as your "blacks and arabs are stupid thread". Just get out xD.

Reply 2210

Apeiron

Original post by Onewingedangel

Remember when UCL was supposedly the 4th best university in the world?
That alone should tell you everything you need to know about the QS world university rankings.
It's total garbage and an insult to the intelligence.
UCL, some average UK university; better than the likes of MIT, Princeton, Oxford, Imperial college, Caltech, Columbia... etc? Don't make me laugh.
Then you have other anomalies like McGill ranking higher than both Toronto and UBC.
They should just give up and throw it all into the fire.

A ranking system measures what it measures according to its methodology. QS uses subjective academic peer review as a main component and currently places UCL 7th. The Times system uses a broader spectrum approach, including a research citation count, and places UCL 17th.

Either way, UCL is way above average, though not in the top league. If people can't be bothered to understand how ranking systems work, they are probably not top university material.

Reply 2211

dirtyoldriver

Original post by Onewingedangel

This is kind of stupid, you're bringing up two universities which specialise and saying that people would rather go there for their specialised subject than to a university which doesn't specialise. It's kind of a no-brainer.
On the other hand, if you wanted to do architecture, english, psychology, law or archaeology you'd probably want to go to UCL since it's departments for all of the above are exceptional and either the best or amongst the best in the country, and I'd imagine very competitive on an international scale as well. Perhaps UCL is not the 4th best in the world, but it is certainly not 'average' by any means.
UK universities will always have a hard time competing against those in the US simply due to funding.

Reply 2212

Theophile

Original post by whyumadtho

this is very true

Reply 2213

No Future

Original post by sarah1345

I'm sure that many abroad simply know the London universities as University of London, or am I wrong?

That's what I meant

Reply 2214

sarah1345

Original post by No Future

That's what I meant

Ah okay, yeah, most abroad just know it as London, Oxford, Cambridge.

Reply 2215

Cabine Sono Qui

Original post by Onewingedangel

You have no idea about UCL do you? It's world class in pretty much every area, especially in humanities, social sciences and medical sciences.

With regards to economics and engineering as you mentioned them: UCL's economics departments is one of the best in the world. If you don't believe me, look at its staff. In the 2008 RAE it scored joint first with LSE above Oxford and Cambridge. For engineering granted it's relatively weaker, but it's improving rapidly and is still top quality.

Basically you're talking a load of garbage. UCL may not have the same 'brand name' as LSE/Imperial, but the gap is small and closing rapidly. Amongst academic and employer circles it's highly regarded and that's all that matters ultimately, not what your average Joe on the street thinks.

QS ranked it 4th in the world last year and 7th this year. The Times ranked it 21st in the world last year and it's moved up to 17th this year. Hardly 'average' :rolleyes:

Reply 2216

Like_A_G6

Should say a degree from Engineering from Imperial, Cambridge or Southampton in India is regarded ridiculously highly. The countries graduates from IIT (best uni in India for engineering) cannot compete with graduates from these institutions. Source: My Indian uni friends doing engineering.