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Why the HELL is America still in Afghan?

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Original post by Indo-Chinese Food

None said it was about human rights, it was about killing islamist terrorists, that muslim countires didnt want to do anything about.

Thanks for informing me... (and cutting and pasting comments from an entire post dedicated to this discussion).

But as regards your comment about womens rights, as far as im aware, america hasnt ever ruled raped women have to marry their rapist or go to jail, as in certain islamic countries.

Erm, I believe that was a disgusting rule undertaken by the Afghan judiciary headed by our ally. Anyway, besides, rulings to actually protect women are negligible if they aren't enforced. The biggest democracy in the world, India is like a donkey with ton of books on its back of fair rulings given to women, yet it's on the list of world worst places as a woman following Afghanistan's lead. Yikes! "Let's go liberate them!".

Reply 41

RadiantA

sigh - why does every thread about muslims or asians get hijacked be far right extremists -_-

Reply 42

RadiantA

Anyways America can't just leave any more. They destroyed the economy with this ILLLEGAL war and it has to be fixed.

If only we could just kick them out, but some form of compensation and settlement has to be worked out before the can leave. There also needs to be a thorough investigation in the international courts.

Reply 43

Aj12

Original post by RadiantA

How is Afghanistan an illegal war?

Reply 44

Dux_Helvetica

Historically, Afghanistan has been unconquerable.

The Brits couldn't do it during the Great Game, the Soviets failed miserably in the late 70s and America is failing now.

Reply 45

Indo-Chinese Food

Original post by harmony_01

Thanks for informing me... (and cutting and pasting comments from an entire post dedicated to this discussion).

Erm, I believe that was a disgusting rule undertaken by the Afghan judiciary headed by our ally. Anyway, besides, rulings to actually protect women are negligible if they aren't enforced. The biggest democracy in the world, India is like a donkey with ton of books on its back of fair rulings given to women, yet it's on the list of world worst places as a woman following Afghanistan's lead. Yikes! "Let's go liberate them!".

You seem to be backpeddling on points now, so we should be invading countries on the basis of womens rights now? That would add a string of islamic countries that need to be hit then - saudi arabia having the lowest legal status for women in the world for example. You would support a few US B-2 bombing raids on Saudi now would you?

(edited 12 years ago)

Reply 46

Phantom Lord

Original post by Dux_Helvetica

Historically, Afghanistan has been unconquerable.

Alexander the Great, Genghis Khan?

(edited 12 years ago)

Reply 47

harmony_01

Original post by Indo-Chinese Food

You're way off the mark here.

I understand we're not invading countries on the basis of women's rights- that is just some poor reasoning given by some.

Reply 48

Indo-Chinese Food

Original post by harmony_01

You're way off the mark here.

I understand we're not invading countries on the basis of women's rights- that is just some poor reasoning given by some.

as far as im concerned theres perfect reasoning - we were attacked unprovoked by afgan based islamists, we asked for them to be handed over, they werent, we bomb islamist to kingdon come.
More logic than our involvement in our countries to be frank.

(edited 12 years ago)

Reply 49

Indo-Chinese Food

Original post by AkaJetson

Alexander the Great, Genghis Khan?

islamic armies of the mughals

Reply 50

Dux_Helvetica

Original post by AkaJetson

Alexander the Great, Genghis Khan?

How long did Alexander and Genghis' empires last? Not long at all. They could not sustain their expansion.

Besides, mine is more in reference to recent history.

Reply 51

harmony_01

Original post by Indo-Chinese Food

As far as I'm concerned, I agree to a whole inquiry into the war by the International Court of Justice.

http://www.ratical.org/radiation/DU/ICTforAatT.html#s7
http://www.globalissues.org/article/334/what-laws-were-broken-by-invading-afghanistan#Thelawwecannotattackacountryjustbecauseitharborsterrorists9

Reply 52

username818763

Original post by Vikitora

According to the US it was - but was it really? Because if you really think about it, you come to realise that they made a lot of their reasons up. In connection with the reform of Currency in Germany as example for American capitalism and considering the amount of supported dictatorships so as to expand; also, thinking of the Sovietunion's fear about the respective position amongst the world's powerful and their as such binded "satellite states"; -
is it really legitimate to take sides? To state that the American policy of the open door should be supporteed more (or less) than the Sovietunion's clinging onto whichever might they had left after the German invasion in WWII?

You are right there, I mean even if the Russians did invade Afghanistan successfully, they wouldn't be able to cause a lot of damage in terms of the Cold War, if Afghanistan had become a satellite state then in the long term it would have been beneficial to us today as the Soviet Union fell soon after the war . Gorbachev begged the Americans not to fund the Muhajideen because he knew they were fanatics. If the USA hadn't been so obsessed with beating the Russians at the time then there wouldn't have been another Afghanistan war or possibly Al-Qaeda.

Reply 53

prog2djent

Russia

Iran

Heroin Trafficking

"Stability"

And helping their indfrastructure as a side show.

Threat of terrorist attacks.

Reply 54

Indo-Chinese Food

Original post by Dux_Helvetica

How long did Alexander and Genghis' empires last? Not long at all. They could not sustain their expansion.

Besides, mine is more in reference to recent history.

Afgans have been rules by various empires, sassanids, mauryan etc. The fact that they are mainly muslims today is a hangover of the mughal/timurid empire.

Reply 55

Indo-Chinese Food

Original post by harmony_01

i dont see it getting very far

Reply 56

calumsteele1

god knows, notionally to squash bin ladens crew and the taliban but then again look at how thats turning out ... the americans and ISAF have failed to learn from the past ... if the might of the british empire and the soviet union couldnt bring Afghanistan under their yoke what hope in hell does america have? its simply turning out to be another vietnam ... kill lots of civillians, piss the rest off no end and throw billions upon billions upon billions of dollars down the drain. if you ask me, imho the possible rewards from this are not worth the investment. afghanistan is a basket case, it always has been a basket case and shall continue being a basket case, waste of money and lives.

Reply 57

s.a.u

Original post by Ajay12

They are there to prevent the (sic) Al-Quaedas using the taliban as base and launching attacks from that base you idiot!.

and why is afghanistan a terrorist base? america's fault

"The mujahideen were significantly financed, armed and trained by the United States [Central Intelligence Agency] (CIA) during the administrations of Jimmy Carter and Ronald Reagan"

precursor to the taliban

Reply 58

Brandmon

Oh how quickly people forget the past.

The US is in Afghanistan for the same reason it was in Germany in 1950s. After defeating an opponent, it wanted to make sure it didn't destabilise and extremist elements to reemerge back in power. Afghanistan would have actually been worse off if NATO just left it be after attacking it in 2001 as it would have resulted in Civil War all over again.

Original post by Dux_Helvetica

Historically, Afghanistan has been unconquerable.

The Brits couldn't do it during the Great Game, the Soviets failed miserably in the late 70s and America is failing now.

Actually Afghanistan has been very conquerable historically. By Greeks, Arabs and Persians from the West and Mughals, Mongols and Hindis from the East. Afghan identity is hardly unique and is actually a product of those cultures who conquered it in the past; not too different than how English culture developed. Furthermore Afghan sovereignty is a relatively contemporary concept.

That said, since when is the US trying to conquer Afghanistan? Afghanistan, despite the NATO presence, is still a sovereign nation last I checked.

Original post by s.a.u

Umm no. Saying that the Mujahadeen are the Taliban is as wrong as saying that the British are Scottish. The Taliban was actually not at all a faction within the Mujahadeen of the 1970s compared to those factions that after the Soviets left would form the Northern Alliance. Only with Pakistan's direct assistance did they emerge and then gain the upper hand in the ensuing Civil War and thus get to power.

So get your facts right. The myth of the US being responsible for the Taliban is a commonly held yet wrong misconception.

(edited 12 years ago)

Reply 59

im so academic

Who the **** cares? The quicker America destroys the taliban and turns it from an Muslim republic into a democratic, "American" state, where the people speaks English and doesn't believe in stupid ideologies, the better for everyone.