[georget1]

Can anyone help...I am keen on bristol because of its grades of AAA compared to durham A*AA. But durham seems to be ranked higher on league tables etc and like the college system etc.
Would anyone say they are equally prestigious? I.e. if you got a first at either and joined societies/good work experience etc. you would have equal chance at getting into a top london law firm? Or is one better?

Of course this is subjective but I need to decide soon and keep swaying between them every few days as I like both so anyone's help is appreciated!

[River85]

The difference in reputation really is fairly negligible, certainly overall (where a significant number of employers don't take university brand name into account) but also at Magic Circle firms where reputation does carry at least a little bit of importance. It should really come down to which of the two you prefer at a personal level.

And, having just read the thread you created in the law forum, I wouldn't think Durham will provide a "culture shock". The North of England isn't a completely different country and such an alien environment and, as you state itself, a large number of Durham's students are from the south. Around 40% are from private schools, most of these southern, and even the majority of state schooled students are from the south. You can relocate Durham City in the south east of England and little will change. This isn't to say it doesn't have an identity, and that this is to some extent "northern" (old mining hall, miners Gala, its religious history and association) but that Durham City does contrast with the former industrial parts of the County.

What do you mean by areas outside Durham being "awful"? Do you know of any in particular? Most of the towns and villages immediately outside Durham are rather pleasant, or at least quite average. There are parts of County Durham which still haven't fully recovered from the closure of industry, specifically coal mining and, in Consett, the steel works, but these are often further afield and more towards the east coast (and the coastline itself is quite beautiful). Even then, though they have some economic deprivation, crime isn't exactly out of control. Elsewhere in County Durham, especially in the south and west, there are some lovely towns and villages, particularly around the boundary with North Yorkshire and, in the West, the Durham Dales and North Pennines (which is an Area of Outstanding Natural Beauty). I don't know anyone who'd call beautiful, and middle class, Barnard Castle or Stanhope "awful", for example.

Looking at the wider region, Newcastle is widely praised as one of the country's most exciting cities, cosmopolitan with great nightlife, beautiful architecture, and great arts scene. The third city in the region, Sunderland, is a mixed bag. Has a great theatre but, in my opinion, little else. Middlesbrough, a town, is....Middlesbrough It has good features but it's unlikely it will be a place you'll need (or want) to go to and, besides, it's Yorkshire really. Northumberland and County Durham are beautiful counties.

Although I cannot speak for Bristol's law department, I really don't see it going "downhill" or Durham being "on the up". Yes, Durham's about to join the Russell Group, but this shouldn't be seen as an "improvement" as such as it was in the 1994 Group previously. The 1994 Group isn't a lesser group, they are just different lobbying groups according to a university's size. Durham, whose research income and size has always placed it at the bottom of the Russell Group/top of the 1994 Group (it has large, excellent science departments like physics, but lacks the medical school and dental schools of most RG universities), could have been a founding member of the official Russell Group in 1994. However, in the early 1990s, it chose to remain unaffiliated, eventually joining the 1994 Group in the year it was formally established. For some reason (and I can only speculate) they have decided that the Russell Group now suits their interests better than the 1994 Group did. That's all it's about. It's not that Durham has improved or on the up. Just a change of lobbying group.

Durham and Bristol have always been ranked comparably in league tables. Both were in the top five/ten in the early to mid 1990s, then Durham fell out of the top ten for a handful of years, and has been back in the top ten/five since 2004 or so. Bristol has experienced something similar. These minor fluctuations shouldn't be perceived as being of any great importance, but just what you'd expect in the statistical game that is league tables. I think Bristol might have suffered as a result of the inclusion of student satisfaction. This isn't unique to Bristol but has been found across most large universities.

In conclusion, as I result this post is long, the Russell Group is just a lobbying group for large research intensive universities. Durham hasn't improved by entering it, nor is the change a sign that it's improved, it's just changed from the 1994 Group. Durham was a potential founding member for the RG in the early 1990s, after all. Employers will not differentiate between the two. Both are equally targeted and graduates from both broadly equally represented. You can consult the Law forum's league table/university comparison sticky for more information on this. Finally, universities do fluctuate in league tables and this isn't any indication of a long-term decline. It's best to get opinions from current and previous Bristol law students rather than relying on league tables and using them in any literal sense. The North of England isn't really much different to the South in many respects, and Durham isn't really very stereotypically "northern" anyway.

I don't mean to be too defensive, but I was just bit a bit bemused when you mentioned some "nasty" areas outside Durham, but don't seem to take into account Bristol's well known problems with crime and deprivation in a number of its wards/suburbs which, in my opinion, are probably greater problems that you'll find in Co. Durham. Bristol isn't all Clifton. All parts of the country have dodgier areas.