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has anyone seen this after the Jimmy Carr incident?

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    Following the Jimmy Carr debacle, this popped up. Pretty good IMO.

    'd like to make you a business offer.

    Seriously. This is a real offer. In fact, you really can't turn me down, as you'll come to understand in a moment...

    Here's the deal. You're going to start a business or expand the one you've got now. It doesn't really matter what you do or what you're going to do. I'll partner with you no matter what business you're in – as long as it's legal.

    But I can't give you any capital – you have to come up with that on your own. I won't give you any labour – that's definitely up to you. What I will do, however, is demand you follow all sorts of rules about what products and services you can offer, how much (and how often) you pay your employees, and where and when you're allowed to operate your business. That's my role in the affair: to tell you what to do.

    Now in return for my rules, I'm going to take roughly a third of whatever you make in the business each year. A third seems fair, doesn't it? I think so. Of course, that's a third of your profits. And you know what, just to make it more attractive, if you choose to pay yourself an income instead of keeping the money in the business I'll take up to half instead of only a third. Well, you know that growing businesses need an incentive for investment, so that seems like a good deal.

    You're also going to have to pay me about 12% of whatever you decide to pay your employees because you've got to cover my expenses for promulgating all of the rules about who you can employ, when, where, and how. Come on, you're my partner. It's only "fair."

    Now... after you've put your hard-earned savings at risk to start this business, and after you've worked hard at it for a few decades (paying me my 33% or a bit more along the way each year), you might decide you'd like to cash out – to finally live the good life.

    Whether or not this is "fair" – some people never can afford to retire – is a different argument. As your partner, I'm happy for you to sell whenever you'd like... because our agreement says, if you sell, you have to pay me an additional 28% of whatever the increased capital value of the business is at that time.

    I know... I know... you put up all the original capital. You took all the risks. You put in all of the labor. That's all true. But I've done my part, too. I've collected 33% of the profits each year. And I've always come up with more rules for you to follow each year. Therefore, I deserve another, final 28% slice of the business.

    Oh... and one more thing...

    Even after you've sold the business and paid all of my fees... I'd recommend buying lots of life insurance. You see, even after you've been retired for years, when you die, you'll have to pay me 40% of your entire estate over about 250k.

    After all, I've got lots of partners and not all of them are as successful as you and your family. We don't think it's "fair" for your kids to have such a big advantage. But if you buy enough life insurance, you can finance this expense for your children.

    All in all, if you're a very successful entrepreneur... if you're one of the rare, lucky, and hard-working people who can create a new company, employ lots of people, and satisfy the public... you'll end up paying me more than 70% of your income over your life. Thanks so much.

    I'm sure you'll think my offer is reasonable and happily partner with me... but it doesn't really matter how you feel about it because if you ever try to stiff me – or cheat me on any of my fees or rules – I'll break down your door in the middle of the night, threaten you and your family with lawsuits funded by an infinite pool of money - amusingly enough, that's a pool you contribute to - and throw you in jail.

    That's how civil society is supposed to work, right? Because that's the offer the state gives its entrepreneurs.
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    (Original post by pshewitt1)
    I'm not really sure what your point is. This cannot be used as an argument for a smaller state or lower taxes, since it is an argument against any kind of civil society or government at all, in which case the business is very unlikely to succeed. Any tax at all is, according this argument, illegitimate. As is any attempt to enforce it. If you can point to an example of where this had been tried and worked out well (feel free to choose any point in history) then the argument would be more convincing.

    In reality, even a cursory glance at history will show that it is precisely the development of civil society and governance that has allowed entrepreneurship to develop. There were many reasons why the industrial revolution took hold first in the UK, but our system of government and institutions was certainly a large part of it.

    Nevertheless, if the entrepreneur would like to try this out, he could move somewhere where there is essentially no state or civil society (limited options, perhaps Somalia) and try to set up his business there.

    He will probably find that his life is both brutal and short.
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    Everyone pays tax. Everyone.

    Being a 'successful businessman' doesn't magically free you from your social obligations any more than the fact someone earns minimum wage should.

    It's about fair taxation. A subject that could be debated and argued but at the end of the day the well off can pay more money than a poor person.

    But also at the end of the day the obscenely rich are still rich, and I find it amusing when even moderately wealthy businessmen and women complain about tax when they can still afford nice homes, multiple cars, all the furnishings and gadgets they could possibly need and generally fund a lifestyle for them and their families most people in the world can only hope for.

    If anything tax avoidance if excusable at all would only apply to the less fortunate who can actually measure quality of life in their disposable income as compared to those who are basically arguing about pure excess.

    You're free to disagree with my opinions of course but basically OP your post was a nice story, but nothing more. Have you thought of writing fiction for a living?
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    In return, I will educate your children for free. I will give you and your family free healthcare. I will fund prosecution of criminals. I will provide a safety net for the poorest in our society. I will invest in national defence. In general, I will build a coherent society. And if you are a successful businessman, you will still get to be obscenely rich.
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    (Original post by Mbob)
    I'm not really sure what your point is. This cannot be used as an argument for a smaller state or lower taxes, since it is an argument against any kind of civil society or government at all, in which case the business is very unlikely to succeed. Any tax at all is, according this argument, illegitimate. As is any attempt to enforce it. If you can point to an example of where this had been tried and worked out well (feel free to choose any point in history) then the argument would be more convincing.

    In reality, even a cursory glance at history will show that it is precisely the development of civil society and governance that has allowed entrepreneurship to develop. There were many reasons why the industrial revolution took hold first in the UK, but our system of government and institutions was certainly a large part of it.

    Nevertheless, if the entrepreneur would like to try this out, he could move somewhere where there is essentially no state or civil society (limited options, perhaps Somalia) and try to set up his business there.

    He will probably find that his life is both brutal and short.

    (Original post by Studentus-anonymous)
    Everyone pays tax. Everyone.

    Being a 'successful businessman' doesn't magically free you from your social obligations any more than the fact someone earns minimum wage should.

    It's about fair taxation. A subject that could be debated and argued but at the end of the day the well off can pay more money than a poor person.

    But also at the end of the day the obscenely rich are still rich, and I find it amusing when even moderately wealthy businessmen and women complain about tax when they can still afford nice homes, multiple cars, all the furnishings and gadgets they could possibly need and generally fund a lifestyle for them and their families most people in the world can only hope for.

    If anything tax avoidance if excusable at all would only apply to the less fortunate who can actually measure quality of life in their disposable income as compared to those who are basically arguing about pure excess.

    You're free to disagree with my opinions of course but basically OP your post was a nice story, but nothing more. Have you thought of writing fiction for a living?

    (Original post by derangedyoshi)
    In return, I will educate your children for free. I will give you and your family free healthcare. I will fund prosecution of criminals. I will provide a safety net for the poorest in our society. I will invest in national defence. In general, I will build a coherent society. And if you are a successful businessman, you will still get to be obscenely rich.
    bear in mind I said has anyone seen this, it was not written by me... not here is my opinion please go to town
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    (Original post by Studentus-anonymous)
    Everyone pays tax. Everyone.
    If you mean tax as in VAT then I guess so
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    ... And I will provide healthcare and schools to make sure you have a healthy and educated workforce at your disposal. I will provide roads to facilitate the transport of your goods and workers, and phone and internet infrastructure as well as a postal service so you can communicate with customers and partners. I will provide a police force to protect your business from crime, a fire brigade to protect it from fire and a military to protect it from foreign threats. I guarantee your business's right to exist within my borders. This **** ain't cheap, so pay up.
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    (Original post by pshewitt1)
    bear in mind I said has anyone seen this, it was not written by me... not here is my opinion please go to town
    Pretty good IMO.
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    (Original post by derangedyoshi)
    That was just me copying and pasting the thing...
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    (Original post by Captain Haddock)
    ... And I will provide healthcare and schools to make sure you have a healthy and educated workforce at your disposal. I will provide roads to facilitate the transport of your goods and workers, and phone and internet infrastructure as well as a postal service so you can communicate with customers and partners. I will provide a police force to protect your business from crime, a fire brigade to protect it from fire and a military to protect it from foreign threats. I guarantee your business's right to exist within my borders. This **** ain't cheap, so pay up.
    without a choice yes... if a purely private system were in place you can't say what would work better...

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