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Mickey Mouse Degrees

Reply 120

Changing Skies

22

Original post by Michael_Hedaux

Mickey Mouse Degrees

(Excluding nursing & architecture obviously)

The fact those two are even on that list makes it a very stupid one :lol:

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Reply 121

rayquaza17

17

Original post by Iggy Azalea

The issue is that History is a general, very traditional academic subject whereas Chemistry is way more specific to a science. History has a lot of interchange with other subjects, thus you pick up things from other subjects along the way. Chemistry can mix with the other 2 sciences but isn't as flexible in this regard, unless you elect to combine subjects intentionally.

General degrees tend to strengthen the following in terms of skills:

- ability to convey meaning
- ability to detect true meaning
- ability to develop opinions
- ability to justify
- ability to debate, argue
- writing skills for audience/purpose
- communication skills

STEM skills on the other hand vary from technical proficiency to data gathering and presenting information.

Hence we cannot say one degree is better than another, purely because there's never any set context (career path). I'm not against STEM at all, but every subject is equal. Calling certain subjects 'mickey mouse degrees' is purely out of ignorance and a lack of logic in understanding what the subject is. If you get where I'm coming from?

I'm not sure you actually understand what we actually do in a STEM degree? I do develop those skills through my maths degree (maybe not so much the debate one). Fair enough I don't write essays, but I've still had projects where I've had to write a bit, and I'm doing a 35-40 page dissertation at the end.

I do get where you're coming from in the last paragraph though. My opinion is that you should go to university to study what you love. If other people don't like what you study, then you shouldn't care because you're doing something you enjoy.

Original post by morgan8002

.

I think TheWaffle was trolling.

Anyway I think most universities just offer a "mathematics" degree rather than "pure mathematics" or "applied mathematics" (although I think a few make a distinction between maths and statistics e.g. at my uni you can do Maths with Statistics). Not all maths research is classed as pure maths though, applied and statistics research goes on as well and this is still maths research. So you can still be a maths researcher without specialising in pure maths.

(edited 9 years ago)

Reply 122

Wade-

10

Original post by Strawberry68

Lol get lost where else do you think all the environmental consultants, GIS users, EQI people, and physical scientists come from.

I'm not sure but most 79% of those geography graduates are unemployed so that goes to show how respected it is

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Reply 123

a10

19

Original post by Iggy Azalea

The important thing to remember here is that we don't know who these 'employers' are. Employers in Media and Social Work wouldn't find much use with an Engineering grad for example, whereas a technology company would find it a right fit. Thus, all degrees are equal and are all valuable to 'employers'. As I've mentioned before on this thread, people are judging degrees completely out of context, making all their points irrelevant.

Going into Media for example, a STEM student would struggle

Lol

Did you know that they are so many directors for the top media firms that have STEM background.

E.g. director of ITN News- Electronic engineer.

Reply 124

username1560589

20

Original post by rayquaza17

I think TheWaffle was trolling.

Anyway I think most universities just offer a "mathematics" degree rather than "pure mathematics" or "applied mathematics" (although I think a few make a distinction between maths and statistics e.g. at my uni you can do Maths with Statistics). Not all maths research is classed as pure maths though, applied and statistics research goes on as well and this is still maths research. So you can still be a maths researcher without specialising in pure maths.

Yes I think they were trolling.

Most do just offer maths degrees. Some offer pure maths or applied maths degrees. Some offer specialist applied maths degrees such as operational research or statistics. You can also do joint honours in for example maths with statistics.

Of course you can be a researcher studying applied maths, or study a maths degree then do pure maths research. I think the primary goal of most people studying pure maths degrees is to go into pure maths research though.

Reply 125

benrobinson3

2

Sorry but what's the point of forcing everyone into a STEM degree?

They're prestige because not many people take them.

Surely by forcing more people to take them, the reputation of them will go down?

Opinions welcomed :smile:

Reply 126

rayquaza17

17

Original post by morgan8002

Yes I think they were trolling.

Most do just offer maths degrees. Some offer pure maths or applied maths degrees. Some offer specialist applied maths degrees such as operational research or statistics. You can also do joint honours in for example maths with statistics.

Of course you can be a researcher studying applied maths, or study a maths degree then do pure maths research. I think the primary goal of most people studying pure maths degrees is to go into pure maths research though.

Statistics is not applied maths! That's blasphemy! :eek:

Reply 127

Michael_Hedaux

1

Original post by Changing Skies

The fact those two are even on that list makes it a very stupid one :lol:

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Really? I'd say it was pretty accurate on the whole. But everyone has their own views I suppose

Reply 128

username1495504

17

Original post by Wade-

I'm not sure but most 79% of those geography graduates are unemployed so that goes to show how respected it is

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lol where is your source for that? Sounds like bs.

Reply 129

DJKL

17

Original post by Wade-

I'm not sure but most 79% of those geography graduates are unemployed so that goes to show how respected it is

Posted from TSR Mobile

Fair number of Chartered Surveyors and Chartered Town Planners come from a geography background.

There are a reasonable number of PG MSc courses that cover the educational requirement for both these institutes (Relevant experience also, of course, required post graduation) and geography/similar degrees tend to be a natural fit with the cognate entry requirements to these MSc courses.

Local to Edinburgh, Heriot Watt offers a few of these courses, e.g.

http://www.postgraduate.hw.ac.uk/prog/msc-sustainable-urban-management/
http://www.postgraduate.hw.ac.uk/prog/msc-urban-and-regional-planning/

Entry is via a first degree in a cognate subject, geosciences usually best fit.

So, who do say Chartered Surveyors work for?

Well life and pensions companies tend to make use of them re property fund management, firms of Chartered Surveyors like Montagu Evans or similar will employ both surveyors and town planners as will property companies, local authorities and central government.

Of course, maybe you consider Chartered status is of no value however given its recognition around the world I suspect you would be mistaken.

In the same way that a law degree does not make one a lawyer, further education/training is required , a degree in the geosciences can often open doors to a professional career pathway.

I would be somewhat slower to disparage before maybe having a little insight into say the property industry for example.

Reply 130

ChaoticButterfly

20

Original post by TheWaffle

Probably pure mathematics. What actual use does that have to anyone? No one uses pythagorous outside of school lol.

That is annoying the physicists in me :mad:

The industrial revolution wouldn't of happened without triangles :colonhash:

Reply 131

cole-slaw

5

Original post by AdamCee

This.

OP, imo there is no such thing as a mickey mouse degree. I would maybe classify the likes of "golf studies" or "football management" as pretty useless, but everything else has its uses. And tbh a degree>no degree, it just depends if it's worth the money and time.

Golf course management is the most headhunted course in the country. Useless it is not.

TBH the useless courses are stuff like history, english, philosophy which don't have really any direct work related uses.

Reply 132

DJKL

17

Original post by ChaoticButterfly

That is annoying the physicists in me :mad:

The industrial revolution wouldn't of happened without triangles :colonhash:

Once upon a time in an Indian village, there lived three squaws. Two squaws had young sons who were very overweight. The first squaw, whose son weighed 150 pounds, always placed her son on a bear hide near a pine grove; the second squaw, whose son also weighed 150 pounds, put her son on a moose hide in the shade of a large oak tree; but the third squaw, who was expecting the birth of her first son, always rested on a hippopotamus hide beside a bubbling brook. Her weight? 300 pounds!

To this day, mathematicians give credit to these women and their children for proving the Pythagorean Theorem, because you see: The squaw of the hippopotamus is equal to the sons of the squaws of the other two hides. :smile:

Reply 133

cole-slaw

5

Original post by benrobinson3

Sorry but what's the point of forcing everyone into a STEM degree?

They're prestige because not many people take them.

Surely by forcing more people to take them, the reputation of them will go down?

Opinions welcomed :smile:

Its not about reputation, its about being productive and highly skilled workers in the 21st century.

Reply 134

cole-slaw

5

I don't think there are any degrees that are completely useless.

What there are, are degrees where the number of graduates each year vastly outnumbers the number of jobs that degree qualifies you for.

Reply 135

jameswhughes

19

Original post by Iggy Azalea

To be honest, it doesn't seem STEM subjects are a wise option to take for anyone under 20. You often see many STEM students drop out or have a change of heart. I mean, while they're specialist degrees, you cannot realistically venture into anything other than that unless you want to start from the bottom. Given that the majority of people change their mind about careers ever so frequently, you're essentially tying yourself down just for job security. I'd say a position for a senior manager in a business would go to someone with a History degree, or maybe a Media student before it would go to a dentistry student. Jobs in Banking, Tourism, Civil Service or Education essentially go to Humanities students, and most people end up pretty happy in these careers.

Having some family members who work in STEM careers, I've found that the jobs themselves, despite the lovely pay, are pretty dull with long hours and isolated periods. I think they're certainly a good option for the most introverted among us, but I'm not sure if it's a job prospect for an average 15 year old. I definitely think STEM subjects, with the exception of Maths possibly, should be treated as pure postgraduate degrees. They just seem so limiting.

So in your world, would people waste three years on an undergraduate degree in media studies before doing something useful like maths, computer science or medicine?

I'd be interested to see the evidence that humanities graduates are more employable than science ones. There are loads of science graduates working in all fields, and if you're more likely to get a job as a science teacher having studied history instead of a STEM subject, then there's something seriously wrong with the teacher recruitment process.

Reply 136

AdamCee

18

Original post by cole-slaw

Golf course management is the most headhunted course in the country. Useless it is not.

TBH the useless courses are stuff like history, english, philosophy which don't have really any direct work related uses.

But courses like history, English and philosophy do have a lot of transferable skills though

I read something once that of all the CEO's in the FTSE 250, the most common degree for them was history

And then ofc you have like Cameron and Ed Balls and like every other politician with PPE from Oxford

Reply 137

TheTechN1304

21

Original post by AsandaLFC

What job are u going to get with your 'degree'Posted from TSR Mobile

ahh. Ignorance is bliss. Language degrees can get you into the foreign office, interpreting, law, banking, journalism and a lot more. GCHQ, MI5/6 advertise that they want language graduates. If you study high ij demand languages like Chinese, Japanese, Russian, Arabic, German and Persian, you're probably more favourable to a lot of employers than someone with a degree in economics.

Reply 138

DJKL

17

Original post by cole-slaw

Golf course management is the most headhunted course in the country. Useless it is not.

TBH the useless courses are stuff like history, english, philosophy which don't have really any direct work related uses.

Funny that, my first degree covered English, History and Philosophy (Scottish M.A. in humanities from University of Edinburgh back in the dark ages (well 1983)) and I have managed to carve out a pretty decent career since graduating.That degree was my entry requirement to a PG Certificate in Accountancy from Aberdeen which at the time was required if non accountancy graduates wished an ICAS (Scottish CA) training contract.

I think my current employers are fairly happy with my abilities to apply my brain to multiple problems outwith my actual niche (accountancy/tax) areas of expertise that can arise from time to time vis a vis my employment e.g. legal issues, HR issues, contract issues, JV issues, insurance, procurement, negotiating or even just looking at issues with little preconceived grounding/ knowledge- sometimes your specialists cannot see the wood for the trees and just looking at an issue fresh gives a different angle.

This narrow focus on subject is not reflected in the real world, yes, some work needs mainly niche knowledge but most other work needs problem solving and in my experience those that tend to slide upwards through management do tend to be those that can apply themselves across multiple disciplines.Finding employees that will think outside the box is the Holy Grail of recruitment, technical experts are great,and often those with a technical relevant skill can use their experience to deal with an issue, but sometimes the generalist has his/her place.

You really have to appreciate that the first degree you receive is often the start not the end of your real education post school, whether structured or otherwise you need to keep learning new material throughout your career; a good degree has little to do with subject and more to do with gaining the skill of being able to educate oneself over the rest of one's life.

Original post by Iggy Azalea

The important thing to remember here is that we don't know who these 'employers' are. Employers in Media and Social Work wouldn't find much use with an Engineering grad for example, whereas a technology company would find it a right fit. Thus, all degrees are equal and are all valuable to 'employers'. As I've mentioned before on this thread, people are judging degrees completely out of context, making all their points irrelevant.

Going into Media for example, a STEM student would struggle against a history, languages, politics student for example.

STEM graduates are needed in the media not only for technical positions (e.g. broadcasting, programming etc.) but also to produce content too; for example, most newspapers have science correspondents, environmental correspondents, etc.

I'll give you social work, though, although from what I understand from my mum who used to be a social worker you need a specific social work degree/qualification. But by original contention was with some of your assertions in your original post in this thread, which are completely untrue and as a STEM ambassador I feel obliged to point out when people are producing incorrect information. There are lots of jobs you could post that would likely not go to a graduate from a STEM discipline, but there are an awful lot of jobs that could, and would. STEM disciplines produce graduates with a wide range of skills that employers look for in a wide range of roles, ergo STEM graduates certainly won't find themselves limited to their field of study.

http://www.parliament.uk/business/committees/committees-a-z/lords-select/science-and-technology-committee/news/stem-report-published/

This thread itself is an example too. Trying to find 'worthless degrees' in the hopes of boosting takeup in another field.

In other words, education is not 'do what interests you' but 'do what other people want you to do so it benefits them'. At this point in time, STEM is the flavour of the month, and so there's a pressure to venture into this field. It's not STEM's fault, as it could be any other subject, but there shouldn't be this elitist attitude purely because a person's interests match the state's interests. Does that make any sense?

Given the rapid industrialisation of the East, the subjects in demand might geniunely switch to Social Work, Media or International Relations.

The state has a vested interest in ensuring there is a large enough supply of skilled and qualified workers for the economy, and reports that we're not producing enough STEM graduates are released practically every month it seems. Given that the state pays for our education, it seems only fair that it also encourages people to enter fields which produce the kinds of workers we need to continue to grow our economy.

And you're not exactly forced to study STEM, are you? No-one is secretly altering your UCAS, swapping history for physics. If anything I would say that, especially under Labour, the government was guilty of promoting simply a university education at all costs, regardless of the field the degree was in, at the expense of apprenticeships and other forms of work based learning.

Mickey Mouse Degrees

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