Feminists Vs Islam (women are disrespected in islam?)

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Please use your brain - apart from one philosopher, no one has written at the exact time of Jesus. Tacitus is the closest you'll get, which is what I meant he was writing at the time of Jesus.

It's also quite idiotic to refuse to accept Tacitus and accept the writings of Eusebius and whatnot, who lives hundreds of years later.

Bias speaks volumes here.

You use your brain.

You're quoting a ROMAN historian, one who was probably a pagan and had the influence of the roman empire around him when he was writing about Christianity a religion that was illegal up until 325AD, as proof, But not authentic Manuscripts from the Bible itself that contains old testament verses from Isaiah written hundreds of years before the birth of Christ which prophecy his coming, his death and his message?

And you're telling me i should use my brain?

Hahaha.

Okay mate.

Reply 81

SuperStar#7

[QUOTE="lulucoco98;63912057"]

Original post by SuperStar#7

Throughout his whole argument I'm saying that women are oppressed in Christianity amongst other religions. There's proof of that, no need to be such a tool.

You're an idiot if you think a verse that asks disorderly women to keep quiet in a church gathering is proof that women are oppressed in Christianity.

Reply 82

BrokenLife

Original post by HAnwar

I do not like your attitude towards the laws of my religion, so please change your tone.

So the answer to my question was basically a no. Thanks.

My attitude is based on the laws of 'your religion'. Do not tell me about Islam, I know my own share about Islam. I was brought up in very religious and strict Muslim family.

No or yes, I'm entitled to hold my opinion so stop becoming defensive. Islam is an ideology and not everyone is going agree with an ideology, so do us a favour and open up your mind a bit and chill.

Reply 83

mariachi

Original post by Butternuts96

The Quran mentions the word prayer, fasting, pilgrimage and a whole bunch of other ideas without explaining them so where on Earth did muslims learn to do these things? From authentic hadiths which explain them. We also have tafseer (commentary on Quranic verses) which can explain something that we are unsure of. Security and strength is something all human beings know that the majority of men have over women (different sporting events in the same sports is an example) and this is confirmed and accepted by all muslim scholars by consensus. And anything that reaches consensus is considered part of the religion.

Like I said . . . Get outta here with your islamophobic intentions. Islam ain't hurting you in the slightest way but you will go out of your way to try to denigrate Islam.

And no, you cannot say that Islam denigrates itself (a popular line amongst you folk) because otherwise people like you wouldn't exist. The ones that would like to stir hatred and whatnot.

Hi B.

still waving around that islamophobic hammer, as I see...

however, this is one of the very few posts where you don't refer us to islamQA for an insight into your opinions

we do appreciate that

best

Reply 84

Al-farhan

Says this

Spoiler

Then this

Spoiler

*Cough* *Cough*
Brain malfunction! Reboot please.
ps:

Spoiler

(edited 8 years ago)

Reply 85

BrokenLife

Original post by SuperStar#7

So what then do you believe, rainbow sunshine muslim?

I believe in the concept of God in Islam to an extent but I just do not like all how God rules us and sexist views in Islam. And let me clarify, this is with any religion, not just Islam.

Reply 86

lulucoco98

[QUOTE="SuperStar#7;63912167"]

Original post by lulucoco98

You're an idiot if you think a verse that asks disorderly women to keep quiet in a church gathering is proof that women are oppressed in Christianity.

Wow mate seriously get a life, first of all you are the idiot. And it's not just that, there are several other examples you can check for yourself. You are getting to personal, do you actually have any friends? Must not with that smelly attitude of yours

Reply 87

username2059657

Original post by Bazzel

inb4 'Quran is all about equality'.

Quran (4:3) - (Wife-to-husband ratio) "Marry women of your choice, Two or three or four"

I dont need to explain tht verse . Its been explained before but if u ask il explain. Notice u didnt quote the full verse because u like to decieive people. The verse saysBut if you fear that you will not be just, then marry only one show me anywhere in any other religious book where it says marry only 1.

Reply 88

reinaadira

And We have enjoined on the person (to be good) to his/her parents: in travail upon travail did his/her mother bear his/her and in years twain was his/her weaning: (hear the command) "Show gratitude to Me and to your parents: to Me is (your final) Goal. (Qur'an 31:14)

And their Lord has accepted of them and answered them: "Never will I suffer to be lost the work of any of you be it male or female: you are members of one another ..."(Qur'an 3:195)

When the female (infant) buried alive is questioned for what crime she was killed. (Qur'an 81: 89) This quote addresses female infanticide

When news is brought to one of them of (the birth of) a female (child) his face darkens and he is filled with inward grief! With shame does he hide himself from his people because of the bad news he has had! Shall he retain her on (sufferance and) contempt or bury her in the dust? Ah! what an evil (choice) they decide on! (Qur'an 16:58 59)

O you who believe! You are forbidden to inherit women against their will... (Qur'an 4:19)

Reply 89

username2059657

Original post by Bazzel

inb4 'Quran is all about equality'.

Quran (4:24) and Quran (33:50) - A man is permitted to take women as sex slaves outside of marriage. Note that the verse distinguishes wives from captives (those whom they right hand possesses).

Verse 4:24 is about married slave women who had been captured at the battlefield itself and whose previous marriages were made null and void because they were unable to go back or had converted to Islam in captivity and didn’t want to go back to their non-Muslim husbands.Marry the unmarried among you and the righteous among your male slaves and female slaves. If they should be poor, Allah will enrich them from His bounty, for Allah is Encompassing and Knowing.Surah An-Nur 24:32

Muhammad Asad comments on this verse:As in verse 4:25, the above verse rules out all forms of concubinage and postulates marriage as the only basis of lawful sexual relations between a man and his female slave.
Source: Message of the Quran 24:32

The Prophet and his companions considered sexual intercourse with unmarried slave girls to be a form of adultery.Habeeb ibn Salim reported: A man had sexual intercourse with the servant girl of his wife, so the matter was referred to Nu’man ibn Basheer. Nu’man said:لَأَقْضِيَنَّ فِيهَا بِقَضَاءِ رَسُولِ اللَّهِ صَلَّى اللَّهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ لَئِنْ كَانَتْ أَحَلَّتْهَا لَهُ لَأَجْلِدَنَّهُ مِائَةً وَإِنْ لَمْ تَكُنْ أَحَلَّتْهَا لَهُ رَجَمْتُهُI will judge them according to the judgment of the Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him. If his wife had given him permission, I will lash him one hundred times. If she did not give him permission, I will sentence him to death.Source: Sunan At-Tirmidhi 1451, Grade: Hasan
so based on tht hadith sex slavery is not allowed unless u marry .

Reply 90

_Fergo

Original post by SuperStar#7

You are deluded - that explains it.

You are literally telling me that Jesus is the Son of God because someone who wrote some crap 800 before his birth supposedly guessed what would happen? And not someone who lived immediately after his death? Is this for real?

The fact that you believe he was born from a virgin is also hilarious.

Finally, it's funny that you use some parts of the Bible to support your opinion but dismiss others because they were written by people who oppose what you say. Bias much?

So yeah, "hahaha".

Reply 91

Al-farhan

Original post by BrokenLife

I do not like your defensive attitude so please change your tone and then talk to me. Everyone is entitled to hold their opinions. Such defensive attitude of Muslims puts me off.

Asking you if you have read up further on a topic other than spouting shallow regurgitated material is a basic question one can ask.
If anyone is being defensive here it is you I'm afraid.

Reply 92

username471863

Original post by reinaadira

Islam certainly gave women some rights, that doesn't change the fact that they get far less than men. This is especially when you look at the imbalance of power in favour of the man in Islamic marriages.

Reply 93

fire_and_ice

Original post by SuperStar#7

Even their false prophet said

Sahih al-Bukhari 2658—The Prophet said: "Isn't the witness of a woman equal to half of that of a man?" The women said: "Yes." He said: "This is because of the deficiency of her mind."

You can imagine how much i cringe anytime i see a woman defending islam .

Is it really that hard to go onto google, paste that quotation and look for Islamic interpretations for it? Or, are you just dumb?

Anyway, because I have nothing better to do, do yourself a favor and give this a read. I also don't know what the hell happened the other paragraphs when I pasted it, and I can't be bothered to amend it since I'm using my iPad. Here it is:

Before I give you my result, I would like to say that the translation of the Arabic language done for the hadith and the Qur'an are weak. They don't point out the grammatical significance of the words, which does matter for interpretation. They also don't point out how the structure of the Arabic sentence, which, again, matters. So, unless you know Arabic, you shouldn't take it into task to interpret these texts. You should either go to someone with knowledge or gain knowledge yourself.Also, for better interpretation, you should also take a look at other hadiths.That being said, here is my result.

First :Let us try to understand what the word intelligence here mean.. Intelligence here rather means intellect, that is why many scholars consider translation as a cause for the misunderstanding of this hadith.That is why some consider the above translation as wrong and give the following as its correction“The Messenger of Allah once said to a group of women: O Women, give charity. I see the majority of those in hellfire to be women. They said: why is it so, O Messenger of Allah? He said: You rebuke a lot and you are disobedient towards your husbands. I have not seen any one who has more influence on an intelligent and sensible man, than you, although you are deficient in intellect and religion. A cautious, sensible man can easily be led astray by you. The women asked: O Allah's Messenger, what is deficient in our intellect and religion? He said: Is not the evidence of two women equal to the witness of one man? They replied in the affirmative. He said: This is the deficiency in your intelligence'... 'Isn't it true that a woman can neither pray nor fast during her menstruation? The women replied in the affirmative. He said: This is the deficiency in your religion.''They give the following explanation to the above hadithIn this narrative of the Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, according to a normal principle of the classical Arabic language, some words have been suppressed. The words "Naqisa'tul-`aql wal-deen" translated as: "deficient in intellect and religion" have the noun "umu'r" suppressed. The complete phrase is: "Naqisa'tu umu'ril-`aql wal-di'n" or "Naqisa't fi' umu'ril-`aql wal-di'n" i.e. "deficient in responsibility in matters pertaining to intellect and religion.A thorough deliberation on the narrative in the light of the above explanation would clarify the meaning of this narrative. The Prophet , peace and blessings be upon him, directs the group of women to give a lot of charity to balance out their weaknesses. He then informs them of two of their important weaknesses, i.e., they are quick in rebuke and are disobedient to their husbands. Both these qualities may result in making the family life very miserable. He then expresses his surprise at their influence on their men by saying that although God has reduced their responsibility in matters pertaining to practical wisdom and religion, strange as it is, they have a tremendous influence on their men.)

Second :Arab philosophers consider the human mind has two parts one which has all his instinct-based behavior, as well as his being God’s trustee on earth which is the one that Allah created inside man. The other one is based on the intelligence, intellect and brilliance. Consequently, they say that some humans can have one strong and the other deficient whether men or women equally.Based on Arab philosophers theory, The famous scholar Al-Mawardi said that the real intellect is the one responsible for the human actions as Allah’s vicegerent on earth. That is the one meant by the word (intelligence) in this hadith. That is why the hadith said (deficient in intelligence and religion) i.e. used the woman’s deficiency in intellect with her having less religious responsibilities. The hadith actually speaks of the part of the mind responsible for the human as vicegerent on earth.As for her deficiency in intellect, Women can not control her feelings as much as man and is more patient and merciful than man and is much easily moved by tragic situations than man which is her nature that is why her responsibilities as Allah vicegerent on earth are less. For example she does not have to financially support the family while financially supporting the family is one of the man’s major responsibilities. Another example is her testimony in debt registration sessions or transactions which is a field not frequently tackled by women, which requires great accuracy and understanding of financial matters, in this case her testimony is half that of a man (please refer to page 21 for further discussion of this point in Islam).As for her deficiency in religion it is because during her menstruation she does not fast or pray.Both deficiencies are not meant to humiliate or underestimate women but rather understanding her nature. Women have less responsibilities as Allah vicegerent on earth that is the part of their intellect that is missing but it never means that women are brainless, unwise, less intelligent or even less religious than men. The hadith rather empathizes women nature as the part of humanity responsible for emotions and mercy than men.Before we leave this matter we have to say here that in various occasions the Holy Quran and Prophet Muhammad, peace and blessings be upon him, praised women intelligence and wisdom.The holy Quran praised Belqees The Queen of Sheba’s wisdom and narrated her story with Prophet Soloman, blessings be upon him, in the following verses“She said: O chiefs! give me advice respecting my affair: I never decide an affair until you are in my presence They said: We are possessors of strength and possessors of mighty prowess, and the command is yours, therefore see what you will command. She said: Surely the kings, when they enter a town, ruin it and make the noblest of its people to be low, and thus they (always) do; And surely I am going to send a present to them, and shall wait to see what (answer) do the messengers bring back.” (AlNaml – 32:35)Belquees, the Queen of Sheba was a woman in a ruling position. She represented a democratic ruler who consulted with her people before making important decisions.“It was said to her: Enter the palace; but when she saw it she deemed it to be a great expanse of water, and bared her legs. He said: Surely it is a palace made smooth with glass. She said: My Lord! surely I have been unjust to myself, and I submit with Sulaiman to Allah, the Lord of the worlds.” (AlNaml – 44)After witnessing what God gave Solomon, she became a Muslim, while still the Queen of Sheba. When she saw the interior of Solomon’s palace, she thought it was a pool of water, and she (pulled up her dress) exposing her legs. He said, "This interior is now paved with crystal." She said, “My Lord! surely I have been unjust to myself, and I submit with Sulaiman to Allah, the Lord of the worlds”In another hadith a woman came asking the prophet and he praised her wisdom and eloquence. The Noble Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, consulted his wives, may Allah be pleased with them, in many critical occasions and followed their opinion like in case of Um Salama, may Allah be pleased with her, during the treaty of Hudaibeya which is explained later in the section (Examples of How the Islamic society treated women)From the above discussion we can easily conclude that Islam regards woman as equal to man, the fact that she has less responsibilities as God’s vicegerent on earth does not underestimate her capabilities but rather empathizes her nature as more passionate than man which is a necessity for the continuity of life on earth.

Taken from: https://www.quora.com/Does-islam-say-women-are-less-intelligent

(edited 8 years ago)

Reply 94

lulucoco98

Original post by *Stefan*

The voice of reason ❤️

Reply 95

champ_mc99

Original post by SuperStar#7

The Islamic Jesus apparently, never called himself the son of God.

Never had people worship or invoke him (Muslims claim his followers were muslim)

Is there a link you can provide showing this as historical evidence?

Original post by SuperStar#7

Never got crucified, Never resurrected, amongst many other differences.
That Jesus, has never been recorded to be real by any historian ever.
That Jesus can only be found in the Qur'an.

I don't think you fully understand the story of Jesus in the Qur'an. Muslims believe that Jesus rose and was replaced by a man who wanted to kill him. This guy was the one who was crucified. Anyways can you provide links for that too.

Reply 96

SuperStar#7

Original post by *Stefan*

LOL. Your ignorance and vitriol is quite outstanding.

The Bible is filled with prophets. The prophets prophesied the coming of Jesus, his trials, his death and his resurrection in the old testament.

The prophecy gets fufillied and gets recorded by followers of Christ, supported by manuscripts, and now you're saying all this is false because some roman historian, (LOL at him being Roman, there certainly isn't any agenda there) who wrote his nonsense years after his death said it isn't true?

I feel that you should do some actual research on Biblical theology and history because you sound really misinformed here my friend.

Reply 97

BrokenLife

Original post by Al-farhan

Asking you if you have read up further on a topic other than spouting shallow regurgitated material is a basic question one can ask.
If anyone is being defensive here it is you I'm afraid.

'bothered'...talked about tone. There's a way to ask as well without sounding rude and defensive. As if all have to agree with their views. Well, you know what? We are individual beings with different thoughts so calm it and accept that not everyone is going to share same views as you.

I've seen her posts on other threads too which reflect her defensive and narrow minded attitude towards criticism of Islam. that imo is ridiculous.

Reply 98

SuperStar#7

Original post by champ_mc99

Is there a link you can provide showing this as historical evidence?

I don't think you fully understand the story of Jesus in the Qur'an. Muslims believe that Jesus rose and was replaced by a man who wanted to kill him. This guy was the one who was crucified. Anyways can you provide links for that too.

Muslims believe that Allah replaced Jesus with some imposter who looks exactly like him, and Jesus ascended into heaven and will return and denounce false religions.

That's what I meant by he wasn't crucified and never resurrected, because Jesus in the Qur'an never died.

Reply 99

Squishy•

Original post by Bazzel

Islamic women will say 'we are equal, we're just different', its sad but thats indoctrination for you.

Original post by SuperStar#7

Original post by BrokenLife

I'm a Muslim female and I've drifted away from Islam mainly due to Islamic and cultural sexist ideas. The ideas of inheritence and a few others do not make any sense to me and are rather ridiculous.

You guys are really missing out on knowledge if you are being too ignorant to watch this video. Literally I could argue with you but what is the point when a person of more knowledge has a whole video about it and you are too ignorant to watch it?

Brokenlife, Men have to provide all their money for their family whilst a woman can keep her money for herself as it's not her duty. With men inheriting 2:1 ratio of girls that is due to the fact women can keep their money for them self however men have to split and share it among their family as they have to provide for them.