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Original post by ForcePotential
Who is voting to leave the EU and why?
Me, my main reasons:
- Regain complete sovereignty.
- Regain control of borders.
- Build up stronger relationships with growth regions of the world which seems to be almost impossible or very lengthy while we are part of the EU.
- Save money and decide ourselves where the £350 million a week would go.
- Get out of a corrupt, unelected, unaccountable and unreformable German dominated club.
- I'm more optimistic about Britain than I am the EU.
In. Let's not take a step into the dark and cross our fingers.
Original post by Bornblue
In. Let's not take a step into the dark and cross our fingers.
So you are scared, don't take risks and don't like change. Well if we had that attitude we would still be cavemen scared of fire.
Original post by Sebastian Bartlett
Me, my main reasons:
- Regain complete sovereignty.
- Regain control of borders.
- Build up stronger relationships with growth regions of the world which seems to be almost impossible or very lengthy while we are part of the EU.
- Save money and decide ourselves where the £350 million a week would go.
- Get out of a corrupt, unelected, unaccountable and unreformable German dominated club.
- I'm more optimistic about Britain than I am the EU.
- Regain complete sovereignty.
- Regain control of borders.
- Build up stronger relationships with growth regions of the world which seems to be almost impossible or very lengthy while we are part of the EU.
- Save money and decide ourselves where the £350 million a week would go.
- Get out of a corrupt, unelected, unaccountable and unreformable German dominated club.
- I'm more optimistic about Britain than I am the EU.
Ok so, here reality.
£350 million a week? Nahhh.. what if its not a free trade deal? Also, some of that actually comes BACK to UK into other projects so all that would happen is we'll control where it goes to, as it already goes to farmers, space programmes etc.. More like £130 million, who said we'll grow in the future anyway if we left? Unemployement is rising and slower growth as well as lower pound value, take a hint.
" Back control with boarders " is a classic one, if we join EEA we need to accept free movement of people.
Why would growing nations give a crap about 60 million people who are most likely to decline from 5th richest nation? We'll be irrelevent, we're currently used as a EU gateway for China/USA...
There no Germany dominant, its fair and equal. To be fair, they DID make it and we rejected to join at start, one day we will be the dominant as we will within the next century become EU powerhouse. They are also, NOT corrupt and democracy isn't always the best.
Original post by Sebastian Bartlett
Me, my main reasons:
- Regain complete sovereignty.
- Regain control of borders.
- Build up stronger relationships with growth regions of the world which seems to be almost impossible or very lengthy while we are part of the EU.
- Save money and decide ourselves where the £350 million a week would go.
- Get out of a corrupt, unelected, unaccountable and unreformable German dominated club.
- I'm more optimistic about Britain than I am the EU.
- Regain complete sovereignty.
- Regain control of borders.
- Build up stronger relationships with growth regions of the world which seems to be almost impossible or very lengthy while we are part of the EU.
- Save money and decide ourselves where the £350 million a week would go.
- Get out of a corrupt, unelected, unaccountable and unreformable German dominated club.
- I'm more optimistic about Britain than I am the EU.
I support most of these arguments.
My feeling that the IN campaigners will be very happy at the outcome
Original post by ckfeister
Ok so, here reality.
£350 million a week? Nahhh.. what if its not a free trade deal? Also, some of that actually comes BACK to UK into other projects so all that would happen is we'll control where it goes to, as it already goes to farmers, space programmes etc.. More like £130 million, who said we'll grow in the future anyway if we left? Unemployement is rising and slower growth as well as lower pound value, take a hint.
" Back control with boarders " is a classic one, if we join EEA we need to accept free movement of people.
Why would growing nations give a crap about 60 million people who are most likely to decline from 5th richest nation? We'll be irrelevent, we're currently used as a EU gateway for China/USA...
There no Germany dominant, its fair and equal. To be fair, they DID make it and we rejected to join at start, one day we will be the dominant as we will within the next century become EU powerhouse. They are also, NOT corrupt and democracy isn't always the best.
£350 million a week? Nahhh.. what if its not a free trade deal? Also, some of that actually comes BACK to UK into other projects so all that would happen is we'll control where it goes to, as it already goes to farmers, space programmes etc.. More like £130 million, who said we'll grow in the future anyway if we left? Unemployement is rising and slower growth as well as lower pound value, take a hint.
" Back control with boarders " is a classic one, if we join EEA we need to accept free movement of people.
Why would growing nations give a crap about 60 million people who are most likely to decline from 5th richest nation? We'll be irrelevent, we're currently used as a EU gateway for China/USA...
There no Germany dominant, its fair and equal. To be fair, they DID make it and we rejected to join at start, one day we will be the dominant as we will within the next century become EU powerhouse. They are also, NOT corrupt and democracy isn't always the best.
Your delusion, ignorance and short-termist attitude is clear.
We are a net contributor fact so we would save by leaving. Why wouldn't growth continue? Negative are we? No surprise there. If you take one figure in unemployment data and base your entire argument on it well then you have no argument. Also you realise cheaper pound tends to lead to stronger exports (basic economics but wouldn't expect you to know that). Fastest growing large EU economy, unemployment rate way below average, higher average salary than a large number of EU nations, we don't want it be held back by a declining or poorer Europe.
Why do we have to except that condition? Also spell borders right. We could have FTA and not have complete open borders.
We are the 5th richest nation and likely to stay that way for decades while the rest of Europe declines (check out almost all predictions). If the 5th richest nation in the world with 65 million people btw can't survive outside the EU lord knows how all these other countries do it. Argument is so invalid and anti Britain, pure drivel from a fear-mongering, economically illiterate remainer.
Your last point isn't even an argument used by the remain camp because they admit Europe is broken, they agree it needs considerable reform especially in regards to accountability and national sovereignty. The last point I can't even believe you said that, think you need to go an join isis or move to China. You are clearly anti everything British, likely a troll and probably employed by the corrupt EU. Seriously lost the entire argument with that last statement alone. Keep sprouting you're drivel cause it will only convince more to vote Leave.
Original post by Sebastian Bartlett
Your delusion, ignorance and short-termist attitude is clear.
We are a net contributor fact so we would save by leaving. Why wouldn't growth continue? Negative are we? No surprise there. If you take one figure in unemployment data and base your entire argument on it well then you have no argument. Also you realise cheaper pound tends to lead to stronger exports (basic economics but wouldn't expect you to know that). Fastest growing large EU economy, unemployment rate way below average, higher average salary than a large number of EU nations, we don't want it be held back by a declining or poorer Europe.
Why do we have to except that condition? Also spell borders right. We could have FTA and not have complete open borders.
We are the 5th richest nation and likely to stay that way for decades while the rest of Europe declines (check out almost all predictions). If the 5th richest nation in the world with 65 million people btw can't survive outside the EU lord knows how all these other countries do it. Argument is so invalid and anti Britain, pure drivel from a fear-mongering, economically illiterate remainer.
Your last point isn't even an argument used by the remain camp because they admit Europe is broken, they agree it needs considerable reform especially in regards to accountability and national sovereignty. The last point I can't even believe you said that, think you need to go an join isis or move to China. You are clearly anti everything British, likely a troll and probably employed by the corrupt EU. Seriously lost the entire argument with that last statement alone. Keep sprouting you're drivel cause it will only convince more to vote Leave.
We are a net contributor fact so we would save by leaving. Why wouldn't growth continue? Negative are we? No surprise there. If you take one figure in unemployment data and base your entire argument on it well then you have no argument. Also you realise cheaper pound tends to lead to stronger exports (basic economics but wouldn't expect you to know that). Fastest growing large EU economy, unemployment rate way below average, higher average salary than a large number of EU nations, we don't want it be held back by a declining or poorer Europe.
Why do we have to except that condition? Also spell borders right. We could have FTA and not have complete open borders.
We are the 5th richest nation and likely to stay that way for decades while the rest of Europe declines (check out almost all predictions). If the 5th richest nation in the world with 65 million people btw can't survive outside the EU lord knows how all these other countries do it. Argument is so invalid and anti Britain, pure drivel from a fear-mongering, economically illiterate remainer.
Your last point isn't even an argument used by the remain camp because they admit Europe is broken, they agree it needs considerable reform especially in regards to accountability and national sovereignty. The last point I can't even believe you said that, think you need to go an join isis or move to China. You are clearly anti everything British, likely a troll and probably employed by the corrupt EU. Seriously lost the entire argument with that last statement alone. Keep sprouting you're drivel cause it will only convince more to vote Leave.
Ok I'll go through all of that, just to say your purely wrong.
Short-termist; world is very uncertain right now, we just gone through the deepest recession in a long time and just starting to get out of it, now another one would permeantly affect Britain with a lost generation.
Ignorant? In what way? That we're more wealthier if we give some powers to Europe? Whats so wrong about that? Why does it matter about immigration? The reason why even here is because labour market is stronger, they'll go back when eurozone is fixed you'll see.
I'm also not delusion, you tell me why every single union, IMF, China, USA all want UK in EU, hm? All evidence also show that Britain will be permeantly will be worse off, we will stay in anyway just watch.
We will grow about 0.9% in short term, then higher in long term I know... however we would lose a lot of infulence and could drop us as a world power as we know today, we would also be almost irrelevent to invest into.
Cheaper pound = lower living standards and yes, more exports however worse off at home... we are CURRENTLY the fastest growing, if we leave EU thats -50% of our trade, now the trade deals with Canada, China is EU so make that -70%... we only take 10% of EU so why should they care if we leave? 10% or 70%, which one is more?
Oh you not that smart are you.. world is balancing and UK leads EU into economic changing as we already have, we are in decline ourselves as the world is rebalancing back to its original state. Quit living in the past.
Original post by Sebastian Bartlett
Me, my main reasons:
- Regain complete sovereignty.
- Regain control of borders.
- Build up stronger relationships with growth regions of the world which seems to be almost impossible or very lengthy while we are part of the EU.
- Save money and decide ourselves where the £350 million a week would go.
- Get out of a corrupt, unelected, unaccountable and unreformable German dominated club.
- I'm more optimistic about Britain than I am the EU.
- Regain complete sovereignty.
- Regain control of borders.
- Build up stronger relationships with growth regions of the world which seems to be almost impossible or very lengthy while we are part of the EU.
- Save money and decide ourselves where the £350 million a week would go.
- Get out of a corrupt, unelected, unaccountable and unreformable German dominated club.
- I'm more optimistic about Britain than I am the EU.
This.
If the European Union is viewed as a single country it has the strongest economy in the world according to the International Momentary Fund .
We could unite to a single country with each previous country as a state and become the most powerful country in the world.
But NO, every single european country is SO special and different from the others. We see other Europeans as foreigners and so terribly different.
The tactic Romans used to concur Ancient Greece was dividing Greece into many small countries (by convincing greeks that they were different from each other)
We could unite to a single country with each previous country as a state and become the most powerful country in the world.
But NO, every single european country is SO special and different from the others. We see other Europeans as foreigners and so terribly different.
The tactic Romans used to concur Ancient Greece was dividing Greece into many small countries (by convincing greeks that they were different from each other)
(edited 4 years ago)
Original post by Vesniep
If the European Union is viewed as a single country it has the strongest economy in the world according to the International Momentary Fund .
We could unite to a single country with each previous country as a state and become the most powerful country in the world.
But NO, every single european country is SO special and different from the others. We see other Europeans as foreigners and so terribly different.
The tactic Romans used to concur Ancient Greece was dividing Greece into many small countries (by convincing greeks that they were different from each other)
Without Britain the EU won't last long , top economists predict.
All thanks to the national pride most europeans have for their countries.
We could unite to a single country with each previous country as a state and become the most powerful country in the world.
But NO, every single european country is SO special and different from the others. We see other Europeans as foreigners and so terribly different.
The tactic Romans used to concur Ancient Greece was dividing Greece into many small countries (by convincing greeks that they were different from each other)
Without Britain the EU won't last long , top economists predict.
All thanks to the national pride most europeans have for their countries.
ahahahahah spot it!
Original post by Bornblue
In. Let's not take a step into the dark and cross our fingers.
By that logic you shouldn't be voting at all as there is no option to freeze everything as it is now. I'll ask you again, what will the EU look like in even just 5 years?
Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by ckfeister
ahahahahah spot it!
Is that ironic? Did I say something funny?
But oh see that happy face in the end it makes me feel good
.
.
.
.
Seriously now I don't know if I said anything extreme , so please let me find out.
Original post by Vesniep
But NO, every single european country is SO special and different from the others. We see other Europeans as foreigners and so terribly different.
Exactly, and people will always think that way. People will always think differently from you and you appear to consider them idiots because they don't agree with you.
Fact: Every single European country is unique and different.
You say 'WE see other Europeans' as though everyone thinks the same as you; they don't.
Some people agree with you, see themselves as Europeans. But other people do not.
Fact: Europeans are foreigners speaking in terms of nationality.
Fact: "Foreigners" are different.
Stop mocking people for thinking differently to you; I suggest you look up the definitions of 'bigot' and 'democracy'.
Original post by similarBlank
Exactly, and people will always think that way. People will always think differently from you and you appear to consider them idiots because they don't agree with you.
Fact: Every single European country is unique and different.
You say 'WE see other Europeans' as though everyone thinks the same as you; they don't.
Some people agree with you, see themselves as Europeans. But other people do not.
Fact: Europeans are foreigners speaking in terms of nationality.
Fact: "Foreigners" are different.
Stop mocking people for thinking differently to you; I suggest you look up the definitions of 'bigot' and 'democracy'.
Fact: Every single European country is unique and different.
You say 'WE see other Europeans' as though everyone thinks the same as you; they don't.
Some people agree with you, see themselves as Europeans. But other people do not.
Fact: Europeans are foreigners speaking in terms of nationality.
Fact: "Foreigners" are different.
Stop mocking people for thinking differently to you; I suggest you look up the definitions of 'bigot' and 'democracy'.
Idiots ??? Really , did I say that? We are different and unique but not that different in my opinion... my opinion ok?
Mocking people ? When really? Yes many people have a different attitude which I don't like that doesn't mean I hate them or anything like that. So you do accuse me for being a bigot because I'd like a united europe with less national pride.That's all I'm saying.
It's like you hate that my opinion is different than yours .
But let's please stop it here.It's leading nowhere/
You know you can always report my previous comment
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by Vesniep
Idiots ??? Really , did I say that? We are different and unique but not that different in my opinion... my opinion ok?
Mocking people ? When really? Yes many people have a different attitude which I don't like that doesn't mean I hate them or anything like that. So you do accuse me for being a bigot because I'd like a united europe with less national pride.That's all I'm saying.
It's like you hate that my opinion is different than yours .
But let's please stop it here.It's leading nowhere/
You know you can always report my previous comment
Mocking people ? When really? Yes many people have a different attitude which I don't like that doesn't mean I hate them or anything like that. So you do accuse me for being a bigot because I'd like a united europe with less national pride.That's all I'm saying.
It's like you hate that my opinion is different than yours .
But let's please stop it here.It's leading nowhere/
You know you can always report my previous comment
Sorry, I guess I've never seen sarcasm being used in an unmocking way before.
Mocking someone, suggested by your sarcasm, suggests you think they are idiots in my opinion. Doing that and then claiming you didn't mean it like that seems to be kind of like Passive aggresivism.
Oh, and the good ol' trying to accuse me of the same thing I accused you of? I didn't make a single inclination that I "hate", your word not mine, in my post and remained very neutral, but because it pointed out flaws in the way you made your post you're suddenly accusing me of being, according to the definition, a bigot.
P.S. Did you like my sarcasm in the first line? Did you feel like it was mocking you? That's because that's practically the purpose of sarcasm, which I needed to show on that example.
Look. The fact is that voting out takes away thousands of jobs from hard-working British people. Is that really fair? Of course the EU Isn't perfect. But it's what we have! And we should be grateful for it. Yes the capital shouldn't be Brussels and the EU parliament needs to be reformed but these little things don't affect the big idea of the point of the EU. The EU is the biggest player on the global trade scene and the amount the UK pays to stay in the EU is nothing if you look at the amount we generate each year.
I'm afraid that if we leave, there will be a long gap (years) of figuring out how we would survive alone. New Treaties, new laws, countless arguments and the ultimate division of the UK public. It would never end.
A lot of us here are students. I'm 16 and about to go into my first year of A-levels. If anyone (like myself) is planning to go to University and the work in the UK, we could be caught up in this mess of a time if the UK votes out.
These are just a few reasons why its safer to stay in.
For those concerned about borders, many countries look at us as WEAK and selfish for not taking in more refugees than we have. Look at the countries surrounding us taking in hundreds of thousands.
We still have a 'special' place in the EU. We get the trade, enviormental, business positives while not being part of the EU's most ambitious projects. The Eurozone and the Schengen border-free travel area. We have also made sure hat we don't have to join the EU's next big project 'an ever-closer union.
Sorry for the rant here but for those saying we can establish better and more foreign-relations if we exit, that really is bs. Our greatest ally (The US) could not longer become our very important friends and although they have a joke running for president, the US is still one of the most powerful and important (if not the most) country in the world. Losing their support would be extremely damaging.
Stay in so that we don't have to go through this turmoil and run the risk of damaging our reputation even more.
Rant over! (Sorry for any spelling mistakes, did not proof read)
I'm afraid that if we leave, there will be a long gap (years) of figuring out how we would survive alone. New Treaties, new laws, countless arguments and the ultimate division of the UK public. It would never end.
A lot of us here are students. I'm 16 and about to go into my first year of A-levels. If anyone (like myself) is planning to go to University and the work in the UK, we could be caught up in this mess of a time if the UK votes out.
These are just a few reasons why its safer to stay in.
For those concerned about borders, many countries look at us as WEAK and selfish for not taking in more refugees than we have. Look at the countries surrounding us taking in hundreds of thousands.
We still have a 'special' place in the EU. We get the trade, enviormental, business positives while not being part of the EU's most ambitious projects. The Eurozone and the Schengen border-free travel area. We have also made sure hat we don't have to join the EU's next big project 'an ever-closer union.
Sorry for the rant here but for those saying we can establish better and more foreign-relations if we exit, that really is bs. Our greatest ally (The US) could not longer become our very important friends and although they have a joke running for president, the US is still one of the most powerful and important (if not the most) country in the world. Losing their support would be extremely damaging.
Stay in so that we don't have to go through this turmoil and run the risk of damaging our reputation even more.
Rant over! (Sorry for any spelling mistakes, did not proof read)
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by Sebastian Bartlett
Also you realise cheaper pound tends to lead to stronger exports (basic economics but wouldn't expect you to know that).
Actually basic economics tells us that because we are a net importer that having a weak pound will have a negative impact on the UK.
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