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Why is crime so prevalent among black people in UK?

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Original post by NickLCFC
It really isn't 'obvious' when you don't provide evidence to back up your claim.


It is obvious, it wos boring enough studying it. You also need to be careful about using stats, especially criminal ones becayse they are fraught with traps for the unwary.

As you seem interested in race issues from your threads, then here are two reports you can read on the subject matter if you have an interst in learning about the subject. If he reports are too much for you, then just skip to the conclusion and you can see the complex lin of several factors, poverty being a major one.

The first is

House of Commons Home Affairs Committee Young Black People and the CriminalJustice SystemSecond Report of Session 2006–07

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200607/cmselect/cmhaff/181/181i.pdf

The other is a poverty and crime review

WebsterC and Kingston S, 2014,Poverty and Crime Review, Centre for Applied Social Research (CeASR)Leeds Metropolitan University May Joseph Rowntree Foundation
http://eprints.lancs.ac.uk/71188/1/JRF_Final_Poverty_and_Crime_Review_May_2014.pdf
Original post by ElizaLemon
The reason why black youths are more likely to be found guilty of crimes is because the police stereotype and look for crimes in areas where there is a higher proportion of black people. I don't need evidence for this cause as you've already stated black peoples are more likely to be stopped and searched.


To justify this, both the UK police AND the UK justice system itself would have to be racist/discriminatory. You don't really have any evidence to prove that and as stated in the original post: white people and chinese people are most likely to be convicted in court. That kind of goes against the theory that the justice system itself is racist.
What I was trying to say is that everyone from every race commit crimes but the reason why there are more black people in prison is because they are stereotyped by the police and focused upon when the police go on patrols and look for crime.
Original post by the bear
the astonishing thing is how well behaved the Chinese community are. they work hard, do not cause trouble and keep themselves to themselves.


That depends on the country. In some countries, the perception towards the Chinese minority is not unlike the view some in the West have towards Jews. Look at the history of Indonesia for example and you will find many uprisings and pogroms against the Chinese, especially so in 1965 and 1998. Also, I think it is worth mentioning that in some countries, the Chinese are associated with criminal elements such as the Chinese triads, prostitution, selling illegal goods etc... So I don't think we can say one ethnic groups is perfect and another isn't.

This is not me saying Chinese people are bad, but rather I'm just trying to emphasise that perceptions sometimes vary and are to some extent subject to bias.
Original post by NickLCFC
To justify this, both the UK police AND the UK justice system itself would have to be racist/discriminatory. You don't really have any evidence to prove that and as stated in the original post: white people and chinese people are most likely to be convicted in court. That kind of goes against the theory that the justice system itself is racist.


Where is your evidence that white and Chinese people are more likely to be convicted in court. You ask everyone to prove themselves but I don't see your proof.
Original post by 999tigger
It is obvious, it wos boring enough studying it. You also need to be careful about using stats, especially criminal ones becayse they are fraught with traps for the unwary.


The statistics provided are official government figures. There are definitely not any 'traps'.
Original post by ElizaLemon
Where is your evidence that white and Chinese people are more likely to be convicted in court. You ask everyone to prove themselves but I don't see your proof.


It's literally in my original post.
Original post by NickLCFC
The statistics provided are official government figures. There are definitely not any 'traps'.


Again you miss the point. If you did stats or studied crime figures then youd realise that using raw crime figures is quite complex and subject to pitfalls. Ive provided you with the research you asked for that looks at the links bewteeen crime rates and poverty in the black community.

Actually analysing the data and looking at causal factors will give you the understanding and appreciation to speak from a position of knowledge, which I presume what you want? Its up to you.
Original post by The Epicurean
That depends on the country. In some countries, the perception towards the Chinese minority is not unlike the view some in the West have towards Jews.

Which is that they're too successful and therefore dangerous, not that they are a criminal underclass. Not all negative stereotypes are the same.
Original post by ElizaLemon
However there are black mothers who can't afford to pay tax and who are labelled criminals for failing to do so. How is her not paying a few hundreds of pounds of tax compatible to David Cameron and his liked millions of tax avoidance.

What? If they cannot afford to pay tax then they will likely not have to do so, see: "personal allowance".
Original post by Observatory
Which is that they're too successful and therefore dangerous, not that they are a criminal underclass. Not all negative stereotypes are the same.


I notice you skipped the other part of my post. Nice bit of editing there. The rest of my post said:

"Also, I think it is worth mentioning that in some countries, the Chinese are associated with criminal elements such as the Chinese triads, prostitution, selling illegal goods etc... So I don't think we can say one ethnic groups is perfect and another isn't."
Original post by Years & Months
What? If they cannot afford to pay tax then they will likely not have to do so, see: "personal allowance".


That's not the point. the point is that certain acts are seen as criminal while others are not. Everyone in every race commits crimes but if you so of you target a particular race based on stereotypes then don't be surprised when you find what your looking for.
Original post by 999tigger


House of Commons Home Affairs Committee Young Black People and the CriminalJustice SystemSecond Report of Session 2006–07

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200607/cmselect/cmhaff/181/181i.pdf


Pretty interesting. I read through some of the causes of overrepresentation:

"1) Social exclusion, education underachievement and school exclusion
2) Lack of father involvement
3) A culture among young black people fuelled by the media and popular culture
4) More likely to come to the attention of police due to their higher risk of things like: social exclusion, living in rented accommodation and being homeless
5) More likely to come to the attention of police due to the TYPE of crimes that are more prevalent among black people
6) The relationship between black communities and the police"

It still begs the question: why do some of these causes exist?
Why is social exclusion, educational underachievement and school exclusion more prevalent among black people?
Why is lack of father involvement more common in black families?
Can it all be put down to a 'black culture'?
(edited 8 years ago)
From what i know the system is a lot more racist against black people .
There was a study a couple of years ago which stated that when a white person and a black person committed the same crime the judge would more likely send the black person to jail and let the white male go free
Original post by NickLCFC
To justify this, both the UK police AND the UK justice system itself would have to be racist/discriminatory. You don't really have any evidence to prove that and as stated in the original post: white people and chinese people are most likely to be convicted in court. That kind of goes against the theory that the justice system itself is racist.


It could be a regressive trend. So if you are willing to agree that there may have been racism present within the system in the past, then black people would have historically been more likely to have been stopped/searched and arrested. This could have left many black children growing up possibly without a father, in a culture that has a negative attitude to the system which discriminated against them alongside other factors such as poverty and lack of educational opportunities, all of which can have a negative effect.

If people don't have respect for a system that may have been racist in the past, then could that not have some effect on the present?
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by NickLCFC
The statistics provided are official government figures. There are definitely not any 'traps'.


Btw just because they are official givernment figures, that doesnt mean to say you shouldnt treat them with caution and understand the quirks in the data on how its collected and its integrity maintained.
Original post by 999tigger

WebsterC and Kingston S, 2014,Poverty and Crime Review, Centre for Applied Social Research (CeASR)Leeds Metropolitan University May Joseph Rowntree Foundation
http://eprints.lancs.ac.uk/71188/1/JRF_Final_Poverty_and_Crime_Review_May_2014.pdf


This one is just about the impact of poverty on crime. As stated in my original post, 'poverty' (people from low-income households) is also very common among British 'Asians'. Why doesn't it have such a big impact on their crime rates?
And cue the racism....
Original post by 999tigger
Btw just because they are official givernment figures, that doesnt mean to say you shouldnt treat them with caution and understand the quirks in the data on how its collected and its integrity maintained.


I have confidence that the Ministry of Justice would provide accurate statistics on their prison population. Why would they lie or have any kind of agenda? Pretty ridiculous suggestion.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by muslimstanisyed
From what i know the system is a lot more racist against black people .
There was a study a couple of years ago which stated that when a white person and a black person committed the same crime the judge would more likely send the black person to jail and let the white male go free


It would be useful if you could actually post that study...
(edited 8 years ago)

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