University tuition fees set to rise again

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username1204031

Just because I "worked hard" is exactly the reason I'll have a high paid job unless I suddenly become stupid or suddenly stop working hard. If I only ended up with a decent job I'd be dissapointed, maybe where we're different is how high we each aim.

Just because you aim for a high paid job and would be disappointed with less doesn't mean you're going to get one. Do you honestly, genuinely believe that everyone working a **** job is there because they didn't work hard enough? Even the very top universities have graduates coming out unemployment. Do you honestly believe they're all just lazy? You're lying to yourself. There aren't enough jobs in the country for everyone, there will ALWAYS be a certain amount of unemployed people, and there are far more factors than just hard work that determine who those people are.

Unless you're doing computer science, there's a reasonable chance that when you finish uni there'll be no demand for your particular skills, and all the jobs are being filled by people who worked EVEN HARDER than you, or people living closer to those jobs, or people with connections in those fields.

You're a dreamer. I've worked hard all my life but I'm not pretending to myself that I'm guaranteed a good job. I aim high too, the only difference is I realize there are factors outside my control that might stop me getting to where I aim. Like I said, you'll probably come to realize this after graduating.

Reply 201

Doones

Original post by JordanL_

Unless you're doing computer science, there's a reasonable chance that when you finish uni there'll be no demand for your particular skills, and all the jobs are being filled by people who worked EVEN HARDER than you, or people living closer to those jobs, or people with connections in those fields.

The clue is in his user name.

Posted from TSR Mobile

Reply 202

Duke Glacia

Have pitty for us international students guys, im on the verge of deferring my entry fml

Reply 203

username1204031

Original post by jneill

The clue is in his user name.

Posted from TSR Mobile

He could be doing maths. But yeah, I meant to say but forgot - even doing computer science you're not guaranteed a job. I can't remember exactly but I think compsci has one of the highest graduate unemployment rates?

Reply 204

Betelgeuse-

Original post by Jammy Duel

Well for it to be a lifetime of debt they need to die before 51 (normally), i.e. before the loan is written off, and it's hardly insecure on the part of the student.

I see

Reply 205

username521617

More young people complaining about still paying practically nothing for their useless sociology and media studies degrees until they're actually earning a decent salary?

At least England isn't like the rest of Europe, where the taxpayer gets the bill for your student life.

Reply 206

Clearing and Applications Advisor

Original post by JordanL_

So bad that the government has commissioned a review into the problem: http://www.hefce.ac.uk/kess/gradstemreview/csreview/

Reply 207

MrsSheldonCooper

I'm applying to uni in the Netherlands because I found the same course at a uni in Netherlands for about £1300 a year, when it would be 9k a year. Not turning that down.

Original post by Reue

Show me a situation where a student from 'poor' background is unable to go to university due to the cost of tuition fees?

Poor people will go to university as long as there's loans. But there are people who have dodged the debt.

http://www.theguardian.com/education/2012/feb/09/british-students-maastricht-university-lower-fees

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-34721679

(edited 7 years ago)

Reply 208

Doones

Original post by JordanL_

Yep. I think a lot of people do CompSci expecting a more vocational degree with Microsoft Certification etc and a guaranteed job at Ubisoft or something.

Reply 209

Josb

Original post by MrsSheldonCooper

I'm applying to uni in the Netherlands because of I found the same course at a uni in Netherlands for about £1300 a year, when it would be 9k a year. Not turning that down.

You speak Dutch?

Original post by MrsSheldonCooper

I don't have student debt. :biggrin:

My masters cost €400 (and some people here still find it's too much). :u:

Reply 210

username1539513

Original post by MrsSheldonCooper

I'm applying to uni in the Netherlands because of I found the same course at a uni in Netherlands for about £1300 a year, when it would be 9k a year. Not turning that down.

Poor people will go to university as long as there's loans. But there are people who have dodged the debt.

http://www.theguardian.com/education/2012/feb/09/british-students-maastricht-university-lower-fees

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-34721679

Oh sweet, what is it?

What a-levels and grades do they need?

Reply 211

MrsSheldonCooper

Original post by Josb

You speak Dutch?

I don't have student debt. :biggrin:

My masters cost €400 (and some people here still find it's too much). :u:

Only a bit of it. My course in the Netherlands is in English. I'm torn between which one to go for though because I've decided to go next year..

Where did you do your Masters??

Reply 212

Josb

Original post by jneill

Yep. I think a lot of people do CompSci expecting a more vocational degree with Microsoft Certification etc and a guaranteed job at Ubisoft or something.

Yep, many CompSci courses are quite theoretical and don't teach many programming languages, whilst this is what employers want. It's a shame that there aren't more vocational schools in the UK since Polytechnics have become "universities".

Reply 213

MrsSheldonCooper

It's English Language and Literature with a semester abroad in New Zealand
OR
European Studies.

Both of them say they want pass grades but I'm aiming for AAB

Reply 214

bob5124

Original post by lahorizon

I never said that there is a net loss. I said that your tax revenue as a result of your now higher income is likely to be very irrelevant in terms of its effect on the entire economy.

Original post by lahorizon

Sorry if I don't think studying communications at university is going to help society.

First of all, you wanted higher tuition fees for everyone, not just those studying communications. Second of all, even those studying communications receive an overall higher income on average compared to those who did not go to university, so they still pay off the cost of the degree through the higher tax they pay,

Original post by lahorizon

Anyways, the main issue here is WHY should the government pay? It is just like buying groceries. YOU benefit most from the investment.

The government gets its investment back multiple times over. Why shouldn't the government pay when its making money off the investment? You have failed to establish a case for increased fees.

Reply 215

Josb

Original post by MrsSheldonCooper

Only a bit of it. My course in the Netherlands is in English. I'm torn between which one to go for though because I've decided to go next year..

What's your uni? You take a gap year then?

Original post by MrsSheldonCooper

Where did you do your Masters??

In France. Don't go there. It's cheap for a reason.

Reply 216

lahorizon

Original post by bob5124

The government gets back its cash investment in you multiple times over, the government has made money, and the government has a more educated population as well, what is your complaint exactly? You have failed to establish a reason for the increased tuition fees, considering that the government makes money off of it to begin with through the higher taxes paid over the course of the student's life.

First of all, you wanted higher tuition fees for everyone, not just those studying communications. Second of all, even those studying communications receive an overall higher income on average compared to those who did not go to university, so they still pay off the cost of the degree through the higher tax they pay,

The government gets its investment back multiple times over. Why shouldn't the government pay when its making money off the investment? You have failed to establish a case for increased fees.

How about the government also pays for all new hair salons and grocery shops because they make money from it? Oh wait.. it doesn't work like that. Yes the government will benefit but why should tax money from people who decide to not go to university go towards those who do want it. The degree holder benefits first THEN the government and at the very end is the individual taxpayer. Not all degrees are useful and worth the government paying for. Besides where is all this money supposed to come from exactly?

Reply 217

Josb

Original post by MrsSheldonCooper

It's English Language and Literature with a semester abroad in New Zealand
OR
European Studies.

Both of them say they want pass grades but I'm aiming for AAB

That one?: https://www.maastrichtuniversity.nl/education/bachelor/bachelor-european-studies-0

I'd say take European Studies. It's multidisciplinary so you'll have more options at the end (history, law, business, politics, etc.) than literature (for which there are already too many graduates with limited prospects).

Reply 218

MrsSheldonCooper

Original post by Josb

Nope

Clear your inbox bebs

Reply 219

bob5124

Original post by lahorizon

How about the government also pays for all new hair salons and grocery shops because they make money from it? Oh wait.. it doesn't work like that.

The government shouldn't pay for an investment which it makes a profit off because of a strange strawman you have invented about hair salons and grocery shops? Form a coherent argument please.

Original post by lahorizon

Yes the government will benefit but why should tax money from people who decide to not go to university go towards those who do want it.

I've already explained to you multiple times now that the cost of the degree is paid off multiple times over by the graduate through the extra tax they pay due to their higher income. The money is completely paid off by the graduate, they are not "taking" money from other people.

Original post by lahorizon

The degree holder benefits first THEN the government and at the very end is the individual taxpayer.

Why should the government stop doing something that currently makes it money? The fact that the person who gets the degree benefits is not relevant, because there is no net loss by the government, but a net gain.

Original post by lahorizon

Not all degrees are useful and worth the government paying for. Besides where is all this money supposed to come from exactly?

That is a completely different debate, which is not worth debating while you continue to hold the stance that all graduates should pay more for their degree.