I'm an anti-feminist, AMA.
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Original post by UDZ
So would I need to be raped in order to say rape is bad?
You're immediately pulling out completely random analogies (which might I add is exactly what TAA does), which shows me you don't actually have anything of substance to offer. It doesn't take a genius to realise that your little "ooh burn" comment actually isn't relevant. Of course you can say rape is bad. However, you can't say how rape feels without having experienced it yourself.
Original post by UDZ
You don't need a study to show that paying a woman less than a man is illegal, it's illegal.
Because law has ALWAYS stopped companies from segregating.
Original post by UDZ
It is true that women as a whole make less than men as a whole, but that is a result of personal choices, not sexism.
You fail to address my point. Why do you think that women don't choose these jobs? Have you considered that it may be due to their "man's world" upbringing?
Original post by UDZ
Again, even if women are lacking power, how is this the result of sexism?
?????????? I'll let you re-read what you wrote here.
Original post by Dartychu
It does require experience in the world of functioning mature adults, and not the world of the red pill subreddit.
Oh, you know that it exists? Whoa, real facts and statistics, as opposed to imaginary ones!
I struggle to see how some people don't see the huge difference in treatment that women get. I honestly couldn't care less about debating the wage gap, because it comes down to which studies you believe. However, culturally, women are clearly lacking power and there are huge numbers of studies proving this (I'd encourage you to look at O'Barr and Atkins' work, just as a little taster lesson).
The only thing so-called meninists have is the whole thing about child custody, but apart from that it's just white middle-class men who think they are inherently better than women.
Oh, you know that it exists? Whoa, real facts and statistics, as opposed to imaginary ones!
I struggle to see how some people don't see the huge difference in treatment that women get. I honestly couldn't care less about debating the wage gap, because it comes down to which studies you believe. However, culturally, women are clearly lacking power and there are huge numbers of studies proving this (I'd encourage you to look at O'Barr and Atkins' work, just as a little taster lesson).
The only thing so-called meninists have is the whole thing about child custody, but apart from that it's just white middle-class men who think they are inherently better than women.
1) No, personal experiences are valid experiences but they should not be used to generate and extrapolate an overall trend or pattern of mistreatment - love the way you try to belittle those who see past the flaw in this logic as trp followers
2) You're not interested in debating it because it doesn't work in your favour - it has been debunked countless times and attempts to bolster its validity don't work - because it does not mean anything.
3) Here we go with the "lets shut down the discussion by inserting white man middle class misogynist" tactic. Nice generalisations. I like how you can't seem to keep debate civil and just resort to insulting parties with opposing views. Shows that your arguments lack substance.
Original post by Dartychu
You're immediately pulling out completely random analogies (which might I add is exactly what TAA does), which shows me you don't actually have anything of substance to offer. It doesn't take a genius to realise that your little "ooh burn" comment actually isn't relevant. Of course you can say rape is bad. However, you can't say how rape feels without having experienced it yourself.
Because law has ALWAYS stopped companies from segregating.
You fail to address my point. Why do you think that women don't choose these jobs? Have you considered that it may be due to their "man's world" upbringing?
?????????? I'll let you re-read what you wrote here.
Because law has ALWAYS stopped companies from segregating.
You fail to address my point. Why do you think that women don't choose these jobs? Have you considered that it may be due to their "man's world" upbringing?
?????????? I'll let you re-read what you wrote here.
Have you considered that it is a difference between the sexes not because of upbringing?
If it is upbringing that is at fault and women are the primary care givers surely then women are the cause of this
Cba to quote because so many people to reply to.
UDZ, what did I say that was sarcastic? I was being serious.
Toofocused, it was an insult to his maturity. I'm not interested in debating the wage gap because I don't have the time and I don't come on the chat forum to debate with people. Of course my arguments lack substance, the UDZ bears the burden of proof in this discussion and I already gave one study about it. The idea of women being biologically inclined to do certain jobs is ridiculous; for example I highly doubt evolution has anything to do with accountants.
Joe, by upbringing i was talking about growing up in our society. I used the wrong word.
Honestly I can't be bothered to reply to this thread anymore since I'm having to reply to 4 people at once and debates like this never actually change people's opinions anyway. Nonetheless I'm certain somebody will say something along the lines of "no, you're leaving because you don't want to face up to the fact that you're wrong", which would be pretty funny. Hopefully by addressing in in foresight I'll avoid it but oh well.
UDZ, what did I say that was sarcastic? I was being serious.
Toofocused, it was an insult to his maturity. I'm not interested in debating the wage gap because I don't have the time and I don't come on the chat forum to debate with people. Of course my arguments lack substance, the UDZ bears the burden of proof in this discussion and I already gave one study about it. The idea of women being biologically inclined to do certain jobs is ridiculous; for example I highly doubt evolution has anything to do with accountants.
Joe, by upbringing i was talking about growing up in our society. I used the wrong word.
Honestly I can't be bothered to reply to this thread anymore since I'm having to reply to 4 people at once and debates like this never actually change people's opinions anyway. Nonetheless I'm certain somebody will say something along the lines of "no, you're leaving because you don't want to face up to the fact that you're wrong", which would be pretty funny. Hopefully by addressing in in foresight I'll avoid it but oh well.
Original post by UDZ
No, it does not! They just added all the earnings of women, and compared them to all the earnings of men. How does that factor in hours worked, occupation etc? And if it isn't legal anymore, why do feminists keep spewing out this statistic?
Well that is true whether you like it or not. People who talk about the wage gap arent saying "oh yeah every employer just pays women less" we are looking at the way women are treated in society and how that affects their work life and their salary.
Original post by SophieBarlow87
Well that is true whether you like it or not. People who talk about the wage gap arent saying "oh yeah every employer just pays women less" we are looking at the way women are treated in society and how that affects their work life and their salary.
Actually what they say is women get paid less for the exact same work
Original post by UDZ
You are seriously a hypocrite. You say sexualisation is a problem, then say that image (of Lara Croft) which feminists say is sexualised, isn't a problem?
And I am not manipulating your language. You said:
So I asked if you were denying that masculinite traits and strength aren't deemed attractive by women, which is the goal of sexualisation.
EDIT: If you think I am 'manipulating' what you are saying, maybe you should be more clear in how you say things. Earlier when I showed you why I wasn't manipulating what you were saying, you just ignored it.
And I am not manipulating your language. You said:
So I asked if you were denying that masculinite traits and strength aren't deemed attractive by women, which is the goal of sexualisation.
EDIT: If you think I am 'manipulating' what you are saying, maybe you should be more clear in how you say things. Earlier when I showed you why I wasn't manipulating what you were saying, you just ignored it.
The photo of laura Croft is not that sexualised , in my opinion (as a feminist), how the second one is IMO however the main audience for computer games is predominatly male, also the game is of course creating a sense of realism, typically women do not become 'muscly' whereas if training a man will - consider the second image a 'hyperbolic' idea of realism within the genre. Of course the women would look good - but its a computer game it ISNT realistic.
I think there are also a lot of assumptions going on within the thread-
Women and men are biologically different in terms of sexual reproduction - therefore it is much easier for men to sustain a career in which they work everyday. If a woman gets pregnant then of course she has to leave work and look after a child. ONLY RECENTLY have the laws changed so men can now take paternity, which will have an influence on the desicions of some couples.
Furthmore a lot of people are talking about how women made the 'conscious' decision to go into lower paid jobs. I think that sexism within education here is ignored. There are many male dominated jobs within our society still - politics being an obvious one. However when looking down to more working class jobs the BETTER ones are often full with men - electritions, plumbers etc etc , this contrasts to the shittier paid jobs such as careers which are predominately done by men. So the pay gap is 'legitimized' through these means.
I dont think anyone should be 'anti-feminist' because its a continual development of an aspect within our society which has helped equality. Overall we will never have complete equality unless we completely re-shape our society and then change the values and norms of the next generation - educating them fairly in primary and secondary socialisation (which both affect the roles of women and men within our society). Without feminism we would most likely live in a crappier place then we already do.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by UDZ
This is quite a controversial topic, so I'd like to at least clear some confusion over what "anti-feminist" means, and why I am one.
What's your opinion on rape culture? Do you believe it exists?
Original post by student_2902
What's your opinion on rape culture? Do you believe it exists?
No, not at all. How is raping women congratulated by men, and legal?
Original post by Fraserulysses
The photo of laura Croft is not very sexualised , in my opinion (as a feminist), how the second one is IMO however the main audience for computer games is predominatly male, also the game is of course creating a sense of realism, typically women do not become 'muscly' whereas if training a man will - consider the second image a 'hyperbolic' idea of realism within the genre. Of course the women would look good - but its a computer game it ISNT realistic.
Exactly, it's isn't realistic. So then why do feminists complain about "unrealistic body images" and such?
Original post by TheTechN1304
And at 15 you think you know the first thing about gender inequality and feminism? What a load of ****. Ignorance at its finest.
Being 15 doesn't stop him having the ability to think
Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by UDZ
Exactly, it's isn't realistic. So then why do feminists complain about "unrealistic body images" and such?
I think it 'tongue-in-cheek', the definition of feminsts change from person to person as there are so many perspectives such as radical, liberal etc etc... But to say you are 'anti-feminist' is very naïve.
It's a two way thing for men in the way that it's also unrealistic for men - how many people do you see with a 6 pack etc etc, not many. Women are just for the focus for appearance... DUE TO TRADITIONAL VALUES.
Original post by UDZ
No, not at all. How is raping women congratulated by men, and legal?
I mean this is an example of being naive, you probably haven't been exposed to enough yet to understand that sexual assault is not reported often, its a 'grey area' within statistics. What some people might not considered rape may be by other people I.E. such as being intoxicated, it may not be nessercarily celebrated by men but you cannot ignore that there is a clear proportion of men who probably do.
Original post by UDZ
No, not at all. How is raping women congratulated by men, and legal?
It's not as explicit as 'congratulating' other men for raping women. It's the fact that a women can't go outside without being stared at inappropriately or being cat called, it's the fact that an astonishing number of rapists don't go to jail. It's the fact that thousands of women a day are sexually assaulted.
Original post by student_2902
It's not as explicit as 'congratulating' other men for raping women. It's the fact that a women can't go outside without being stared at inappropriately or being cat called, it's the fact that an astonishing number of rapists don't go to jail. It's the fact that thousands of women a day are sexually assaulted.
Are you saying catcalling is sexual assault? I'm not twisting your words, I just want to make sure I know what your saying. Also, that is false. Not only is it untrue that a woman can't go outside without being catcalled or stared at, it happens to men too.
Do you have a source to support your "fact" that an astonishing number of rapists don't go to jail?
Original post by Fraserulysses
What some people might not considered rape may be by other people I.E. such as being intoxicated, it may not be nessercarily celebrated by men but you cannot ignore that there is a clear proportion of men who probably do.
You're giving me "maybe"s and "probably"s, and no sources or actual points. It's not a matter of what is considered rape, the definition is pretty clear. Rape is having sex with someone against their will. How is having sex with someone drunk automatically against their will, and how come it's such a double standard? If a man is drunk and has sex, he's a rapist but if a woman is drunk and has sex, she's a victim (or should I say, "survivor" as the tumblr SJWs like to call them).
Original post by UDZ
Are you saying catcalling is sexual assault? I'm not twisting your words, I just want to make sure I know what your saying. Also, that is false. Not only is it untrue that a woman can't go outside without being catcalled or stared at, it happens to men too.
Do you have a source to support your "fact" that an astonishing number of rapists don't go to jail?
You're giving me "maybe"s and "probably"s, and no sources or actual points. It's not a matter of what is considered rape, the definition is pretty clear. Rape is having sex with someone against their will. How is having sex with someone drunk automatically against their will, and how come it's such a double standard? If a man is drunk and has sex, he's a rapist but if a woman is drunk and has sex, she's a victim (or should I say, "survivor" as the tumblr SJWs like to call them).
Do you have a source to support your "fact" that an astonishing number of rapists don't go to jail?
You're giving me "maybe"s and "probably"s, and no sources or actual points. It's not a matter of what is considered rape, the definition is pretty clear. Rape is having sex with someone against their will. How is having sex with someone drunk automatically against their will, and how come it's such a double standard? If a man is drunk and has sex, he's a rapist but if a woman is drunk and has sex, she's a victim (or should I say, "survivor" as the tumblr SJWs like to call them).
I said 'may' because I'm taking an interpretivist approach studying the meanings behind actions - you do not need statistics for everything bud -
Yes but rape also coincides with sexual harassment, sexual exploitation - do you understand that the sex trade is one of the biggest industries in the world right now - also how can you make statistics on grey area within crime such as prostitutes being raped?
Also you shouldnt mock, thats not nice.
Original post by UDZ
Are you saying catcalling is sexual assault? I'm not twisting your words, I just want to make sure I know what your saying. Also, that is false. Not only is it untrue that a woman can't go outside without being catcalled or stared at, it happens to men too.
Do you have a source to support your "fact" that an astonishing number of rapists don't go to jail?
You're giving me "maybe"s and "probably"s, and no sources or actual points. It's not a matter of what is considered rape, the definition is pretty clear. Rape is having sex with someone against their will. How is having sex with someone drunk automatically against their will, and how come it's such a double standard? If a man is drunk and has sex, he's a rapist but if a woman is drunk and has sex, she's a victim (or should I say, "survivor" as the tumblr SJWs like to call them).
Do you have a source to support your "fact" that an astonishing number of rapists don't go to jail?
You're giving me "maybe"s and "probably"s, and no sources or actual points. It's not a matter of what is considered rape, the definition is pretty clear. Rape is having sex with someone against their will. How is having sex with someone drunk automatically against their will, and how come it's such a double standard? If a man is drunk and has sex, he's a rapist but if a woman is drunk and has sex, she's a victim (or should I say, "survivor" as the tumblr SJWs like to call them).
No, I am not saying it is sexual assault. I am saying it is inappropriate sexual behaviour, it may happen to men too but not the same degree as women.
https://rainn.org/statistics
Original post by iEthan
shhh!! You're still hidden 
just… not as well hidden 
just… not as well hidden Spoiler
Oui et toi ? C'est vrai :/
Original post by joecphillips
Actually what they say is women get paid less for the exact same work
That's just a statistic, what it actually means is that men are more likely to get promotions, better hours, be employed by higher paying companies...
Original post by UDZ
This is quite a controversial topic, so I'd like to at least clear some confusion over what "anti-feminist" means, and why I am one.
Seeing as something like 16=17% identify as a feminist, what kept you from the dark side of gender segregation and sexism (otherwise known as modern day feminism)
P.S. Feminists, I'm waiting for the no true Scotsman fallacy, come on!
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