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Questions about shia-ism

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Ah yes the sickening apology for the butcher of Sham comes out.

I can understand why he hates Ahrah al Sham lol. They don't let his Irani / Iraqi / Lebnani friends leave Syria, except in a coffin.

Reply 121

Tawheed

Original post by AlifunArnab

I can understand why he hates Ahrah al Sham lol. They don't let his Irani / Iraqi / Lebnani friends leave Syria, except in a coffin.

Here we go, praising Ahrar Asham again, before you prayed for them, and now it's more indirect. And i did warn people. To those who don't get the link, ahrar asham and radical groups love chanting the 'don't let them leave except in a coffin line' usually in arabic on their terrorist video's.

I dislike Ahrar-asham for the following reasons, and primarily for the following reasons:

1.Ahrar Asham are probably considered one of the closest allies to jabhat al nusra, and have very, very strong links to Alqaeda.
2. "It routinely cooperates with al-Nusra and, until relations soured in 2013, also worked with ISIS. In February 2014, the U.S. Director of National Intelligence called Ahrar al-Sham one of the three most effective rebel groups in Syria."

Leadership: "Abu Khalid al-Suri, also known as Abu Omeir al-Shami (Unknown to February 23, 2014): Suri was a co-founder of Ahrar al-Sham and acted as Ayman al-Zawahiri’s representative in Syria,"

"Suri's close ties with Al Qaeda became clear after his death, when AQ commander Ayman al-Zawahiri published a eulogy for the fallen Ahrar al-Sham leader and AQ posted a video documenting his participation in Al Farouq training camp in Afghanistan, including photos of him with Osama bin Laden and Zawahir"

"Ahrar al-Sham was founded by members of Al Qaeda and maintains links to AQ’s core leadership. [42] While neither group formally claims a partnership, senior AQ officials, including Ayman al-Zawahiri, openly mourned Ahrar al-Sham leader Abu Khalid al-Suri when he died.

http://web.stanford.edu/group/mappin...roups/view/523

My source is standford university, NOT press TV. I have rarely ever used any iranian sources in this conflict.

So we have here, a group founded by members of Alqaeda, who had worked with ISIS, who cooperate with the official alqaeda affiliate, jabhat al nusra, who are ruthlessly secterian, and you, with all due respect, gloss over these very pertinent facts as to why i am primarily opposed to them.

This is what a lot of people on the I-Soc, neutrals, often don't get. We have in our midst people who support groups like this. It takes a lot in ones heart to put aside sunni or shia labels, tribal biases, and recognise this very important fact.

Since when did condemning an alqaeda founded, once-ISIS friend, current al nusra (alqaeda) cooperative, which is highly radical and secterian, make one a lover of Bashar Al Assad?

You also forget, a large contingent of the syrian arab army are comprised of sunni muslims, who have family all over syria, and who groups like ashrar asham slaughter. Not to mention civilians.

The difference between our view points is that you believe Al Nusra, ahrar asham, alqaeda and their affiliates, taking control of war planes, cities with many minorities, and also sunni's who will naturally oppose them, is a better prospect for syria. That's where you and i disagree.

(edited 7 years ago)

Reply 122

Tawheed

Original post by Ibn Fulaan

Ah yes the sickening apology for the butcher of Sham comes out.

I condemn Assad for all his crimes against humanity. There is no apology for the loss of any innocent life. I don't represent him, nor did i even care or know much about him before the conflict. If the syrian people under internationally observed elections vote him out, and elect their own leader, then this is something i absolutely support.

Reply 123

h333

@Tawheed are you from Iran? Just interested.

Reply 124

Tawheed

Original post by h333

@Tawheed are you from Iran? Just interested.

Nope, not from Iran. On my mothers side i have a long line of sunni ancestors. On my fathers side, shia ancestors.
And on my wife's side, both parents have a long line of sunni ancestors, meaning inshAllah if i am granted the chance to have kids, they will have more sunni's in their ancestral tree than shia's.

(edited 7 years ago)

Reply 125

username945663

Original post by TheContrarian

That would also cover Ahmadi Muslims too.

Nope.

Reply 126

h333

Original post by mil88

They are purified via the verse 33:33 I believe

I also assume you believe the Holy Prophet is sinless? Are you now saying that the Prophet isn't human?

Do you mean this?

“O wives of the Prophet! You are not like any other of the women; If you will be on your guard, then be not soft in your speech, lest he in whose heart is a disease yearn; and speak a good word. And stay quietly in your houses, and make not a dazzling display, like that of the former Times of Ignorance; and establish regular Prayer, and give regular Charity; and obey Allah and His Messenger. And Allah only wishes to remove all abomination from you, you Ahlel Bayt (People of the House), and to make you pure and spotless.And recite what is rehearsed to you in your homes, of the Signs of Allah and His Wisdom: for Allah understands the finest mysteries and is well-acquainted (with them).” (Quran, 33:32-34)

Reply 127

Tawheed

Original post by h333

Who do you believe Allah swt is referring to in this verse dear sister?

Reply 128

h333

Original post by Tawheed

Oh I see. And ameen. :smile:

Reply 129

Tawheed

Original post by IdeasForLife

InshAllah after my exams, i will reserve time to specifically reply to your last post, as well as this one.

Reply 130

h333

Original post by Tawheed

Who do you believe Allah swt is referring to in this verse dear sister?

I believe that Allah swt is addressing the Prophet’s wives as Ahlel Bayt.

Reply 131

Tawheed

Original post by h333

I believe that Allah swt is addressing the Prophet’s wives as Ahlel Bayt.

x

EDIT: I wrote an entire post for you sister, but it does not show up. I'll re-write it later inshAllah.

(edited 7 years ago)

Reply 132

Tawheed

Original post by IdeasForLife

Whilst you may mean well, if it's the usual copy and pastes, then please don't bother. They aren't very effective. I understand you write them yourself but the point still stands. I'm not trying to be rude but I think it's what a lot of people think when reading some of them.

I spend an enormous ammount of time writing replies to you. On the Isoc, to others on the issue, i also spent an enormous ammount of time writing posts.

Reply 133

h333

Original post by Tawheed

x

EDIT: I wrote an entire post for you sister, but it does not show up. I'll re-write it later inshAllah.

Aww bless you brother. No worries. :smile:

Reply 134

Tawheed

Original post by h333

Aww bless you brother. No worries. :smile:

JazakAllah,

Sister, do you believe the Ayah is clearly only referring to the wives of Rasullah s.a.w?

(edited 7 years ago)

Reply 135

username945663

Original post by Tawheed

I spend an enormous ammount of time writing replies to you. On the Isoc, to others on the issue, i also spent an enormous ammount of time writing posts.

If I understand correctly, you have pre written posts for most of the issues we discussed (mainly Syria related). You have a tendency to repeatedly use these posts and copy paste them into replies because you deem them to be effective. It honestly isn't a bad idea and it saves time, but more than once I've rejected something and then you've copy pasted me the same post in a later argument.

On ummah forum you used one of these too. "Who is ahrar Al sham" or "who is *insert Syrian rebel leader name*". Something like that.

^they are the ones I cba with because I have probably read them already.

Reply 136

Tawheed

Original post by IdeasForLife

Most of my posts are written freshly. Some are copy and pasted , mostly to quote other sources or to explain the same point to a different person, or, to reitterate point again.

We will go point by point, and limit each of our posts so we get to the specifics of the issue this time.

A big post, followed by a lengthy reply and vice versa really makes key points of the message lost.

(edited 7 years ago)

Reply 137

username2097061

Original post by IdeasForLife

There is no unity on major misguidance. To give a few examples on which types of people this includes: people who reject parts of Islam, people who claim to be new messengers and their followers, people who curse the companions openly or secretly or believe it's OK for others to do so...

I don't understand what you are trying to say with the stick paragraph etc.

I am careful. But you can't ignore cold blooded murderers when their actions are so open. There is nothing wrong with being openly against beliefs which include cursing companions. Of course if that isn't your belief then we should have no problem.

Whilst I do agree that it is difficult to have unity in these circumstances, I still have hope, same way I have hope that one day all evil will be eradicated.

How can someone believe in 'new messengers'. Do you mind clarifying what you mean by that phrase?

Reply 138

h333

Original post by Tawheed

JazakAllah,

Sister, do you believe the Ayah is clearly only referring to the wives of Rasullah s.a.w?

Wa iyyak.

Well in this particular verse, it is instructions in specific to the prophet's S.A.W wives and includes them as the ahlel bayt (household) ofcourse.

Reply 139

username2097061

Original post by h333

Wa iyyak.

Well in this particular verse, it is instructions in specific to the prophet's S.A.W wives and includes them as the ahlel bayt (household) ofcourse.

Often hadith kisa is used alongside this.

Narrated Aisha:

One day the Prophet (PBUH&HF) came out afternoon wearing a black cloak (upper garment or gown; long coat), then al-Hasan Ibn Ali came and the Prophet accommodated him under the cloak, then al-Husain came and entered the cloak, then Fatimah came and the Prophet entered her under the cloak, then Ali came and the Prophet entered him to the cloak as well. Then the Prophet recited: "Verily Allah intends to keep off from you every kind of uncleanness O' People of the House (Ahlul-Bayt), and purify you a perfect purification (the last sentence of Verse 33:33).

"Reference:

Sahih Muslim, Chapter of virtues of companions, section of the virtues of the Ahlul-Bayt of the Prophet (PBUH&HF), 1980 Edition Pub. in Saudi Arabia, Arabic version, v4, p1883, Tradition #61.

Also note how the masculine and feminine words change from previous aya (s) and this one, which uses ankum (masculine tense). I believe this is some of the arguments for the purity of ahlulbayt.

However, I disagree with the notion of them being infallible, as that often implies that they didn't have a choice/free will, which they did, so pure is better word, and after all, it's the word God used.