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Shooting in gay club in Florida

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Original post by The_Opinion
Regarding the caliphate, this may surprise you, but I am against British military involvement, simply because I think that it should be the job of neighbouring countries.


Then we really have very little in common.

I also have said on this forum, that seems as we are bombing anyway, we may as well bomb properly and start to bomb effectively, Russian style, rather than bombing a few trucks every now and then.


I'm sorry but this post merely tells us you know next to nothing about military tactics, and about the real facts on the ground. The Western coalition has killed around 30,000 ISIS members in airstrikes. That's because we have been consistent and steadfast in targeting and hitting targets every single day, and doing so with expensive guided munitions that almost never miss.

The Russians have killed, at most, 1,000 ISIS members with their bombardments. It also sounds like you're like many Trumpkins and their UK counterparts; you have all the weakness and batshit crazy of the hard left (and the apparent admiration of Vladimir Putin that the insane, hard left and right share) without any of their corresponding upside on economic policy.
Original post by ubiquitousking

TL;DR I don't blame the religion solely, but instead a mixture of many factors, each contributing to the murderer's acts.


It's true that Islam/religion isn't the sole factor or cause. But it is the indispensable one; it is the necessary condition. You don't find any Christian, Hindu, Jewish or atheist members of ISIS.

Islam is the vector through which the disease of ISIS spreads
Original post by ubiquitousking
Because ISIS relates explicitly to Islam?


I believe I expressed myself quite clearly. It's not too difficult to understand.

Being a Muslim is the indispensable condition that must be met before someone can go on to join ISIS and conduct terrorist attacks on its behalf.

There are extremist Buddhist groups in other parts of the world, for example. Likely extremist Hindu ones


And how many attacks have these groups carried out in the West? How many Western Buddhists have left their homes in the West to go fight a genocidal war on behalf of a murderous group? How many Hindu extremist groups have slaughtered a hundred Parisian kids at a rock concert?

Quantity has its own quality. The fact that tiny, irrelevant Buddhist and Hindu terrorist groups exist has no logical bearing on the centrality of the Islamist threat and its unique scale compared to other religious groups.
Original post by Thutmose-III
I believe I expressed myself quite clearly. It's not too difficult to understand.

Being a Muslim is the indispensable condition that must be met before someone can go on to join ISIS and conduct terrorist attacks on its behalf.



And how many attacks have these groups carried out in the West? How many Western Buddhists have left their homes in the West to go fight a genocidal war on behalf of a murderous group? How many Hindu extremist groups have slaughtered a hundred Parisian kids at a rock concert?

Quantity has its own quality. The fact that tiny, irrelevant Buddhist and Hindu terrorist groups exist has no logical bearing on the centrality of the Islamist threat and its unique scale compared to other religious groups.


How many Iraqis killed by US, French, British governments? How many Libyans, Afghanis.....get the drift

How many US army personnel killed Bhuddists? Hindus? None so they have no need to kill or attack in the west. :rolleyes:

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Original post by SMEGGGY
How many Iraqis killed by US, French, British governments? How many Libyans, Afghanis.....get the drift

How many US army personnel killed Bhuddists? Hindus? None so they have no need to kill or attack in the west. :rolleyes:

Posted from TSR Mobile


What on earth is your point? ISIS sympathiser here folks.
Alert.

Alert.


We have an Al Qaeda symphatiser here.

Alert

Alert
Someone alert the police.

This guy openly admitted twice that he supports Al Qaeda
Alert the police he's inciting racial hatred against muslims. It's a criminal offence

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Original post by SMEGGGY
Haha. Yes? A resistance movement against the west crusaders stealing oil off them.

Posted from TSR Mobile


You are probably going to be tracked by GCHQ now, enjoy.

I am in two minds as to report you myself, just in case they are not.
Original post by nexttimeigetvpn
Stop thinking one dimensionally. A would-be terrorist might only commit to doing an attack in the first place because of how readily available guns are. I'd be surprised if he would think of doing the same in the UK where guns, especially assault weapons, are far harder to obtain.


oh yeah the paris terrorists and charlie hebdo terrorists only attacked france because of how readily available guns are there.................OH WAIT

liberal logic loses again
Original post by SMEGGGY
Alert the police he's inciting racial hatred against muslims. It's a criminal offence

Posted from TSR Mobile


I'd start running if I were you.
Original post by ESPORTIVA LUTA
oh yeah the paris terrorists and charlie hebdo terrorists only attacked france because of how readily available guns are there.................OH WAIT

liberal logic loses again


You completely and utterly missed my point :rolleyes:

If guns are readily available, people who would otherwise not risk going to the underground black market for guns, would be able to commit these mass shootings.
Original post by The_Opinion
You are probably going to be tracked by GCHQ now, enjoy.

I am in two minds as to report you myself, just in case they are not.


Do it, you've got nothing to lose.

Minimum is he'll get tracked down, arrested and questioned.
Original post by SMEGGGY
How many Iraqis killed by US, French, British governments? How many Libyans, Afghanis.....get the drift

How many US army personnel killed Bhuddists? Hindus? None so they have no need to kill or attack in the west. :rolleyes:

Posted from TSR Mobile


Still that doesn't give anyone any right go on a killing spree and kill other innocent people. Or are you suggesting that if particular religion psychopath kills a gay person, that all gay people kill everyone in revenge? :erm:
Original post by nexttimeigetvpn
You completely and utterly missed my point :rolleyes:

If guns are readily available, people who would otherwise not risk going to the underground black market for guns, would be able to commit these mass shootings.


You just love making stuff up

Why are you trying to deflect the attention away from islamic terrorism and move it towards gun control?

If you are willing to MURDER HUGE AMOUNTS OF PEOPLE I honestly don't think you would care whether guns are illegal or not.

"Oh guns are illegal, better not carry out that terrorist attack"

So you're telling me these people are willing to take huge risks by murdering huge amounts of people, but are not willing to go underground and find illegal firearms?

Liberal logic fails yet again!
Original post by ESPORTIVA LUTA
You just love making stuff up

Why are you trying to deflect the attention away from islamic terrorism and move it towards gun control?

If you are willing to MURDER HUGE AMOUNTS OF PEOPLE I honestly don't think you would care whether guns are illegal or not.

"Oh guns are illegal, better not carry out that terrorist attack"

So you're telling me these people are willing to take huge risks by murdering huge amounts of people, but are not willing to go underground and find illegal firearms?

Liberal logic fails yet again!


It's what they do, they will find any excuse / change of topic, all part of their "darn, we are in the wrong here, lets talk about something else" tactic.
Now I'm not saying that it's America's fault, but the fact that guns are just so readily available makes it so easy for mentally disturbed people such as this to carry out such devastating acts of violence.

My thoughts are with the families.
Original post by Romanoff
Now I'm not saying that it's America's fault, but the fact that guns are just so readily available makes it so easy for mentally disturbed people such as this to carry out such devastating acts of violence.

My thoughts are with the families.


There is no reason to suggest that he was mentally disturbed, just very devout in his beliefs.
Original post by viddy9
A terrible attack on the gay community.

These kinds of hate crimes and terrorist attacks aren't going to stop anytime soon, but we can minimise the risk of them occurring. Firstly, the United States needs stricter gun control laws: people on the terrorism watchlist aren't barred from having guns, which is madness (although that wouldn't have stopped the terror attack at the black church in Charleston from occurring, nor the San Bernardino attack, because the suspects weren't on the watchlist). Ideally, guns would be completely banned in the United States, but that's not going to happen anytime soon.

Secondly, we should recognise that all ideologies and beliefs can lead people to do terrible things. Islam has its extremists, just as right-wing, anti-government ideologies have their extremists; indeed, domestic terrorism by right-wing anti-government extremists is as big a threat, if not a bigger threat, than jihadi terrorism.

Third, we should identify how best to combat jihadi terrorism. Jihadists have been able to amplify their abhorrent ideologies in ways that, say, Buddhist or Hindu extremists (yes, they exist) haven't, by taking advantage of sociopolitical strife in the Middle East. Dictators in the Middle East have continued to anger and oppress people for decades, largely supported by the West, and our own interventions in the Middle East have demonstrably, as intelligence experts have said, contributed to a rise in terrorism in the Middle East.

Robert Pape, a prominent political scientist at the University of Chicago, analysed every known case of suicide terrorism between 1980 and 2003, concluding: “there is little connection between suicide terrorism and Islamic fundamentalism, or any one of the world's religions... Rather, what nearly all suicide terrorist attacks have in common is a specific secular and strategic goal: to compel modern democracies to withdraw military forces from territory that the terrorists consider to be their homeland”.

He later expanded on this work by looking at all of the suicide terrorist attacks between 2004 and 2009. He found that “overall, foreign military occupation accounts for 98.5% -- and the deployment of American combat forces for 92% -- of all the 1,833 suicide terrorist attacks around the world in the past six years.” Tellingly, between 1980 and 2003, less than 15% of suicide terrorist attacks were aimed at the United States and its interests; between 2004 and 2009, after the invasion and occupation of Iraq and the United States' continued presence in Afghanistan, 92% of suicide terrorist attacks were aimed at the United States.

And, once extremists in the Middle East have taken advantage of these situations, they can go global, and try to radicalise young, disenfranchised people who seek a stable identity, as they have done with many people who have travelled to Syria. Richard Barrett, former director of global counter-terrorism operations for MI6, writes: “Isis projects a strong identity and sense of purpose and it appeals in particular to people who lack both; it offers them the opportunity to be part of something new, regardless of their gender or abilities."

Fourth, we should not be afraid to criticise conservative interpretations of religions, and Islam in particular is a very conservative religion at the moment. We need to work with liberal and reformist Muslims to discount and discredit not only the views of extremists, but also to promote more socially liberal views too within the Islamic community, just as the main Christian churches have reformed extensively their views on so many issues. The latter in particular will be difficult, given that very socially conservative views continue to exist in Christianity (extensively in the United States) and Judaism.


Well said m8. :yy:

Aside from gun reforms, would also add mandatory security checks at mass social gatherings given the current developments at Iraq and Syria

http://www.businessinsider.com/r-american-islamic-state-fighter-chose-to-surrender-to-kurds-tv-2016-3
A lot of hateful tweets coming out on Twitter. http://www.gspellchecker.com/2016/06/what-are-some-people-saying-about-the-orlando-shooting-in-arabic/ May they all be prosecuted for their offensive filth!
(edited 7 years ago)

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