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The finance sector is sexist!!!! Attention

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Reply 80
My point is wage gap does exist in any industry,period.

Original post by KnightCode
The wage gap has already been debunked.
You get paid depending on how much money you make the money.
btw
did you just google search it and select ones that prove ur point?? biaseD?
Original post by ComputerMaths97
Think about it logically.

Imagine you had to employ someone. You have a £50,000 budget. That money not used on a persons salary, you get as profit.

Would you a) Employ a male at £50,000 p/a or b) Employ a female (with the EXACT SAME credentials for the sake of the argument) at less than £40,000 p/a?

Exactly. The theory and calculations that imply a wage gap ignore the current things:
1) The amount of hours worked (yes, it just takes an annual figure. Ignores hours worked completely)
2) Holidays taken (similar to hours worked, but this also considers maternity leave which is much larger for females)
3) Qualifications (If two people have applied for the same job, it ignores how qualified they are, just how much they're paid. Which is evidently a factor in considering wages)
4) It's an average of ALL JOBS. And if you think that there isn't a disparity between the jobs that men and women do then you cannot be helped.

It's just a total salary of all women/men, divided by how many women/men are in work. It ignores so much that it's actually less accurate than saying all women are murderers because the vast majority of children murders in first world countries are done by women.


That's not really how it works dude.

It:s about negotiation power, not about saving money.

Posted from TSR Mobile


1) Ignores hours worked, job role and holidays.
2) Ignores qualifications, just accounts for averages.
3) That one even admits it ignores hours worked and qualifications are also ignored. It also admits that 1 in 6 of the women used were in part time jobs (WHICH OBVIOUSLY PAY LESS) This was the worst piece of evidence I have ever seen sorry to break it to you.
4) Same as 2, conveniently from the same bias company. Great.

I have seen good proof of the pay gap, which exists, but it's not 77%. The evidence you quoted was horrendous and biased. The real pay gap is supposedly 97%. A huge difference. And I believe this is due to sexism in older generations but that's my opinion, I don't see anyone proving the reason for that. (Also younger women 21-26 actually earn more than men).

Please, I beg of you, don't believe everything you read on the internet.
Reply 83
I can conclude in here people genuinely think wage gap never exist, women are weak if they don't apply so company should not recruit them, women are paid more+ more well educated. Not sure how they learn to twists facts into their arguments but they may never have the resources to read newspapers to know what is happening in the world + read the PwC company schemes.


Original post by Princepieman
That's not really how it works dude.

It:s about negotiation power, not about saving money.

Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by Quiton
The things you listed are applicable to men too,period.


Exactly. Men work more hours than women, so obviously women are paid less.

More women are in part time jobs, so obviously they're paid less.

All of these contribute to the average being unequal, despite the fact that it represents nothing to do with individual pay.
Original post by Elivercury
How is the company being "forced" to employ women? The company wants to employ the best people available. If the best people are not getting through due to discrimination then surely having a path that is free of aforementioned discrimination is a sound way of addressing the issue?

You can look at it in several different ways.

The ideal of course is that no discrimination would happen in the first place, but that isn't where we are, so we have things like this.

As I said before, it's not like they recruit the majority of their workforce this way, so it really should make little to no difference to you as a man.


Companies are getting gender quotes to hire more females. just like Norway has a 40% female quota on selected companies.

"If the best people are not getting through due to discrimination then surely having a path that is free of aforementioned discrimination is a sound way of addressing the issue?"

No cause it would just create a cycle of people saying their discriminated and getting hired to feel up the diversity. Okay now it might be females. But once its 50% to both genders or close. Then it will be the LGBT communities saying, there is a lack of LBGT in workplace, then the non-binary will also join in. Then the religious people would join in, probably Jews since they tend to make up the minority religion in the workplace. This will just be quota upon quota, it's like your strangling the company for Diversity
Reply 86
Original post by Princepieman
Srs?

Can you not step back for a momento and think about maybe just a 'few' reasons why?

Especially in client facing organisations..

Posted from TSR Mobile


Maybe in organisations where cultural sensitivity and experience was very important, but in those cases the persons background will directly affect their job performance so its still down to suitability for the job. I'm talking about situations where a persons gender/race/orientation would have no specific advantages. Eg. If a software engineering company has a majority of male workers and they are looking to employ someone, should they hire a woman even if she was less qualified, just to make a diversity quota?
Reply 87
It really depends on the listener himself. LOL. Career is a big thing, if I tried and someone told me I am not well fit, I find this piece of advice more convincing. And it depends how the person is trying to break down to you how you are not a well fit for the job? But I strongly agree that parents advice affect our career choices, limit opportunities and potential.


Original post by J-SP
There definitely is. My point was that the "trusted person" could be ill informed on both those counts. Doesn't stop them from saying it, nor the person it is directed to taking it to heart.
Reply 88
=__= How did you come to a new conclusion men work longer hours than women?? and More women in part time job? you sure?


Original post by ComputerMaths97
Exactly. Men work more hours than women, so obviously women are paid less.

More women are in part time jobs, so obviously they're paid less.

All of these contribute to the average being unequal, despite the fact that it represents nothing to do with individual pay.
Original post by KRin
Maybe in organisations where cultural sensitivity and experience was very important, but in those cases the persons background will directly affect their job performance so its still down to suitability for the job. I'm talking about situations where a persons gender/race/orientation would have no specific advantages. Eg. If a software engineering company has a majority of male workers and they are looking to employ someone, should they hire a woman even if she was less qualified, just to make a diversity quota?


They have to if they want to fill up the diversity quota and not look like a sexist company
Original post by ComputerMaths97
I still disagree.

Why are we encouraging people to work in a different field? Why cannot people just work in this field they want to?

I remember going to my sixth form open day, and we were faced with 2 huge posters, saying (and I quote as I have a pic of it xD)
1) "Are you female? You may wish to consider these subjects: Maths, Physics, Chemistry, Computing, Biology, Further Maths"
2) "Are you male? You may wish to consider these subjects: Art, Sociology, Media Studies, Fashion Textiles, English, History, Classics"

Why is there a campaign? That is clearly not the common interest. There was constantly teachers from the girl-dominated classes coming over to us guys and offering their course.

Sorry but we should not be forcing people to study somewhere, it should be equal opportunity for all. Simple as.


i think we're on 2 different wave lengths. I am not talking about school (im in sixthform also) but the 'real world'. Of course we're not forcing anyone to work/do something they don't want to do, however, by 'letting people do what they want to do' (assuming these are gendered subjects) is going to further encourage social conventions. We need to beat these socially acceptable choices, and although in the short term it is perhaps discriminating, unethical etc to encourage just one gender, in the long run it is going to create equality as they'll be both males AND females in all or most fields/sectors :smile: does this make sense? For me, school is completely different, and what they did in your school IS bad
Original post by J-SP
If the wage gap is not an issue, why is there significant pressure from the government for individual companies to disclose salaries that would allow direct comparisons?


Can you not imagine the uproar if there wasn't.

There's no significant pressure. People are not being told to pay women more, they're being told to employ more women. That's because people think numerical inequality means we live in a sexist society, which is just plain simple-minded and ignorant. Nobody ever digs into the statistics. People just believe them.

"OMG I flipped a coin 100 times and it landed on heads 56 times!! OMG INEQUALITY WE LIVE IN A HORRIBLE SOCIETY WHY IS THE COIN BIASED TOWARDS HEADS" It's just pathetic. No further info, no proof.

Plus half the "studies" done on wages are surveys. So people could just make up their salaries, but who knows.
Original post by KnightCode
Thanks for being understand! , yep. I'm up for encouragement, just not gender quota that is demanded xD


haha no i agree! :smile:
Reply 93
Throughout the post we are talking about working hours/job type/ability being constant, while wages a woman receives is less than that of a man receives?
Not sure how you starting to bring in part time job? comparing woman working part-time with a full-time male is ridiculous.. Did you study biology or chemistry before btw?

Original post by ComputerMaths97
Exactly. Men work more hours than women, so obviously women are paid less.

More women are in part time jobs, so obviously they're paid less.

All of these contribute to the average being unequal, despite the fact that it represents nothing to do with individual pay.
Original post by Quiton
=__= How did you come to a new conclusion men work longer hours than women?? and More women in part time job? you sure?


Okay you now have to decide if you trust those websites you just quoted me because they said these facts.

Just saying, you're completely contradicting yourself.

And yes it is a fact.
Original post by KnightCode
Companies are getting gender quotes to hire more females. just like Norway has a 40% female quota on selected companies.

"If the best people are not getting through due to discrimination then surely having a path that is free of aforementioned discrimination is a sound way of addressing the issue?"

No cause it would just create a cycle of people saying their discriminated and getting hired to feel up the diversity. Okay now it might be females. But once its 50% to both genders or close. Then it will be the LGBT communities saying, there is a lack of LBGT in workplace, then the non-binary will also join in. Then the religious people would join in, probably Jews since they tend to make up the minority religion in the workplace. This will just be quota upon quota, it's like your strangling the company for Diversity


I have seen nothing requiring companies to legally have a quota for diversity?

Regardless, this is a separate topic, the route does not necessarily need to be related to quotas.

Lets go the whole hog and say they make a scheme for women, muslims, LGBT, minorities, jews...any others? We're at 5 at the moment. Assuming 1% of their hires come through this process that is a whopping 5% of their staff are hired through this route...while they will still continue to hire 70-80% white men via their normal routes. I'm really not seeing the problem, and I say this as a white man.

I am perfectly confident in my ability to succeed and get a job and do not need to feel threatened by what is ultimately a positive initiative.

Incidentally, I would be dead set against, say, a 40% quota as you will get people being hired for their gender rather than their ability. On the other hand, if you believe that the top 1% of 50% of the population are getting a "free ride" then that is rather ridiculous really.
Reply 96
Original post by KnightCode
They have to if they want to fill up the diversity quota and not look like a sexist company


Exactly -_-
Diversity for its own sake is pointless.
Reply 97
I trust my colleagues as this is what happened to her when she worked for other bank :smile:


Original post by ComputerMaths97
Okay you now have to decide if you trust those websites you just quoted me because they said these facts.

Just saying, you're completely contradicting yourself.

And yes it is a fact.
(Original post by KRin)
Maybe in organisations where cultural sensitivity and experience was very important, but in those cases the persons background will directly affect their job performance so its still down to suitability for the job. I'm talking about situations where a persons gender/race/orientation would have no specific advantages. Eg. If a software engineering company has a majority of male workers and they are looking to employ someone, should they hire a woman even if she was less qualified, just to make a diversity quota?

for companies this depends, if they want to be seen as 'ethical' then yes, perhaps employing men and women will be perceived as better, however, for a company that is a business, their main objective is PROFIT, thus if the male was more qualified, experienced than the female, then they would naturally employ the male even if they only had males/little females
Original post by Quiton
Throughout the post we are talking about working hours/job type/ability being constant, while wages a woman receives is less than that of a man receives?
Not sure how you starting to bring in part time job? comparing woman working part-time with a full-time male is ridiculous.. Did you study biology or chemistry before btw?


I agree it's ridiculous, but you continue to listen to statistics that are formed by doing this.

There exists nobody that is paid less for the same job. If there is, you must report it to an authority because it's illegal, so can you please do that thanks.

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