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POLL: What is your view of Jaysh Al Fatah (a terrorist group in Syria)?

Poll

What should we do about Jaysh Al Fatah?

JAYSH AL FATAH

Jaysh Al Fatah is one of the most powerful alliances in Syria. We all know that theres ISIS/Daesh, however, very little focus is given to some of these other takfiri groups. Jaysh Al Fatah formed on the 24th March 2015, is a combination of some of these vicious Takfiri groups. Takfirism is given to radical militants who like to call large bodies of other muslims as kaffirs, apostates, both outside their 'sect' and in their 'sect'. They are viciously militant, radicals in ideology, using sectarianism to brainwash even some moderate's into committing acts and crimes against humanity.




Let us examine Jaysh Al Fatah, an alliance of several of the most powerful non-daesh takfiri groups:

The alliance in question is mainly in the Idlib provence. The important thing to note is, many of these terrorist groups operate outside of the Idlib provence, but the fighters from this group in Idlib have decided to unite and fight together.

Founding groups of Jaysh Al Fatah:

"At its founding, Jaish al-Fatah contained seven members, three of them al-Nusra, Ahrar ash-Sham, and Jund al-Aqsa are directly connected to Al-Qaeda or have a similar ideology.

With Ahrar ash-Sham being the largest group,[11] al-Nusra and Ahrar ash-Sham together were reported to represent 90 percent of the troops.[12] Another prominent Islamist faction in the operations room was the Muslim Brotherhood of Syria-linked Sham Legion (Faylaq Al-Sham).

Jaish al-Fatah collaborated with more moderate Free Syrian Army factions such as Knights of Justice Brigade.[13]The coalition's initial success has been attributed to its strong coherence, with the name of individual factions being forbidden when the group conducts joint operations"

Let's have a breakdown of some of these groups, working closely together in Idlib:

Jabhat Al Nusra is the OFFICIAL Alqaeda affiliate in Syria.

Ahrar Asham once worked closely with ISIS, was founded by members of
Alqaeda, and routinely cooperates with Al Nusra, and is viciously sectarian.

Jund Al Aqsa:[Former member, left Originally founded as a subunit within alqaeda affiliate, jabhat al nusra. On the 23 October 2015, Jund al-Aqsa left the Army of Conquest because of its opposition to the other groups considering the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant an enemy.[17] On 17 February 2016, over 400 fighters and senior leaders of Jund al-Aqsa defected to al-Nusra Front.

Liwa Al Haq - Founding members largely islamist. Even if it has moderate elements, the fact it is working with the likes of Jabhat Al Nusra, and Ahrar Asham speaks volumes.

Jaysh Al Sunnah - Homs based group, links to FSA, works closely with alqaeda -member founded group, Ahrar Asham

Anjad Al Sham - Independent Idlib and Hama based rebel group, works closely with alqaeda affiliates al nusra and ahrar as part of the army of conquest - 'Jaysh Al Fatah'. Killed an unarmed syrian soldier, beheaded him, and posted it on facebook as well, using terms like 'nusayri'.

Imam Bukhari Jama't: Islamist Salafi groups, comprised mostly of Uzbeks, expressing loyalty to the Taliban. Group closely allied to official alqaeda affiliate al nusra, and alqaeda member-founded group ahrar asham.

Turkistan Islamic Party: formerly known as the East Turkestan Islamic Movement(ETIM), and other names,[a] is an Islamic terrorist and separatist organization founded by Uyghur militants in western China.
(edited 7 years ago)

Scroll to see replies

Reply 1
These groups are assisted, funded and supported by gulf states, like Saudi Arabia, Qatar, as well as countries like Turkey, with Erdogan at the helm.









Reply 2
@Ibn Fulaan


Salamunalaykum dear brother,

I hope Ramadhan is going well for you, and that this message reaches you in good health.

Could you give me your opinion on Jaysh Al Fatah ?


Just as a note, before anyone derails my thread - a word about Bashar Al Assad:

From shiachat: http://www.shiachat.com/forum/topic/...-bashar-assad/
"Ive noticed some members actually idolizing and praising Bashar Assad. This is very dangerous for you and your future/akhira."

The post got 50 likes, from many admins, and many moderators, including from me.
(edited 7 years ago)
Reply 3
Anyone else?
Reply 4
Original post by Arevaci
Iran's TSR propaganda machine is up and running I see.

The irony is, nonthing i have even mentioned in my OP has anything to do with Iran. These are clear cut Alqaeda affiliates, or founded by Alqaeda or working with Alqaeda. It's the consensus , it's a fact.

You're by far one of the most deplorable people I have seen on TSR.


The sunnah of Muhammed s.a.w, even to those who treated him terribly, was to discuss and engage in dialogue in a manner that was civil, cordial, and with honour and respect.

Parroting on about Sunni groups all day long and claims you cares about lives


I think many sunni's would be offended that you regard the alqaeda affiliate, jabhat al nusra, the alqaeda-member founded group, ahrar asham, and many of these alqaeda affiliates or cooperating groups as 'sunni's', I have sunni family members, i would never class them as true sunni groups myself - very few would i class as legitimately sunni.

What have i posted on the original post, that you find so offensive, non-factual, or incorrect?

Do you have anything to say in defence of Jaysh Al Fatah ?
(edited 7 years ago)
Reply 5
Original post by Arevaci
x


I don't like to make any assumptions, but i hope you're not IdeasforLife. It would break my heart to find out you were, it would really be a tragedy.

I know you're not Ibn Fulaan, because he does not throw personal insults in that manner afaik.
it doesn't matter which group they belongs to, terrorism itself sucks and should not be encouraged
defo against it :yep:
Reply 7
Original post by fatima1998
it doesn't matter which group they belongs to, terrorism itself sucks and should not be encouraged
defo against it :yep:


Great response. I'm happy you have not gone down the route of supporting a group simply because they happen to be (allegedly) from your sect or not part of your sect.
Lol, how'd i guess you were shia by reading your OP?
Reply 9
Original post by BorisJohnson4PM
Lol, how'd i guess you were shia by reading your OP?


Shia or Sunni, it matters not.

Jaysh Al Fatah is comprised of Alqaeda Affiliates, and Alqaeda -member founded groups. It's a matter of principal, not sect.
Original post by Tawheed
Shia or Sunni, it matters not.

Jaysh Al Fatah is comprised of Alqaeda Affiliates, and Alqaeda -member founded groups. It's a matter of principal, not sect.


You say that yet a look back at your previously created threads show absolutely no sign of Assad, Khameini or their ground militas. Do i sense a little bias?
Reply 11
Original post by fatima1998
it doesn't matter which group they belongs to, terrorism itself sucks and should not be encouraged
defo against it :yep:


:yy:

Posted from TSR Mobile
Reply 12
Original post by Arevaci
It's me. I'm afraid there's only so much you much can tolerate from a person Tawheed. You glorify the killer of my people all the time, it's strange that you think it's tragic that a Muslim thinks you're deplorable because of it :tongue:

Ibn Fulaan is boring.


There are a few things i would like to say,

1. A muslim to me , is a muslim. I do not glorify the killing of any muslim.

2. I have never glorified Assad. I don't really know how many times i have to continually have to say that. I swear by Allah, on the night of Ramadhan that not only have i warned against glorifying Assad, i have done so to shia's as well.

I remember when you had accused me of this before, (many times) and i even responded by showing you a thread made by the Admin on shiachat, warning others never to glorify Assad:

From shiachat: http://www.shiachat.com/forum/topic/235014349-stop-idolizing-bashar-assad/
"Ive noticed some members actually idolizing and praising Bashar Assad. This is very dangerous for you and your future/akhira."

The post got 50 likes, from many admins, and many moderators, including from me.

Original post by BorisJohnson4PM
x?


I have criticized Assad many , many times. Mostly on shia forums. I do not glorify, or support Assad. Also look above.
(edited 7 years ago)
Reply 14
Original post by Arevaci
x


IdeasforLife, you have a wonderful opportunity here, to give me, a muslim brother guidance on this issue.

You have, i feel, totally side-stepped the entire topic in discussion.

What is your view of Jaysh Al Fatah ?

Arevaci = IdeasForLife
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Tawheed
x


im not really bothered about them, syria is a lost cause anyway, just pipe down with the hypocrisy.
Reply 16
Terrorism is terrorism. Sect is irrelevant.
Reply 17
Original post by Arevaci
Come on man. How naive do you think we are? This is thread which demonises the Syrian opponents of Iran and the countries who fund them.


I think you're missing a big point here though brother Ideas. The groups i am demonising are the official Alqaeda Affiliate, Jabhat Al Nusra. The Alqaeda -member founded group, Ahrar Asham. Groups among the seven which work closely with Alqaeda, or harbour hardline, millitant ideologies.

This is the month of Ramadhan. Allah is my witness and a witness over us all. You have the chance to explain to me, what i have done wrong in fairly hi-lighting that these groups are what they are?

There's nothing wrong with what I've said. Your actions are deplorable and they deserve nothing but strong condemnation.


Is it deplorable to raise awareness to the general public that currently, there is a very powerful alliance called jaysh al fatah, formed primarily of alqaeda founded, or alqaeda member-founded groups, along with militant groups from other countries who have invaded syria to form this alliance ?

That , after all, is what my thread is about, and i hope we can keep to topic


Many sunnis live with heads in the sand. Al Qaeda are sunni Muslims whether they like it or not. Al Qaeda are not very good sunni Muslims due to some of their actions but they are still sunni regardless.


Well, i have sunni family members and i will tell you this, they will run a country mile away from jaysh al fatah. They regard such groups as evil themselves. Just because Alqaeda claims to be sunni , does not mean when i criticize them, i am attacking sunni's. With due respect, that's an erroneous conclusion you've made.

It speaks volumes i, unlike you, have not resorted to using sectarian language.
Reply 18
Original post by Arevaci
I'm not your brother Tawheed :tongue:


The Messenger of Allah (s.a.w) came to teach us Akhlaq. Not just to those who do good to use, but even to those who wrong us. If you cut ties with me, i will reach out to you. If you do not call me your brother, or regard me to be your brother in Islam, know this, i am a follower of Muhammed s.a.w and ale Muhammed a.s. And i will never instigate cutting ties with another muslim brother.

Anyone who degrades the sahaba and supports the Iranian regime, I have nothing to do with them. I hope I've finally made that perfectly clear.


This thread has nothing to do with the Sahaba. You see, the Sahaba were not one monolithic group. I respect many. We differ on some. You consider Hazrat Abu Talib r.a as a kaffir, do you not - a companion i regard to be one of the greatest. Now, due to our historical difference in viewpoint, have i made takfir on you, and gone out of my way to disrupt you and cause fitnah and discord on the ISOC?

Furthermore, i have never degraded sahaba. You have never ever seen me do it, and i have spoken out against it many times on these boards and other boards.


Once you get back to the rafidi cursing questions I asked (I'm sure you know which ones I'm talking about), I'll answer this. Question for a question.


Great, now you have used highly offensive and secterian language 'rafidah'. This is really the same language used by these Alqaeda groups.

You're under no compulsion to answer my question, just kindly don't pursue in derailing my thread otherwise.

The discussion is Jaysh Al Fatah. If i have lied, or made a false claim about them, then you have the space and location to make your claim.
(edited 7 years ago)
Reply 19
Original post by Arevaci
You don't care if they're AQ run or not. What you care about is that all of Syrian rebels groups oppose your rafidi backed regime in Syria and they collectively pose a serious threat to Khameini's corruption. And ofcourse you've got to spread the Iranian propaganda to make your side look good :tongue:


Again, Allah is my witness, and a witness over us all.

Do you not think, the fact many of these groups are millitants, alqaeda backed/affiliated, has no bearing and influence over my condemnation of them, given that, the entire crux and gravity of my condemnation has been precisely because of that , and their millitant leanings?

You must understand, i have tried to get iranian views on this, but i can not speak farsi and i don't use pressTV. I swear by Allah, the people whose analysis, views, and information i have gotten are often the more secular, human-rights organizations, who do not want to see western government meddling and regime change - and not iran itself.

Much of what i said in my original post isn't at all linked to Iran, and not a word of it is sourced from an iranian news outlet afaik. It's all factual, academic, much of it being sourced as you know, from stanford university among other reputable organizations.



The day you post about Khameini and his vile actions in Syria, is the day I'll say you actually care about sunni lives. The day you stop making excuses for people like Assad etc... That's when I'll think differently.


I will discuss the issue with you in depth, but really, this thread is to discuss Jaysh Al Fatah. I have many, many times condemned actions carried out by the syrian arab army (comprised heavily by sunni fighters, as well).

Could you give me any examples of when i made an excuse for Bashar Al Assad?

If you're referring to the eatern goutha chemical weapons attack, all i said was, the day of the attack or day before the attack, The syrian government invited themselves the UN to inspect a chemical weapons attack carried out by a rebel group. Assad may be regarded as bad, but surely even he isn't mad enough to carry out a brutal chemical weapons attack on the very day he himself invites UN inspectors into syria !

I also evidenced a reported from MIT, one of the worlds best universities, showing the US report on the attack to be flawed.

Yet again, rather than taking a balanced approach, you jumped straight to saying Assad did it, rather than the alqaeda supported or affiliated groups.



You are trying to demonise all the sunni rebel groups in Syria. It's quite obvious. They work together so what? They layed their differences aside and fight together against the more evil foes (Assad, Khameni, ISIS etc...":wink:.


How can anyone reprimand somebody for condemning Alqaeda? How can you in any way, fault me for condemning Alqaeda?


But apparently allying together makes the other groups bad by default too. But ya'know, so I guess Khameini must be little low life too because he allies with Assad and Russia (but I imagine we won't see that kind of thread from you anytime soon). :tongue:


Well, consider that the powerful Jabhat Al Nusra, Ahrar asham (one of the most powerful groups), and among many of the others are either alqaeda affiliates, or founded by members of alqaeda, or routinely worked with DAESH themselves.

Yes, working together with Alqaeda under one branch and name, is akin to working with ISIS under one branch and name (and ahrar asham and al nusra have both routinely worked with Daesh before breaking up with them).

As you said, there is no unity when there are fundamental differences, did you not?

You rejected shia-sunni unity, peaceful unity, but are openly accepting unity with visciously secterian alqaeda groups, or alqaeda founded groups?

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