Why is gender equality still not a reality in 2016?
I am a 21 year old woman and I would describe myself as a feminist going by the actual definition of feminism which is: the advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of equality of the sexes. I am a feminist because I believe that men and women should be equal in society and that neither men nor women should be forced to conform to traditional gender roles NOT because I think that women should be superior to or have more privileges or better rights than men or because I think all men are sexist. I would also say, before people stereotype me, that I am straight, I do not hate men, I do take care of my appearance and I am not in any way the type of radical, extreme feminist that so many people now seem to think that all women who want equal rights are.
Anyway, to get to why I started this thread, I used to believe that men and women were fairly equal in modern society in the UK. However, as I’ve got older I’ve realised more and more that this is just not the case. In the workplace, there is still a 9.4% pay gap on average between men and women for full-time employment and when part-time employment is also included the gap extends to 19.2%. In the private sector specifically the pay gap for even for full-time employees was 17.2%! The TUC analysis of the ONS statistics showed that looking at the highest earners that gap widens even more reaching 54.9% for the top 2% of earners. The “glass ceiling” is even now nowhere near broken. There are many more men than women in top level jobs in politics, law, science, technology, engineering, academia, business… Just looking at politics alone, there is currently a lot in the media about how the next Prime Minister now has to be either Theresa May or Andrea Leadsom therefore it has to be (how shocking!) a woman. I know it’s only the second time in history so that’s a point of interest and it’s obviously great that there was no gender discrimination in this case that prevented us from getting another female Prime Minister but it still shouldn’t be portrayed by the media as such a novel and unusual idea. Even after the 2015 General Election, only 29% of MPs and a third of cabinet ministers are women. Women in politics seem to be judged by the media and society in general as much for how they look as for their policies and often face sexism from both the media and male colleagues. So, if we can’t get proper gender equality in politics which is both very public and obviously instrumental in trying to create equal rights then what hope is there for other professions.
It’s not just in the workplace that women aren’t treated equally either. Everyday sexism is present in schools, universities and in wider society. Worryingly, there is evidence that our generation, if anything, is getting worse. The rise of “Lad Culture” and “Rape Culture” which are particularly prevalent at universities is becoming a serious problem. Women are routinely objectified. Some men (I am definitely not saying all men) and even some women make sexist jokes and comments on a regular basis including joking about rape. Sexist posts and memes (again including jokes about rape) are often shared on social media… Why is it still seen as acceptable to joke that women should “get back to the kitchen” or worse?
As I said, I used to believe that men and women were now equal in the UK when I was still at school but scarily, knowing what I know now looking back on things that happened when I was at school, sexism was obvious there too. I had one male teacher in sixth form who used to patronisingly call all the girls “young lady” but never the boys “young man”. I had a female teacher who said women who worked and had children were irresponsible because they couldn’t be fully committed to their careers. Boys in my class joked that “all women should be prostitutes” but “*name of girl* wouldn’t get any customers”. In my year, boys and even occasionally girls made jokes that were either sexist or involved rape or both. Also, seeing some of the threads on TSR where (some) guys make sexist and misogynistic comments and then call girls “feminazis” if they dispute what’s been said makes me think that sexism certainly hasn’t gone, it hasn’t even decreased by all that much in some ways, it has just adapted into a modern version.
So, why is it that in 2016 women are still not treated as equal to men? And why do people say that feminism is now irrelevant when there is still so much inequality? In a country where women got the vote almost a century ago shouldn’t we have better equality in modern society than this?
Anyway, to get to why I started this thread, I used to believe that men and women were fairly equal in modern society in the UK. However, as I’ve got older I’ve realised more and more that this is just not the case. In the workplace, there is still a 9.4% pay gap on average between men and women for full-time employment and when part-time employment is also included the gap extends to 19.2%. In the private sector specifically the pay gap for even for full-time employees was 17.2%! The TUC analysis of the ONS statistics showed that looking at the highest earners that gap widens even more reaching 54.9% for the top 2% of earners. The “glass ceiling” is even now nowhere near broken. There are many more men than women in top level jobs in politics, law, science, technology, engineering, academia, business… Just looking at politics alone, there is currently a lot in the media about how the next Prime Minister now has to be either Theresa May or Andrea Leadsom therefore it has to be (how shocking!) a woman. I know it’s only the second time in history so that’s a point of interest and it’s obviously great that there was no gender discrimination in this case that prevented us from getting another female Prime Minister but it still shouldn’t be portrayed by the media as such a novel and unusual idea. Even after the 2015 General Election, only 29% of MPs and a third of cabinet ministers are women. Women in politics seem to be judged by the media and society in general as much for how they look as for their policies and often face sexism from both the media and male colleagues. So, if we can’t get proper gender equality in politics which is both very public and obviously instrumental in trying to create equal rights then what hope is there for other professions.
It’s not just in the workplace that women aren’t treated equally either. Everyday sexism is present in schools, universities and in wider society. Worryingly, there is evidence that our generation, if anything, is getting worse. The rise of “Lad Culture” and “Rape Culture” which are particularly prevalent at universities is becoming a serious problem. Women are routinely objectified. Some men (I am definitely not saying all men) and even some women make sexist jokes and comments on a regular basis including joking about rape. Sexist posts and memes (again including jokes about rape) are often shared on social media… Why is it still seen as acceptable to joke that women should “get back to the kitchen” or worse?
As I said, I used to believe that men and women were now equal in the UK when I was still at school but scarily, knowing what I know now looking back on things that happened when I was at school, sexism was obvious there too. I had one male teacher in sixth form who used to patronisingly call all the girls “young lady” but never the boys “young man”. I had a female teacher who said women who worked and had children were irresponsible because they couldn’t be fully committed to their careers. Boys in my class joked that “all women should be prostitutes” but “*name of girl* wouldn’t get any customers”. In my year, boys and even occasionally girls made jokes that were either sexist or involved rape or both. Also, seeing some of the threads on TSR where (some) guys make sexist and misogynistic comments and then call girls “feminazis” if they dispute what’s been said makes me think that sexism certainly hasn’t gone, it hasn’t even decreased by all that much in some ways, it has just adapted into a modern version.
So, why is it that in 2016 women are still not treated as equal to men? And why do people say that feminism is now irrelevant when there is still so much inequality? In a country where women got the vote almost a century ago shouldn’t we have better equality in modern society than this?
(edited 7 years ago)
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sorry to burst your bubble, but men and women won't be 'equal' - especially for religious people
also you need to relax, just because males adress females as young ladys, but never young man for males, doesn't make it sexist
also you need to relax, just because males adress females as young ladys, but never young man for males, doesn't make it sexist
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by cipi
Because women don't do the mathsy subjects. Take a look at any TEM (STEM minus the S) lecture hall in any uni. 90+% men, dispite women being the dominant gender in higher education over all.
Okay, but why is that? That isn't just nature, boys aren't just born with math/science ability..
[video="youtube;wjWBXbGVyQU"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjWBXbGVyQU[/video]
This pretty much explains the silly "wage gap" myth.
This pretty much explains the silly "wage gap" myth.
What does gender even mean nowadays? 
Original post by epage
Okay, but why is that? That isn't just nature, boys aren't just born with math/science ability..
It's because of the same reason males are better at chess. In IQ tests, women often get average-ish results, while men get the highs and the lows. Skills associated with higher IQs (when judged by the tests) are the same skills that are used in maths and science, and chess!
Original post by Sapphire321
it’s obviously great that we are going to have another female Prime Minister
it’s obviously great that we are going to have another female Prime Minister
nice to see the 'advocate of equal rights' is judging how well each of these candidates will perform as pm based on their gender. How about judging them on the merits and weaknesses of their proposed legislation, experience and characters?
Why should it be great to have a pm just because they're a woman? It makes literally no sense.
Original post by theBranicAc
sorry to burst your bubble, but men and women won't be 'equal' - especially for religious people
also you need to relax, just because males adress females as young ladys, but never young man for males, doesn't make it sexist
also you need to relax, just because males adress females as young ladys, but never young man for males, doesn't make it sexist
This is the entire point. Men and women should certainly be equal in the UK in 2016. The UK is traditionally a Christian country and Christianity adapted for modern society does include equal rights. I am a Christian but I still believe in equal rights and I am in no way unique in that. Also, many people in the UK are not religious at all. I do agree that for some religions and in some countries women are still very far from being accepted as equal but that's why it's so important for people around the world to keep campaigning for gender equality.
Trust me on that one. I was there and it was meant as sexist even if it might not always be.
Original post by cipi
Because women don't do the mathsy subjects. Take a look at any TEM (STEM minus the S) lecture hall in any uni. 90+% men, despite women being the dominant gender in higher education over all.
Yes but why is that? It's gender conditioning which makes less and less girls choose science and maths subjects the further in education you go. From GCSE to A Level to University the number of girls and women taking STEM subjects keeps on decreasing.
Yes you're right, why is gender equality still not a reality in 2016? After all women's cancers receive 15 times more funding than men's. 77% of homicide victims are men. 80% of all suicides are men. Men loose custody in 84% of divorces. 60-80% of the homeless are men. Men make up 94% of work suicides. Just to name a few.
You should spend a week in Saudi Arabia and see what real gender discrimination is about.
You should spend a week in Saudi Arabia and see what real gender discrimination is about.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Sapphire321
It's gender conditioning
Because in your mind, there is probably a secret board room somewhere where a bunch of white middle-aged men are sitting round a table going:
"Mwahahaha! How can we increase our grip on society further? I know, lets do some 'gender conditioning' in schools to keep women out of high-paid jobs... Guess what, I haven't even checked my privellidge!! mwhahahaha"
Original post by epage
Okay, but why is that? That isn't just nature, boys aren't just born with math/science ability..
I think it's nature but more 'natural interest' rather than natural ability. But that's just based on observations. You stick a woman at a desk for 8 hours a day in a non-social setting, and she will hate it. For a man, as long as the work is intellectually stimulating, he can enjoy it.
Original post by MildredMalone
[video="youtube;wjWBXbGVyQU"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjWBXbGVyQU[/video]
This pretty much explains the silly "wage gap" myth.
This pretty much explains the silly "wage gap" myth.
Discrimination is a factor. In the video it says the the wage gap doesn't take account of different job positions or different jobs. It is the average earnings of men and women working full time. Precisely my point, men are paid on average more than women due to:
1. More men in higher paid jobs/careers.
2. More men in higher paid positions within the same organisation/career path.
3. Men being paid more than women for doing the same job.
These situations can arise because of:
1. Discrimination.
2. Gender conditioning/conforming to traditional gender roles.
It's clear somebody hasn't been doing their research or bothered thinking at all, but then again, that's the problem.
A teacher at my school called the girls "princess" , "love" , "sweetie" he commented on one girls clothes size saying she'd be a good model. He never did to the boys.
My dad's colleague is a working mother who is set to be really high up in the company. The amount of s*** she's faced for being a woman, it's taken her many more years than it should've done to get her to this stage. Men have many sexist jokes to her throughout her career and she's missed out on promotions because of it. Don't tell me women don't try to get good careers and that it's their own fault that there's a pay gap.
Growing up the girls were encouraged to do art or dance and the boys were encouraged to love science and maths. Girls who were good at maths were told they are good, "for a girl."
A boy in my year would say women are only good for two things, cooking and babies. The teacher would laugh.
At the age of 11 my friends and I would walk down the street and be told "show us your t*** " we were 11, we barely had any and yet we were already being sexualised.
It's so sad to see the comments on this post blatantly refuse to believe there is inequality. Of course there is inequality, it's just more subtle that you think.
Posted from TSR Mobile
My dad's colleague is a working mother who is set to be really high up in the company. The amount of s*** she's faced for being a woman, it's taken her many more years than it should've done to get her to this stage. Men have many sexist jokes to her throughout her career and she's missed out on promotions because of it. Don't tell me women don't try to get good careers and that it's their own fault that there's a pay gap.
Growing up the girls were encouraged to do art or dance and the boys were encouraged to love science and maths. Girls who were good at maths were told they are good, "for a girl."
A boy in my year would say women are only good for two things, cooking and babies. The teacher would laugh.
At the age of 11 my friends and I would walk down the street and be told "show us your t*** " we were 11, we barely had any and yet we were already being sexualised.
It's so sad to see the comments on this post blatantly refuse to believe there is inequality. Of course there is inequality, it's just more subtle that you think.
Posted from TSR Mobile
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by + polarity -
What does gender even mean nowadays?
This issue isn't only confined to gender either. Racial discrimination, religious discrimination, discrimination against LGBT people and discrimination against disabled people happens as well.
I believe we have infact surpassed gender ewuality to the point where men are now discriminated against in western society. In the uk schools offer a modular based examination sysyem which favours girls. There are multiple women in business/industry schemes for women but none are male based. Men are more likely to commit suicide and more likely to be raped if prison is included
Etc etc
Posted from TSR Mobile
Etc etc
Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by Sapphire321
This issue isn't only confined to gender either. Racial discrimination, religious discrimination, discrimination against LGBT people and discrimination against disabled people happens as well.
"I didn't get the job because somebody else was better" and "I didn't get the job because I'm [insert group here]" are two different thing, the first is legal, the second is illegal (mostly, there are a few exceptions and they have to be explicitly stated), although when somebody who can use the latter doesn't get a job it's likely the first, or they were stupid and tried to get something they knew they couldn't. Then again, nothing new for the "liberal" youth to develop a victim complex to justify all their own failings and incompetence.
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