What is the regressive left?
I see this term bandied around a lot, but what does it actually mean? How is the regressive left different from the "normal" left, the progressive left, the classical left, etc?
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The regressive left (also sometimes referred to as regressive liberals) is a political epithet used to negatively characterise a section of left-wing politics which is accused of paradoxically holding reactionary views due to tolerance of illiberal principles and ideologies (such as extremist Islamism) for the sake of multiculturalism and cultural relativism.
Quoting Wikipedia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regressive_left
I might have misinterpreted this but basically those who are still for allowing millions of migrants into the country, and accepting things from other religions e.g. underage marriage and sharia law. Claiming they protect free speech, etc.
Defined basically by the primary user of the word 'Those who pander to Islamism' rather than questioning the rights of the people involved.
Quoting Wikipedia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regressive_left
I might have misinterpreted this but basically those who are still for allowing millions of migrants into the country, and accepting things from other religions e.g. underage marriage and sharia law. Claiming they protect free speech, etc.
Defined basically by the primary user of the word 'Those who pander to Islamism' rather than questioning the rights of the people involved.
(edited 7 years ago)
From what I gather, the Regressive Left are a small but very vocal minority.
They proclaim to believe in equality yet will hyperbole those you disagree with them as "racist", "sexist", "uneducated", "Tory scum" etc. They tend to follow the cult of Jeremy Corbyn & spivs like Russell Brand. On the whole they do lean towards the "Equal Outcome" rather than "Equal Opportunities" but will happily ignore contradictions & hypocrisy in how they see the world:
E.g - "All Jews are evil (but you can't call all Muslims evil as it's racist."
I think many of them get so used to only debating in their "safe spaces" that they don't actually debate - they all kinda sit around & agree with each other which ensures they lose touch with the majority view. They then don't understand why the majority view is so different to their's so they throw around insults like I've mentioned above.
Some of them are violent but I believe this is a minority even in amongst their movement - others within it are happy to promote violence if it agrees with their aims/ideals but won't take part in it physically.
I do think that deep down some of them probably mean well but have totally the got the wrong end of the stick when it comes to pragmatic solutions.
They proclaim to believe in equality yet will hyperbole those you disagree with them as "racist", "sexist", "uneducated", "Tory scum" etc. They tend to follow the cult of Jeremy Corbyn & spivs like Russell Brand. On the whole they do lean towards the "Equal Outcome" rather than "Equal Opportunities" but will happily ignore contradictions & hypocrisy in how they see the world:
E.g - "All Jews are evil (but you can't call all Muslims evil as it's racist."
I think many of them get so used to only debating in their "safe spaces" that they don't actually debate - they all kinda sit around & agree with each other which ensures they lose touch with the majority view. They then don't understand why the majority view is so different to their's so they throw around insults like I've mentioned above.
Some of them are violent but I believe this is a minority even in amongst their movement - others within it are happy to promote violence if it agrees with their aims/ideals but won't take part in it physically.
I do think that deep down some of them probably mean well but have totally the got the wrong end of the stick when it comes to pragmatic solutions.
The regressive left are a group of idealistic militants who aim to appease political correctness through the eradication of free speech and the indoctrination of identity politics to conform to a political bias which contradicts classical liberal and progressive principles. The regressive left are waging a war on rational and openness because they believe reasoned and systemic evidence promulgates a political agenda which oppresses and disenfranchises minority groups and women. Many on the regressive left like to use buzzwords such as "the patriarchy" and "institutional racism" because it is a reiteration of narrative which comes with no reasoned examples and therefore can be used to silence conversation which goes against the leftist bandwagon. A good example might be the left's refusal to acknowledge the overt incompatibility of Islam in modern society and its heinous oppression of women as they believe such a statement is an attack on multiculturalism and the Muslim community as a collective. This conformity which has been imposed on the populous by the regressive left is why any denunciation of the Islamic faith is now dismissed as radical because the left's use of poignant rhetoric to silence debate has resonated and is now ingrained as a political no-go topic of discussion.
As a people living in a democratic society it's imperative that we are able to challenge political ideals because knowing if an opinion holds up to interrogation from all sides of the political spectrum is a mature mean by which to develop one's political adherence. Too many young people are falling victim to regressive leftism and it's the result of perverse indoctrination from our education system and the overt left wing bias which is present in our academic institutions. Thankfully, many people are beginning to abandon the submission to leftist political propaganda but the war to revert its impact on society may take much longer. Being a liberal and being a leftist are two complete opposites.
As a people living in a democratic society it's imperative that we are able to challenge political ideals because knowing if an opinion holds up to interrogation from all sides of the political spectrum is a mature mean by which to develop one's political adherence. Too many young people are falling victim to regressive leftism and it's the result of perverse indoctrination from our education system and the overt left wing bias which is present in our academic institutions. Thankfully, many people are beginning to abandon the submission to leftist political propaganda but the war to revert its impact on society may take much longer. Being a liberal and being a leftist are two complete opposites.
Original post by Grand High Witch
I see this term bandied around a lot, but what does it actually mean? How is the regressive left different from the "normal" left, the progressive left, the classical left, etc?
Pretty self-explanatory.
Putting it shortly: you become a regressive leftist, when in a bid to eradicate the discrimination against some members of the society you make them more privileged than others.
When you're so liberal, you go full circle and become conservative
The kind of people who will call you a ****ing white male if you disagree, and then tell you to check your privilege.
Original post by Tempest II
From what I gather, the Regressive Left are a small but very vocal minority.
They proclaim to believe in equality yet will hyperbole those you disagree with them as "racist", "sexist", "uneducated", "Tory scum" etc. They tend to follow the cult of Jeremy Corbyn & spivs like Russell Brand. On the whole they do lean towards the "Equal Outcome" rather than "Equal Opportunities" but will happily ignore contradictions & hypocrisy in how they see the world:
E.g - "All Jews are evil (but you can't call all Muslims evil as it's racist."
I think many of them get so used to only debating in their "safe spaces" that they don't actually debate - they all kinda sit around & agree with each other which ensures they lose touch with the majority view. They then don't understand why the majority view is so different to their's so they throw around insults like I've mentioned above.
Some of them are violent but I believe this is a minority even in amongst their movement - others within it are happy to promote violence if it agrees with their aims/ideals but won't take part in it physically.
I do think that deep down some of them probably mean well but have totally the got the wrong end of the stick when it comes to pragmatic solutions.
They proclaim to believe in equality yet will hyperbole those you disagree with them as "racist", "sexist", "uneducated", "Tory scum" etc. They tend to follow the cult of Jeremy Corbyn & spivs like Russell Brand. On the whole they do lean towards the "Equal Outcome" rather than "Equal Opportunities" but will happily ignore contradictions & hypocrisy in how they see the world:
E.g - "All Jews are evil (but you can't call all Muslims evil as it's racist."
I think many of them get so used to only debating in their "safe spaces" that they don't actually debate - they all kinda sit around & agree with each other which ensures they lose touch with the majority view. They then don't understand why the majority view is so different to their's so they throw around insults like I've mentioned above.
Some of them are violent but I believe this is a minority even in amongst their movement - others within it are happy to promote violence if it agrees with their aims/ideals but won't take part in it physically.
I do think that deep down some of them probably mean well but have totally the got the wrong end of the stick when it comes to pragmatic solutions.
The most accurate response so far. I think the anti Semitic point is more nuanced though, in that regreessives of note such as Livingstone, Galloway etc aren't anti Semitic per se but simply have lost plot over Israel- and you have Jews with the same views.
I think the best way to look at the regressive left is that they view neoliberalism as the worlds greatest evil and thus adopt the idiom of my enemies enemy is my friend. In the 30s this manifested as the British communist party supporting hitler. In modern times its people like the SWP having dodgy links to Islamists and dictators.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by TercioOfParma
The kind of people who will call you a ****ing white male if you disagree, and then tell you to check your privilege.
How terrifying.
Personally describing Hamas as fighting for social justice is more of an issue than some up tight students calling people names.
Original post by ChaoticButterfly
How terrifying.
Personally describing Hamas as fighting for social justice is more of an issue than some up tight students calling people names.
Personally describing Hamas as fighting for social justice is more of an issue than some up tight students calling people names.
Honestly I don't get why Israel doesn't just waltz in and utterly crush Hamas. Sure there will be outrage, but you'd be killing a huge problem at the price of causing a bunch of smaller ones.
Original post by Davij038
The most accurate response so far. I think the anti Semitic point is more nuanced though, in that regreessives of note such as Livingstone, Galloway etc aren't anti Semitic per se but simply have lost plot over Israel- and you have Jews with the same views.
Yeah it's a case of anyone anti-Israeli/American will do, regardless of how abhorrent the views and/or actions of the 3rd party in question are.
Original post by TercioOfParma
Honestly I don't get why Israel doesn't just waltz in and utterly crush Hamas. Sure there will be outrage, but you'd be killing a huge problem at the price of causing a bunch of smaller ones.
it's such a shame no one thought of this with the Ba'ath party in Iraq
Original post by zayn008
it's such a shame no one thought of this with the Ba'ath party in Iraq
Iraq wasn't essentially in chaos. Iraq wasn't killing American civilians and bombing and firing missiles its cities.
Original post by jake4198
Spoiler
I salute you for writing all that without being triggered. (Would rep if I could)
Original post by Grand High Witch
I see this term bandied around a lot, but what does it actually mean? How is the regressive left different from the "normal" left, the progressive left, the classical left, etc?
Tempest has touched on it, but I think it can be simplified.
It is basically the philosophical paradox of being tolerant of intolerance, it's regressive because the over tolerance of intolerant views is causing liberal ideals/positions to regress to a state of intolerance.
regressverbrɪˈɡrɛs/
1.
1.return to a former or less developed state.
It comes in two forms that are mainstream, the obvious being Islam and Muslim, the idea of freedom of religion is currently causing many a would be 'liberal' to forgo already established liberal postilions on other issues like women's rights or sexual freedoms like being openly homosexual.
The second, is the need to force their liberal stances. This requires more legislation and more policing of the issues, liberalism is suppose to be about freedoms and having more of them, if the government is given more power to police issues the ability to speak freely becomes lessened, again it's paradoxical.
Being liberal has widely become less about free expression and more about forcing their narrative down people's throat with threats. That this position has been officially backed by many European governments should be a real cause for concern to anyone that actually values the freedoms that liberalism is supposed to precipitate.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by TercioOfParma
Honestly I don't get why Israel doesn't just waltz in and utterly crush Hamas. Sure there will be outrage, but you'd be killing a huge problem at the price of causing a bunch of smaller ones.
Israel waltzed out in 2005 which is why Hamas now runs Gaza. Waltzing in or out doesn't seem to make a difference, the best hope for Israel is stalemate, backed up by great defence (Iron Dome, a separation barrier, checkpoints, etc.). Let's be honest, Hamas is more of an annoyance than an existential threat at this point.
It is similar to how in Europe, nobody will actually fight and destroy Islamism until it becomes an existential threat (by which point it may be too late). After the Paris atrocities last year, and the completely supine response to them, I gave up on Europe, or at least, France.*
Original post by zayn008
it's such a shame no one thought of this with the Ba'ath party in Iraq
Isn't that exactly what we did in the war?
Original post by HanSoloLuck
Tempest has touched on it, but I think it can be simplified.
It is basically the philosophical paradox of being tolerant or intolerance, it's regressive because the over tolerance of intolerant views is causing liberal ideals/positions to regress to a state of intolerance.
regressverbrɪˈɡrɛs/
It comes in two forms that are mainstream, the obvious being Islam and Muslim, the idea of freedom of religion is currently causing many 'liberal' to forgo already established liberal postilions on other issues like women's rights or sexual freedoms like being openly homosexual.
The second, is the need to force their liberal stances. This requires more legislation and more policing of the issues, liberalism is suppose to be about freedoms and having more of them, if the government given more power to police issues the ability to speak freely becomes lessened, again it's paradoxical.
Being liberal has widely become less about free expression and more about forcing their narrative down people's throat with threats. That this position has been officially backed by many European governments should be a real cause for concern to anyone that actually values the freedoms that liberalism is supposed to precipitate.
It is basically the philosophical paradox of being tolerant or intolerance, it's regressive because the over tolerance of intolerant views is causing liberal ideals/positions to regress to a state of intolerance.
regressverbrɪˈɡrɛs/
1.
1.return to a former or less developed state.
It comes in two forms that are mainstream, the obvious being Islam and Muslim, the idea of freedom of religion is currently causing many 'liberal' to forgo already established liberal postilions on other issues like women's rights or sexual freedoms like being openly homosexual.
The second, is the need to force their liberal stances. This requires more legislation and more policing of the issues, liberalism is suppose to be about freedoms and having more of them, if the government given more power to police issues the ability to speak freely becomes lessened, again it's paradoxical.
Being liberal has widely become less about free expression and more about forcing their narrative down people's throat with threats. That this position has been officially backed by many European governments should be a real cause for concern to anyone that actually values the freedoms that liberalism is supposed to precipitate.
Congratulations TSR, you have now effectively shown a right wing demonstration of the 'regressive left',
now as a left winger let me give you a definition from the left of centre. Regressive left, depending on who is saying it, means either a left wing individual/power which doesn't conform to the norm, and in stepping outside of this parameter offends and threatens much of the powers that be. This is exactly what has happened to Jeremy now (the ring winger's meaning of the term). Or on the other hand, the regressive left are those left wingers, such as Hilary Benn, former Blairites, who in abandoning the 'true' left wing polemic and instead favouring the centre ground new labour used to ratify, are equally doing a disservice to what it means to be left wing, in this way! (this is what us left winger's mean when we use this term)
I hope this has helped you look at this issue from another perspective?!?
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Davij038
The most accurate response so far. I think the anti Semitic point is more nuanced though, in that regreessives of note such as Livingstone, Galloway etc aren't anti Semitic per se but simply have lost plot over Israel- and you have Jews with the same views.
I think the best way to look at the regressive left is that they view neoliberalism as the worlds greatest evil and thus adopt the idiom of my enemies enemy is my friend. In the 30s this manifested as the British communist party supporting hitler. In modern times its people like the SWP having dodgy links to Islamists and dictators.
I think the best way to look at the regressive left is that they view neoliberalism as the worlds greatest evil and thus adopt the idiom of my enemies enemy is my friend. In the 30s this manifested as the British communist party supporting hitler. In modern times its people like the SWP having dodgy links to Islamists and dictators.
Yes it's all too easy to forget that the left's alliance with tyranny goes back to the roots of socialism in the 20th century. The communist famines in Russia and Ukraine were vigorously denied or downplayed by the Western leftist useful idiots of the Guardian and New York Times (how times haven't changed, with them now opposing the great struggle of our times - against Islamofascism).
Not that the left is entirely to blame - there was plenty of support for fascist tyranny among the British right, prior to the declaration of war in 1939. The Daily Mail egregiously supported fascism during this period.
But the left has a greater tendency to side with barbarity, and I believe that this is due to the left's inherent desire for change. The right - on the whole - is not particularly keen on any kind of revolutionary movement, good or bad, whether it be the abolition of slavery in the 18th and 19th centuries, or the overthrow of capitalism in the 20th century. The modern right is thus in a better position than the left, since they can say that the Western enlightenment was essentially all we needed, other than minor tweaks, and they are not far wrong. The revolutionary movements of the enlightenment era have been anti-liberty - communism, fascism, and today, Islamism - and so the left has nowhere to turn to to feed its desire for radical change, other than causes against liberty. Put another way, the modern desire for freedom and humanity, in the West, is a conservative one, because the most prominent anti-conservative forces are oppressive and we basically have freedom worked out. We just need to maintain it.
This tendency has never been more true than today. Several severe restrictions on human liberty in the West were wiped out in the 20th century, admirably, by the left. For example, freedom for gays was only established after the 1960s. Today, what many pejoratively term "SJWs", are scrambling around trying to find sources of oppression where they do not exist and ignoring the reality that outside of the West, freedom does not exist yet in many places. A typical example would be third wave feminism - a movement which abandons the goal of sexual equality in favour of rabid identity politics and a tolerance for Islamic misogyny.
The left has never been more regressive than today.*
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