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I'm not at Oxford, but there will be people you don't like at any university, you'll always find some nice people. The workload is high apparently, but there is support and if someone is intelligent they might want to be around people with a similar passion and commitment for their subject (not that that doesn't exist at other unis of course!) Many people are happy at Oxford, but whether it suits one individual is a different matter.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Mvpmb
upper class social cliques etc.
What are those?
Not sure what is included in the 'etc' but the only two things you mention are easily dealt with:
1. Work load is tough but manageable as long as you are disciplined and enjoy your subject.
2. Upper class (and any other) social cliques can simply be ignored. In my experience it really is that easy. There are thousands of students at Oxford and you choose not to have anything to do with most of them if you like.
And then it depends what you mean by 'doing just as good in life'. If you mean earning just as much money, and you worry about the work load at Oxford, then yes, perhaps you'd be better off somewhere else. If 'doing just as good in life' includes having as broad a knowledge and understanding of your subject, then I think you should consider Oxford seriously as an option.
1. Work load is tough but manageable as long as you are disciplined and enjoy your subject.
2. Upper class (and any other) social cliques can simply be ignored. In my experience it really is that easy. There are thousands of students at Oxford and you choose not to have anything to do with most of them if you like.
And then it depends what you mean by 'doing just as good in life'. If you mean earning just as much money, and you worry about the work load at Oxford, then yes, perhaps you'd be better off somewhere else. If 'doing just as good in life' includes having as broad a knowledge and understanding of your subject, then I think you should consider Oxford seriously as an option.
Original post by Mvpmb
With the work load, upper class social cliques etc. If your smart wouldnt you just be happier doing well somewhere else and doing just as good in life without the 3 years?
Am honestly a bit baffled by the line of thinking in your question (which, as others have pointed out, highlights the wrong things/doesn't entirely make sense). I've read this sentence several times and it still doesn't make sense to me because it's implying that Oxford students can't possibly be happier than students at other unis. Is that what you meant to suggest? Idk..
I didn't have a great time at Oxford. In fact, my three years were rather ****. It was hell on earth for me, due to an unfortunate combination of things that were very specific to my particular situation at the time. (I don't think most of the things that happened to me are likely to happen to others.)
So why, you might ask, am I so active on TSR promoting Oxford and promoting my particular college, despite having had a bad time there myself? It is because I believe... no actually, I know, that it is an absolutely amazing place to be an undergraduate student and that it is a student experience that is unparalleled anywhere else in the world (aside from The Other Place
But we don't count them coz no one likes them anyway 
). Academically, socially and - in my case - musically, few places can compete. The opportunities for personal growth/development and trying out new things - be they hobbies, new skills, positions of power, research ideas or just wacky essays - are never-ending and the people you meet are mostly incredible, stimulating and amazing (there are always a few bad eggs at any uni).People often ask me if I regret attending Oxford because they know it was an awful three-year period for me. But honestly, the answer is that if I had to repeat the experience, I would do so and I wouldn't change a thing. The opportunities I was given (bearing in mind I come from a poor ethnic minority family and a comp that was dodgy as hell) and the incredible people I met, and the amount of effort that was invested into tailoring my degree experience to my interests, was completely worth all the bad stuff
In case somone out there's actually taking this thread seriously, I'll copy a response I made to another thread:
There are loads of reasons to want to go to Oxford (or Cambridge). I've main a totally not-exhaustive list below, not one of which will be "prestige". They basically all stem from the fact that Oxbridge have way, way more money than any other university.
- College system. Oxbridge is divided into 35ish individual colleges which provides a totally unique social, physical and academic environment. You live in a community of 200-500 students with dedicated college staff etc. Its a way more personal environment than a university of 10,000, and as a result you get:
- Substantially better access to extracurriculars like sports teams. Show me another university that has more than 100 competitive football teams, for instance. And that's not even the sport with the highest participation.
- University societies are also far more broad and active. You get loads of very interesting speaker events, I'd wager significantly more than at other unis.
- Every college has a bar so... access to 30+ subsidised bars.
- Short terms. A disadvantage in some ways but it also means long holidays. Holidays in which you can travel, spend time at home, work a temp job/internship for experience... whatever you want.
- The above also makes it cheap, as you only pay for 26ish weeks accommodation per year.
- Excellent financial support for those that need it.
- Tutorial system. It gives you access to world-leading academics in groups of 4, 2, even 1. That's really not something that exists elsewhere.
- Living and studying in 750+ year old colleges that conference guests pay £200+ per night to stay in.
- A very nice city, imo.
- Probably the best thing: the people you meet. I'm not going to pretend that that's exclusive to Oxford, but generally speaking Oxford attracts some amazing multi-talented people from loads of backgrounds, unified by being way more interested in academia than the people not at Oxford.
There are loads of reasons to want to go to Oxford (or Cambridge). I've main a totally not-exhaustive list below, not one of which will be "prestige". They basically all stem from the fact that Oxbridge have way, way more money than any other university.
- College system. Oxbridge is divided into 35ish individual colleges which provides a totally unique social, physical and academic environment. You live in a community of 200-500 students with dedicated college staff etc. Its a way more personal environment than a university of 10,000, and as a result you get:
- Substantially better access to extracurriculars like sports teams. Show me another university that has more than 100 competitive football teams, for instance. And that's not even the sport with the highest participation.
- University societies are also far more broad and active. You get loads of very interesting speaker events, I'd wager significantly more than at other unis.
- Every college has a bar so... access to 30+ subsidised bars.
- Short terms. A disadvantage in some ways but it also means long holidays. Holidays in which you can travel, spend time at home, work a temp job/internship for experience... whatever you want.
- The above also makes it cheap, as you only pay for 26ish weeks accommodation per year.
- Excellent financial support for those that need it.
- Tutorial system. It gives you access to world-leading academics in groups of 4, 2, even 1. That's really not something that exists elsewhere.
- Living and studying in 750+ year old colleges that conference guests pay £200+ per night to stay in.
- A very nice city, imo.
- Probably the best thing: the people you meet. I'm not going to pretend that that's exclusive to Oxford, but generally speaking Oxford attracts some amazing multi-talented people from loads of backgrounds, unified by being way more interested in academia than the people not at Oxford.
Original post by nexttime
In case somone out there's actually taking this thread seriously, I'll copy a response I made to another thread:
There are loads of reasons to want to go to Oxford (or Cambridge). I've main a totally not-exhaustive list below, not one of which will be "prestige". They basically all stem from the fact that Oxbridge have way, way more money than any other university.
- College system. Oxbridge is divided into 35ish individual colleges which provides a totally unique social, physical and academic environment. You live in a community of 200-500 students with dedicated college staff etc. Its a way more personal environment than a university of 10,000, and as a result you get:
- Substantially better access to extracurriculars like sports teams. Show me another university that has more than 100 competitive football teams, for instance. And that's not even the sport with the highest participation.
- University societies are also far more broad and active. You get loads of very interesting speaker events, I'd wager significantly more than at other unis.
- Every college has a bar so... access to 30+ subsidised bars.
- Short terms. A disadvantage in some ways but it also means long holidays. Holidays in which you can travel, spend time at home, work a temp job/internship for experience... whatever you want.
- The above also makes it cheap, as you only pay for 26ish weeks accommodation per year.
- Excellent financial support for those that need it.
- Tutorial system. It gives you access to world-leading academics in groups of 4, 2, even 1. That's really not something that exists elsewhere.
- Living and studying in 750+ year old colleges that conference guests pay £200+ per night to stay in.
- A very nice city, imo.
- Probably the best thing: the people you meet. I'm not going to pretend that that's exclusive to Oxford, but generally speaking Oxford attracts some amazing multi-talented people from loads of backgrounds, unified by being way more interested in academia than the people not at Oxford.
There are loads of reasons to want to go to Oxford (or Cambridge). I've main a totally not-exhaustive list below, not one of which will be "prestige". They basically all stem from the fact that Oxbridge have way, way more money than any other university.
- College system. Oxbridge is divided into 35ish individual colleges which provides a totally unique social, physical and academic environment. You live in a community of 200-500 students with dedicated college staff etc. Its a way more personal environment than a university of 10,000, and as a result you get:
- Substantially better access to extracurriculars like sports teams. Show me another university that has more than 100 competitive football teams, for instance. And that's not even the sport with the highest participation.
- University societies are also far more broad and active. You get loads of very interesting speaker events, I'd wager significantly more than at other unis.
- Every college has a bar so... access to 30+ subsidised bars.
- Short terms. A disadvantage in some ways but it also means long holidays. Holidays in which you can travel, spend time at home, work a temp job/internship for experience... whatever you want.
- The above also makes it cheap, as you only pay for 26ish weeks accommodation per year.
- Excellent financial support for those that need it.
- Tutorial system. It gives you access to world-leading academics in groups of 4, 2, even 1. That's really not something that exists elsewhere.
- Living and studying in 750+ year old colleges that conference guests pay £200+ per night to stay in.
- A very nice city, imo.
- Probably the best thing: the people you meet. I'm not going to pretend that that's exclusive to Oxford, but generally speaking Oxford attracts some amazing multi-talented people from loads of backgrounds, unified by being way more interested in academia than the people not at Oxford.
Repped you too recently
Original post by Mvpmb
With the work load, upper class social cliques etc. If your smart wouldnt you just be happier doing well somewhere else and doing just as good in life without the 3 years?
"Can you be happy..."
ofcourse you can! I'm happy, the workload is high, but I spend my time working doing something I enjoy and find interesting. So, although work can take up a lot of time and is often challenging, I find it very rewarding (and I know that virtually everyone else here gets something out of doing their work
)"Will you be happy..." (might be a better question)
Ofcourse, as is true of any university, some people will be unhappy. Often for reasons beyond life at university, and living in the high pressure environment of Oxford rarely helps that.
But Oxford certainly isn't a city full of unhappy, library-dwelling workhorses! People do stuff! Punting, Rowing, Music, Walking, Sleeping(personal favourite), Clubbing, Partying etc. etc.
The Cliques you mention are also something I haven't experienced at all in my 2 and a bit years here, people come from all sorts of backgrounds and rub along together pretty merrily in my experience!
To clarify my concerns
In my opinion, I don't think academic obsession in the most formative years of your life is healthy. The perception I have(and I may be mistaken which is exactly why I'm asking) is that Oxford students work considerably more/harder then others and therefore find it more difficult to have achieve fuffilment in other areas of their life due to The abnormal intensity of their work. In a lot of cases, Oxford graduates do not go on to be highly Succesful rich people or at least not enough so to justify the work they put into their degree. It's one thing to love a subject, it's another to spend the peak years of your youth suffocating yourself with it.
Now, if you turn around and tell me that most people at Oxford are actually very social sporty fun people who breeze through the work then I will apologize.
I'm just asking because I recently achieved a clean slate of A's and A*'s in my a levels and have developed an obsession with politics. I achieved 100%across all my units for it and worked with Zac goldsmith among other things and part of me wants to give Oxford a crack. I LOVE the subject, I talk about it all day research it non stop and have done endless hours of work all year to get my A*(my school is one of the worst in the country so it really was a difficult self study venture). I just don't feel that happy about it though
However, for some reason I just don't think the hardcore academic lifestyle is actually worth it.
IF I come out of Oxford with a top class degree but all my friends outside are playing sports getting girls and having a more natural youthful life id probably be a bit jealous ya know?
I'm not arrogant enough to say I would get accepted, but if I can say confidently in advanced I don't want to go it would save me the stress of applying so I can just have a more fun year.
I'm not disrespecting people that do genuinely want a high stress academic intensive 3 year experience, I'm just trying to set the record straight that that's what it actually is so I don't make a mistaken decision to try and be somewhere that will stop me from being happy
Essentially, I'm saying that I believe a work intensive environment like Oxford makes it difficult to enjoy life unless you really do get off on studying. Feel free to dispute that, that's why I posted
In my opinion, I don't think academic obsession in the most formative years of your life is healthy. The perception I have(and I may be mistaken which is exactly why I'm asking) is that Oxford students work considerably more/harder then others and therefore find it more difficult to have achieve fuffilment in other areas of their life due to The abnormal intensity of their work. In a lot of cases, Oxford graduates do not go on to be highly Succesful rich people or at least not enough so to justify the work they put into their degree. It's one thing to love a subject, it's another to spend the peak years of your youth suffocating yourself with it.
Now, if you turn around and tell me that most people at Oxford are actually very social sporty fun people who breeze through the work then I will apologize.
I'm just asking because I recently achieved a clean slate of A's and A*'s in my a levels and have developed an obsession with politics. I achieved 100%across all my units for it and worked with Zac goldsmith among other things and part of me wants to give Oxford a crack. I LOVE the subject, I talk about it all day research it non stop and have done endless hours of work all year to get my A*(my school is one of the worst in the country so it really was a difficult self study venture). I just don't feel that happy about it though
However, for some reason I just don't think the hardcore academic lifestyle is actually worth it.
IF I come out of Oxford with a top class degree but all my friends outside are playing sports getting girls and having a more natural youthful life id probably be a bit jealous ya know?
I'm not arrogant enough to say I would get accepted, but if I can say confidently in advanced I don't want to go it would save me the stress of applying so I can just have a more fun year.
I'm not disrespecting people that do genuinely want a high stress academic intensive 3 year experience, I'm just trying to set the record straight that that's what it actually is so I don't make a mistaken decision to try and be somewhere that will stop me from being happy
Essentially, I'm saying that I believe a work intensive environment like Oxford makes it difficult to enjoy life unless you really do get off on studying. Feel free to dispute that, that's why I posted
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by nexttime
In case somone out there's actually taking this thread seriously, I'll copy a response I made to another thread:
There are loads of reasons to want to go to Oxford (or Cambridge). I've main a totally not-exhaustive list below, not one of which will be "prestige". They basically all stem from the fact that Oxbridge have way, way more money than any other university.
- College system. Oxbridge is divided into 35ish individual colleges which provides a totally unique social, physical and academic environment. You live in a community of 200-500 students with dedicated college staff etc. Its a way more personal environment than a university of 10,000, and as a result you get:
- Substantially better access to extracurriculars like sports teams. Show me another university that has more than 100 competitive football teams, for instance. And that's not even the sport with the highest participation.
- University societies are also far more broad and active. You get loads of very interesting speaker events, I'd wager significantly more than at other unis.
- Every college has a bar so... access to 30+ subsidised bars.
- Short terms. A disadvantage in some ways but it also means long holidays. Holidays in which you can travel, spend time at home, work a temp job/internship for experience... whatever you want.
- The above also makes it cheap, as you only pay for 26ish weeks accommodation per year.
- Excellent financial support for those that need it.
- Tutorial system. It gives you access to world-leading academics in groups of 4, 2, even 1. That's really not something that exists elsewhere.
- Living and studying in 750+ year old colleges that conference guests pay £200+ per night to stay in.
- A very nice city, imo.
- Probably the best thing: the people you meet. I'm not going to pretend that that's exclusive to Oxford, but generally speaking Oxford attracts some amazing multi-talented people from loads of backgrounds, unified by being way more interested in academia than the people not at Oxford.
There are loads of reasons to want to go to Oxford (or Cambridge). I've main a totally not-exhaustive list below, not one of which will be "prestige". They basically all stem from the fact that Oxbridge have way, way more money than any other university.
- College system. Oxbridge is divided into 35ish individual colleges which provides a totally unique social, physical and academic environment. You live in a community of 200-500 students with dedicated college staff etc. Its a way more personal environment than a university of 10,000, and as a result you get:
- Substantially better access to extracurriculars like sports teams. Show me another university that has more than 100 competitive football teams, for instance. And that's not even the sport with the highest participation.
- University societies are also far more broad and active. You get loads of very interesting speaker events, I'd wager significantly more than at other unis.
- Every college has a bar so... access to 30+ subsidised bars.
- Short terms. A disadvantage in some ways but it also means long holidays. Holidays in which you can travel, spend time at home, work a temp job/internship for experience... whatever you want.
- The above also makes it cheap, as you only pay for 26ish weeks accommodation per year.
- Excellent financial support for those that need it.
- Tutorial system. It gives you access to world-leading academics in groups of 4, 2, even 1. That's really not something that exists elsewhere.
- Living and studying in 750+ year old colleges that conference guests pay £200+ per night to stay in.
- A very nice city, imo.
- Probably the best thing: the people you meet. I'm not going to pretend that that's exclusive to Oxford, but generally speaking Oxford attracts some amazing multi-talented people from loads of backgrounds, unified by being way more interested in academia than the people not at Oxford.
" does being an investment banker provide a good work /life balance"
a.
In case anyone takes this question seriously, I just want to remind you that being an investment banker pays a lot of money, allows you to meet very hard working people and work in capital cities with many attractions
Just trying to show case that you completely missed the point of my question.
Everything you've said is blindingly obvious, that's why it's the top rated university in the world. All these perks come at a price, which is the more intense workload, the self reported average is 40 hours a week which is essentially akin to the most intellecually draining part time job in reality
The purpose of this thread my friend, is to answer
Why would anyone who wants a fun youth take Oxford seriously?
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Mvpmb
To clarify my concerns
In my opinion, I don't think academic obsession in the most formative years of your life is healthy. The perception I have(and I may be mistaken which is exactly why I'm asking) is that Oxford students work considerably more/harder then others and therefore find it more difficult to have achieve fuffilment in other areas of their life due to The abnormal intensity of their work. In a lot of cases, Oxford graduates do not go on to be highly Succesful rich people or at least not enough so to justify the work they put into their degree. It's one thing to love a subject, it's another to spend the peak years of your youth suffocating yourself with it.
Now, if you turn around and tell me that most people at Oxford are actually very social sporty fun people who breeze through the work then I will apologize.
I'm just asking because I recently achieved a clean slate of A's and A*'s in my a levels and have developed an obsession with politics. I achieved 100%across all my units for it and worked with Zac goldsmith among other things and part of me wants to give Oxford a crack. I LOVE the subject, I talk about it all day research it non stop and have done endless hours of work all year to get my A*(my school is one of the worst in the country so it really was a difficult self study venture). I just don't feel that happy about it though
However, for some reason I just don't think the hardcore academic lifestyle is actually worth it.
IF I come out of Oxford with a top class degree but all my friends outside are playing sports getting girls and having a more natural youthful life id probably be a bit jealous ya know?
I'm not arrogant enough to say I would get accepted, but if I can say confidently in advanced I don't want to go it would save me the stress of applying so I can just have a more fun year.
I'm not disrespecting people that do genuinely want a high stress academic intensive 3 year experience, I'm just trying to set the record straight that that's what it actually is so I don't make a mistaken decision to try and be somewhere that will stop me from being happy
Essentially, I'm saying that I believe a work intensive environment like Oxford makes it difficult to enjoy life unless you really do get off on studying. Feel free to dispute that, that's why I posted
In my opinion, I don't think academic obsession in the most formative years of your life is healthy. The perception I have(and I may be mistaken which is exactly why I'm asking) is that Oxford students work considerably more/harder then others and therefore find it more difficult to have achieve fuffilment in other areas of their life due to The abnormal intensity of their work. In a lot of cases, Oxford graduates do not go on to be highly Succesful rich people or at least not enough so to justify the work they put into their degree. It's one thing to love a subject, it's another to spend the peak years of your youth suffocating yourself with it.
Now, if you turn around and tell me that most people at Oxford are actually very social sporty fun people who breeze through the work then I will apologize.
I'm just asking because I recently achieved a clean slate of A's and A*'s in my a levels and have developed an obsession with politics. I achieved 100%across all my units for it and worked with Zac goldsmith among other things and part of me wants to give Oxford a crack. I LOVE the subject, I talk about it all day research it non stop and have done endless hours of work all year to get my A*(my school is one of the worst in the country so it really was a difficult self study venture). I just don't feel that happy about it though
However, for some reason I just don't think the hardcore academic lifestyle is actually worth it.
IF I come out of Oxford with a top class degree but all my friends outside are playing sports getting girls and having a more natural youthful life id probably be a bit jealous ya know?
I'm not arrogant enough to say I would get accepted, but if I can say confidently in advanced I don't want to go it would save me the stress of applying so I can just have a more fun year.
I'm not disrespecting people that do genuinely want a high stress academic intensive 3 year experience, I'm just trying to set the record straight that that's what it actually is so I don't make a mistaken decision to try and be somewhere that will stop me from being happy
Essentially, I'm saying that I believe a work intensive environment like Oxford makes it difficult to enjoy life unless you really do get off on studying. Feel free to dispute that, that's why I posted
We do work harder/more than any other uni bar The Other Place. But that doesn't preclude anyone - let alone EVERYONE - at Oxford from having a very well-rounded, fun uni experience. Almost everyone works hard but plays even harder!
Will type more if needed once more awake
Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by Mvpmb
With the work load, upper class social cliques etc. If your smart wouldnt you just be happier doing well somewhere else and doing just as good in life without the 3 years?
And yet you have a thread:
http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?t=4344748
I'm addicted to academic success but I don't enjoy it
And then you name drop Zac Goldsmith despite your concern about social cliques...
Seems like this is more about you than Oxbridge.
Posted from TSR Mobile
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Mvpmb
Now, if you turn around and tell me that most people at Oxford are actually very social sporty fun people who breeze through the work then I will apologize.
d
Now, if you turn around and tell me that most people at Oxford are actually very social sporty fun people who breeze through the work then I will apologize.
d
Then please apologise.
Everyone is entitled to have an opinion on what is important for them in their life and so are you.
But it seems your opinion was formed by nothing but prejudice and cliche against Oxbridge created by irresponsible media and some people who don't actually have any real life experience at Oxbridge or with people who are/were at Oxbridge.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Mvpmb
" does being an investment banker provide a good work /life balance"
a.
In case anyone takes this question seriously, I just want to remind you that being an investment banker pays a lot of money, allows you to meet very hard working people and work in capital cities with many attractions
Just trying to show case that you completely missed the point of my question.
Everything you've said is blindingly obvious, that's why it's the top rated university in the world. All these perks come at a price, which is the more intense workload, the self reported average is 40 hours a week which is essentially akin to the most intellecually draining part time job in reality
The purpose of this thread my friend, is to answer
Why would anyone who wants a fun youth take Oxford seriously?
a.
In case anyone takes this question seriously, I just want to remind you that being an investment banker pays a lot of money, allows you to meet very hard working people and work in capital cities with many attractions
Just trying to show case that you completely missed the point of my question.
Everything you've said is blindingly obvious, that's why it's the top rated university in the world. All these perks come at a price, which is the more intense workload, the self reported average is 40 hours a week which is essentially akin to the most intellecually draining part time job in reality
The purpose of this thread my friend, is to answer
Why would anyone who wants a fun youth take Oxford seriously?
I provided a multitude of reasons as to why someone might enjoy Oxford over another university. You're welcome.
But I also see your point and realise you have legitimate concerns - your reference to "upper class social cliques" like they actually commonly existed made it seem like you were just here to try to put other people off.
So to answer your concerns: Oxford does not commonly have "upper class social cliques". It has more privately educated students than other universities, but they're still nice, normal people, a bit scared and looking to make friends like everyone else. You hear the occasional anecdote of some rich dickhead at another college wasting money on stupid things or similar, but even if those stories aren't exaggerated, you get state-educated dickheads too. I did not once witness what i would call a "clique" occupied by only rich people in 6 years there.
I also have to say that if you did have some irrational hatred of private school students, you're going to have to go way way down the league table to avoid them in significant numbers. There was of course the famous case of someone writing a rejection letter to Oxford based on, among other things, how she felt the old buildings intimidated state school students and that it was too "middle class". She proceeded to accept her offer to LSE. A university with a higher private school intake where half of the university are so rich they can afford to pay international fees!
The workload is high, but I think the differences between Oxbridge and the universities often considered as an alternative (Imperial, UCL etc) is exaggerated. If you have an image of Oxford students always working and UCL students partying every night then you are wrong. Firstly, UCL students do work hard. Their university wouldn't have such a good reputation if that wasn't the case. Secondly, Oxford students do have fun. The average workload in a self-reported survey was 35-43 hours per week, so less than many people who work full time.
My experience was that most people would have most of the evenings and weekends free, and as mentioned above its a great place to be social in with loads to do. The social context of a small college also brings people close together, further unified by the work-hard-play-harder attitude everyone adopts. There were generally a bunch of people going out clubbing 3x per week. In terms of sport, there were of course the college first VIIIs (rowing) who would train 8x per week so probably averaging 20 hours per week, with people doing university-level sport committing similarly, and they handled that fine. You say "all those perks come at a cost". Well they're run by students for students so I'd argue that all those perks only exist because people have free time to do them!
Now as to your question about "having a fun youth", I think that for someone interested in academia Oxford is in fact one of the funnest places you can be. The people you meet and share the course with are great. But you're question is quite vague... if someone doesn't want to do much work then Oxford is not the place for them, but then neither is UCL or Nottingham or any university with a good reputation. Perhaps try London Met, or just not going to university at all?
tldr: Oxford is hard work, don't get me wrong, but you absolutely are able to have fun and the differences between Oxbridge and other unis are not as big as people would make out.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Mvpmb
To clarify my concerns
In my opinion, I don't think academic obsession in the most formative years of your life is healthy. The perception I have(and I may be mistaken which is exactly why I'm asking) is that Oxford students work considerably more/harder then others and therefore find it more difficult to have achieve fuffilment in other areas of their life due to The abnormal intensity of their work. In a lot of cases, Oxford graduates do not go on to be highly Succesful rich people or at least not enough so to justify the work they put into their degree. It's one thing to love a subject, it's another to spend the peak years of your youth suffocating yourself with it.
Now, if you turn around and tell me that most people at Oxford are actually very social sporty fun people who breeze through the work then I will apologize.
I'm just asking because I recently achieved a clean slate of A's and A*'s in my a levels and have developed an obsession with politics. I achieved 100%across all my units for it and worked with Zac goldsmith among other things and part of me wants to give Oxford a crack. I LOVE the subject, I talk about it all day research it non stop and have done endless hours of work all year to get my A*(my school is one of the worst in the country so it really was a difficult self study venture). I just don't feel that happy about it though
However, for some reason I just don't think the hardcore academic lifestyle is actually worth it.
IF I come out of Oxford with a top class degree but all my friends outside are playing sports getting girls and having a more natural youthful life id probably be a bit jealous ya know?
I'm not arrogant enough to say I would get accepted, but if I can say confidently in advanced I don't want to go it would save me the stress of applying so I can just have a more fun year.
I'm not disrespecting people that do genuinely want a high stress academic intensive 3 year experience, I'm just trying to set the record straight that that's what it actually is so I don't make a mistaken decision to try and be somewhere that will stop me from being happy
Essentially, I'm saying that I believe a work intensive environment like Oxford makes it difficult to enjoy life unless you really do get off on studying. Feel free to dispute that, that's why I posted
In my opinion, I don't think academic obsession in the most formative years of your life is healthy. The perception I have(and I may be mistaken which is exactly why I'm asking) is that Oxford students work considerably more/harder then others and therefore find it more difficult to have achieve fuffilment in other areas of their life due to The abnormal intensity of their work. In a lot of cases, Oxford graduates do not go on to be highly Succesful rich people or at least not enough so to justify the work they put into their degree. It's one thing to love a subject, it's another to spend the peak years of your youth suffocating yourself with it.
Now, if you turn around and tell me that most people at Oxford are actually very social sporty fun people who breeze through the work then I will apologize.
I'm just asking because I recently achieved a clean slate of A's and A*'s in my a levels and have developed an obsession with politics. I achieved 100%across all my units for it and worked with Zac goldsmith among other things and part of me wants to give Oxford a crack. I LOVE the subject, I talk about it all day research it non stop and have done endless hours of work all year to get my A*(my school is one of the worst in the country so it really was a difficult self study venture). I just don't feel that happy about it though
However, for some reason I just don't think the hardcore academic lifestyle is actually worth it.
IF I come out of Oxford with a top class degree but all my friends outside are playing sports getting girls and having a more natural youthful life id probably be a bit jealous ya know?
I'm not arrogant enough to say I would get accepted, but if I can say confidently in advanced I don't want to go it would save me the stress of applying so I can just have a more fun year.
I'm not disrespecting people that do genuinely want a high stress academic intensive 3 year experience, I'm just trying to set the record straight that that's what it actually is so I don't make a mistaken decision to try and be somewhere that will stop me from being happy
Essentially, I'm saying that I believe a work intensive environment like Oxford makes it difficult to enjoy life unless you really do get off on studying. Feel free to dispute that, that's why I posted
People vary and your view what constitutes a 'natural youthful life' is not held by everyone. Setting aside your mildly neo-fascist tone (your Sporting Youth model of society sounds like something from a 1930s Mussolini periodical), there are very solid reasons why it's good to get into an intense academic phase when young - that's also the time when our brains are at peak effectiveness. Most great breakthroughs in all fields are driven by people in their younger years. It's not always the case that university is what brings them on - Einstein produced his greatest insights in his late teens / early 20s outside the university system - but it often is. It's actually the best time to engage in academic study in a creative atmosphere.
You also have a laughably ignorant picture of the mix of people at Oxford - you can relax, because there are a great many people at the university who engage in both competitive and non-competitive physical sports, often to a very high standard. You may have come across some of them on TV - does the 'Boat Race' ring any bells?
Also, please feel reassured that there is no absence of dating and coupling activity within (what you see as) the dismally oppressive portals of Oxford University. Apparently, nerdy, intense students are just as able to have relations as are the strapping brutes who inhabit academia-free sporting clubs.
Original post by Mvpmb
In a lot of cases, Oxford graduates do not go on to be highly Succesful rich people or at least not enough so to justify the work they put into their degree. It's one thing to love a subject, it's another to spend the peak years of your youth suffocating yourself with it.
In a lot of cases, Oxford graduates do not go on to be highly Succesful rich people or at least not enough so to justify the work they put into their degree. It's one thing to love a subject, it's another to spend the peak years of your youth suffocating yourself with it.
It seems to me that this pinpoints your main concern, its motivation, and the answer to it.
You measure a person's success in life principally by the amount of money she makes. This in my opinion is a serious mistake, but in any case if your question ultimately boils down to:
"Is it worth doing more work at Oxford when you could make just as much money having done less work somewhere else, given that you measure success in life only in terms of money?"
then I think the answer is "No."
But (contrary to the implication of your question) that leaves the vast majority of students' justifications for going to Oxford completely untouched.
(It is also simply wrong to think that even a majority of students at Oxford 'suffocate' themselves with their work.)
Original post by Mvpmb
To clarify my concerns
In my opinion, I don't think academic obsession in the most formative years of your life is healthy. The perception I have(and I may be mistaken which is exactly why I'm asking) is that Oxford students work considerably more/harder then others and therefore find it more difficult to have achieve fuffilment in other areas of their life due to The abnormal intensity of their work. In a lot of cases, Oxford graduates do not go on to be highly Succesful rich people or at least not enough so to justify the work they put into their degree. It's one thing to love a subject, it's another to spend the peak years of your youth suffocating yourself with it.
Now, if you turn around and tell me that most people at Oxford are actually very social sporty fun people who breeze through the work then I will apologize.
Essentially, I'm saying that I believe a work intensive environment like Oxford makes it difficult to enjoy life unless you really do get off on studying. Feel free to dispute that, that's why I posted
In my opinion, I don't think academic obsession in the most formative years of your life is healthy. The perception I have(and I may be mistaken which is exactly why I'm asking) is that Oxford students work considerably more/harder then others and therefore find it more difficult to have achieve fuffilment in other areas of their life due to The abnormal intensity of their work. In a lot of cases, Oxford graduates do not go on to be highly Succesful rich people or at least not enough so to justify the work they put into their degree. It's one thing to love a subject, it's another to spend the peak years of your youth suffocating yourself with it.
Now, if you turn around and tell me that most people at Oxford are actually very social sporty fun people who breeze through the work then I will apologize.
Essentially, I'm saying that I believe a work intensive environment like Oxford makes it difficult to enjoy life unless you really do get off on studying. Feel free to dispute that, that's why I posted
Your fundamental premise seems to be that Oxford = work far harder than any other university = lose out on having a "fun" time (eg extra curriculars, socializing) = not worth the trade off because at any rate you won't earn enough after graduation to justify the amount of work.
Personally, I think that's incorrect.
First, you're correct that the workload is intense, and unless one is extremely gifted, most people don't breeze through the work with little effort. The courses are designed to be challenging, and the tutors do expect you to work hard, but they aren't unreasonable. My tutors expected us to consistently achieve at a 2i standard, which is completely doable with a decent but not insane amount of work.
Second, people generally have a "work hard, play harder" mentality. I don't actually know very many Oxonians who literally did nothing but study. Almost everyone gets involved in extra-curricular activities; if anything, it's important to take breaks from studying.
Third, I think you might actually be overestimating how much work you would be doing. Yes, it is a lot of work, but there's definitely ample time left over to socialize and participate in all sorts of activities. You will not, and are not expected to work investment banker hours. As a student, I was involved in plenty of stuff, from chapel choir to dancesport beginners team to volunteering to drama. I also like to think I had a decent social life (met my long-term SO at Oxford), and I graduated with a first class degree. It really isn't as difficult or rare as you might think.
What I tell people is that there is a "minimum amount of work" required to get a 2i (and get the tutors off your back). For Arts students, my guess is that it would probably take you around 30-40 hours each week, depending on how efficient you are. That's more or less like a 9-5 job if you want to take weekends off. If you ask me, I think the opportunity to study at Oxford is worth that trade-off, but perhaps your mileage may vary.
Aside from that, Oxford is as intense as you want it to be work-wise. You can study 60 hours a week and aim to finish every item on your reading list, or you can be like me and work a decent amount but accept that you'll never read everything, and consequently would know less than some of your more hardworking peers. It's just a trade-off.
Fourth, what sort of profession one goes on to after Oxford really depends on the individual. As far as I'm aware though, Oxford is very well represented (over-represented?) in most of the high earning industries (eg law, banking). That being said, there is no free lunch in this world, and the work-life balance for most of these jobs are way, way more atrocious (currently a trainee solicitor, would love to have my student hours back).
However, I can understand where you're coming from. If you honestly do believe that Oxford isn't for you, that's fine. It really isn't for everyone. If you think that the intensity isn't worth it, then go where you think you'd be happiest.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Mvpmb
"
Why would anyone who wants a fun youth take Oxford seriously?
Why would anyone who wants a fun youth take Oxford seriously?
^^^
This is the most fundamental flaw in your opinion.
It's not only Oxbridge, but a sort of people who choose and are able enough to get offer from top universities are usually someone who genuinely love the subject.
So for those people, being able to be taught by some of the top academics in the field in an institute that has some of the best facility to study it among fellow students who are as passionate about and talented in the subject as you is a 'fun.'
So if you think anything academic can not be fun, then probably you'll never understand why your assumption is so wrong.
And all the ex-Oxbridge students I've known over years have also enjoyed a lot of non-academic fun there, too.
Work hard and play hard is what Oxbridge students do. And that demands a good deal of self-discipline and time-management skill. And that's one of the biggest asset they gain by spending a few years of their life at an intensive environment like Oxbridge (and other top universities), which make many of them very reliable, hard working people who don't buckle too easily under pressure. And also they know how to have fun.
I'm saying this as an ex-City worker who was involved in recruiting staff, too.
Also, measuring a success by amount of money you may earn is also so wrong as well.
Original post by vincrows
^^^
This is the most fundamental flaw in your opinion.
It's not only Oxbridge, but a sort of people who choose and are able enough to get offer from top universities are usually someone who genuinely love the subject.
So for those people, being able to be taught by some of the top academics in the field in an institute that has some of the best facility to study it among fellow students who are as passionate about and talented in the subject as you is a 'fun.'
So if you think anything academic can not be fun, then probably you'll never understand why your assumption is so wrong.
And all the ex-Oxbridge students I've known over years have also enjoyed a lot of non-academic fun there, too.
Work hard and play hard is what Oxbridge students do. And that demands a good deal of self-discipline and time-management skill. And that's one of the biggest asset they gain by spending a few years of their life at an intensive environment like Oxbridge (and other top universities), which make many of them very reliable, hard working people who don't buckle too easily under pressure. And also they know how to have fun.
I'm saying this as an ex-City worker who was involved in recruiting staff, too.
Also, measuring a success by amount of money you may earn is also so wrong as well.
This is the most fundamental flaw in your opinion.
It's not only Oxbridge, but a sort of people who choose and are able enough to get offer from top universities are usually someone who genuinely love the subject.
So for those people, being able to be taught by some of the top academics in the field in an institute that has some of the best facility to study it among fellow students who are as passionate about and talented in the subject as you is a 'fun.'
So if you think anything academic can not be fun, then probably you'll never understand why your assumption is so wrong.
And all the ex-Oxbridge students I've known over years have also enjoyed a lot of non-academic fun there, too.
Work hard and play hard is what Oxbridge students do. And that demands a good deal of self-discipline and time-management skill. And that's one of the biggest asset they gain by spending a few years of their life at an intensive environment like Oxbridge (and other top universities), which make many of them very reliable, hard working people who don't buckle too easily under pressure. And also they know how to have fun.
I'm saying this as an ex-City worker who was involved in recruiting staff, too.
Also, measuring a success by amount of money you may earn is also so wrong as well.
You're now on PRSOM too. Stupid TSR rules
Original post by Estreth
It seems to me that this pinpoints your main concern, its motivation, and the answer to it.
You measure a person's success in life principally by the amount of money she makes. This in my opinion is a serious mistake, but in any case if your question ultimately boils down to:
"Is it worth doing more work at Oxford when you could make just as much money having done less work somewhere else, given that you measure success in life only in terms of money?"
then I think the answer is "No."
But (contrary to the implication of your question) that leaves the vast majority of students' justifications for going to Oxford completely untouched.
(It is also simply wrong to think that even a majority of students at Oxford 'suffocate' themselves with their work.)
You measure a person's success in life principally by the amount of money she makes. This in my opinion is a serious mistake, but in any case if your question ultimately boils down to:
"Is it worth doing more work at Oxford when you could make just as much money having done less work somewhere else, given that you measure success in life only in terms of money?"
then I think the answer is "No."
But (contrary to the implication of your question) that leaves the vast majority of students' justifications for going to Oxford completely untouched.
(It is also simply wrong to think that even a majority of students at Oxford 'suffocate' themselves with their work.)
Excellent post. Its easy to forget that the most common career for an Oxford graduate is teacher. Second biggest sector is health and social care (despite the med school being very small).
https://www.ox.ac.uk/admissions/undergraduate/why-oxford/after-oxford/graduate-destinations?wssl=1
(edited 7 years ago)
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