This really baffles me...
Let's look at the facts about medicine:
- Thousands of people apply to do it, it is the single most competitive course in the country. Many of these people genuinely want to help people, however many applicants are motivated by the money.
- Only a fractions of applicants will get a place onto the course. The people that get places are not necessarily the ones who are most suited for the job. The ones motivated by money will make less caring doctors and waste government funded training.
- Doctors are still paid 6-figure salaries once they specialise, even though there is such a large supply of people who would do medicine even if it paid alot less.
So why are doctors still paid so much? Basic supply and demand states that when supply increases, price decreases. However the government still pays doctors high salaries even though there are many people not getting places into medicine, who would be willing to do the job without the motivation of money. I know that doctors undoubtedly deserve their wages, but if they were paid less we would only get applicants who want to do medicine for the right reasons.
- Thousands of people apply to do it, it is the single most competitive course in the country. Many of these people genuinely want to help people, however many applicants are motivated by the money.
- Only a fractions of applicants will get a place onto the course. The people that get places are not necessarily the ones who are most suited for the job. The ones motivated by money will make less caring doctors and waste government funded training.
- Doctors are still paid 6-figure salaries once they specialise, even though there is such a large supply of people who would do medicine even if it paid alot less.
So why are doctors still paid so much? Basic supply and demand states that when supply increases, price decreases. However the government still pays doctors high salaries even though there are many people not getting places into medicine, who would be willing to do the job without the motivation of money. I know that doctors undoubtedly deserve their wages, but if they were paid less we would only get applicants who want to do medicine for the right reasons.
(edited 12 years ago)
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Original post by like a boss
Let's look at the facts about medicine:
- Thousands of people apply to do it, it is the single most competitive course in the country. Many of these people genuinely want to help people, however many applicants are motivated by the money.
- Only a fractions of applicants will get a place onto the course. The people that get places are not necessarily the ones who are most suited for the job. The ones motivated by money will make less caring doctors and waste government funded training.
- Doctors are still paid 3-figure salaries once they specialise, even though there is such a large supply of people who would do medicine even if it paid alot less.
So why are doctors still paid so much? Basic supply and demand states that when supply increases, price decreases. However the government still pays doctors high salaries even though there are many people not getting places into medicine, who would be willing to do the job without the motivation of money. I know that doctors undoubtedly deserve their wages, but if they were paid less we would only get applicants who want to do medicine for the right reasons.
- Thousands of people apply to do it, it is the single most competitive course in the country. Many of these people genuinely want to help people, however many applicants are motivated by the money.
- Only a fractions of applicants will get a place onto the course. The people that get places are not necessarily the ones who are most suited for the job. The ones motivated by money will make less caring doctors and waste government funded training.
- Doctors are still paid 3-figure salaries once they specialise, even though there is such a large supply of people who would do medicine even if it paid alot less.
So why are doctors still paid so much? Basic supply and demand states that when supply increases, price decreases. However the government still pays doctors high salaries even though there are many people not getting places into medicine, who would be willing to do the job without the motivation of money. I know that doctors undoubtedly deserve their wages, but if they were paid less we would only get applicants who want to do medicine for the right reasons.
£100! God I love these 3 figure salaries...
Original post by TooSexyForMyStethoscope
£100! God I love these 3 figure salaries...
Lol, this.
Original post by TooSexyForMyStethoscope
£100! God I love these 3 figure salaries...
Come on, be serious!
It could be as much as £999.
Also, you could never sustain a long term oversupply because it costs so much to train a doctor. Although, that doesn't stop predictions of an oversupply of 20 000 junior doctors in upcoming years.
Haha, because it would be immoral to distinguish between applicants by seeing if they are willing to do it for less money than they deserve! Anyway, from what I've seen nearly all of the applicants for medicine are actually motivated by the job, and whether they'd be suited for it or not is a different issue but they all want to help people. Also, with the grades you have to work to get in, you could easily do something like banking and make a lot more money for similarly high stress levels.
Original post by Tyraell
Come on, be serious!
It could be as much as £999.
Also, you could never sustain a long term oversupply because it costs so much to train a doctor. Although, that doesn't stop predictions of an oversupply of 20 000 junior doctors in upcoming years.
It could be as much as £999.
Also, you could never sustain a long term oversupply because it costs so much to train a doctor. Although, that doesn't stop predictions of an oversupply of 20 000 junior doctors in upcoming years.
I've heard the opposite...that soon 60% of all doctors will be Consultants and the NHS wage bill will go through the roof. I believe they are looking a grading senior posts, so rather than every 35 year old with a CCT being a Consultant (on a Consultant's salary) you have a formal system of specialty doctors with the top level not being reached till your 50ish.
Basically the training system doesn't work. But it never has...
It takes an awfully long time for doctors in the NHS to get up to a 6 figure salary! With The Agenda for Change scheme the highest pay point is actually £97,500 but I believe long serving consultants reach 6 figures. As a newly qualified doctor however you only get about £5000 more than a newly qualified nurse.
Original post by like a boss
Let's look at the facts about medicine:
- Thousands of people apply to do it, it is the single most competitive course in the country. Many of these people genuinely want to help people, however many applicants are motivated by the money.
- Only a fractions of applicants will get a place onto the course. The people that get places are not necessarily the ones who are most suited for the job. The ones motivated by money will make less caring doctors and waste government funded training.
- Doctors are still paid 6-figure salaries once they specialise, even though there is such a large supply of people who would do medicine even if it paid alot less.
So why are doctors still paid so much? Basic supply and demand states that when supply increases, price decreases. However the government still pays doctors high salaries even though there are many people not getting places into medicine, who would be willing to do the job without the motivation of money. I know that doctors undoubtedly deserve their wages, but if they were paid less we would only get applicants who want to do medicine for the right reasons.
- Thousands of people apply to do it, it is the single most competitive course in the country. Many of these people genuinely want to help people, however many applicants are motivated by the money.
- Only a fractions of applicants will get a place onto the course. The people that get places are not necessarily the ones who are most suited for the job. The ones motivated by money will make less caring doctors and waste government funded training.
- Doctors are still paid 6-figure salaries once they specialise, even though there is such a large supply of people who would do medicine even if it paid alot less.
So why are doctors still paid so much? Basic supply and demand states that when supply increases, price decreases. However the government still pays doctors high salaries even though there are many people not getting places into medicine, who would be willing to do the job without the motivation of money. I know that doctors undoubtedly deserve their wages, but if they were paid less we would only get applicants who want to do medicine for the right reasons.
Trouble is...though there may be a surplus of doctors taken as a whole, there aren't enough doctors at the needed grade in the right places. Look at Belfast's A&E departments for example.
In order to attract doctors, trusts need to offer competitive payment packages. Doctors in the UK aren't paid that much relative to countries like Australia. There is a danger that all these doctors which the state has spent thousands on training...will just leave.
It costs roughly £250 a day to keep someone in hospital, so even forking out £100,000 for a competent clinician works out pretty economically over a large time period.
Original post by Mero8
Haha, because it would be immoral to distinguish between applicants by seeing if they are willing to do it for less money than they deserve! Anyway, from what I've seen nearly all of the applicants for medicine are actually motivated by the job, and whether they'd be suited for it or not is a different issue but they all want to help people. Also, with the grades you have to work to get in, you could easily do something like banking and make a lot more money for similarly high stress levels.
That is simply how the market works. The government has interfered by setting doctor's salaries themselves, because they think this is 'immoral'. That is what is causing this massive excess of supply. Classic government failure.
Some of those applicants and medical students who are "only in it for the money" tend to find out that there are easier ways of making money than doing medicine. Plus, those 6 figure salaries that people talk about are only seen by certain doctors, many do not manage to get a consultant post or rather they choose not to.
Original post by like a boss
Let's look at the facts about medicine:
- Thousands of people apply to do it, it is the single most competitive course in the country. Many of these people genuinely want to help people, however many applicants are motivated by the money.
- Only a fractions of applicants will get a place onto the course. The people that get places are not necessarily the ones who are most suited for the job. The ones motivated by money will make less caring doctors and waste government funded training.
- Doctors are still paid 6-figure salaries once they specialise, even though there is such a large supply of people who would do medicine even if it paid alot less.
So why are doctors still paid so much? Basic supply and demand states that when supply increases, price decreases. However the government still pays doctors high salaries even though there are many people not getting places into medicine, who would be willing to do the job without the motivation of money. I know that doctors undoubtedly deserve their wages, but if they were paid less we would only get applicants who want to do medicine for the right reasons.
- Thousands of people apply to do it, it is the single most competitive course in the country. Many of these people genuinely want to help people, however many applicants are motivated by the money.
- Only a fractions of applicants will get a place onto the course. The people that get places are not necessarily the ones who are most suited for the job. The ones motivated by money will make less caring doctors and waste government funded training.
- Doctors are still paid 6-figure salaries once they specialise, even though there is such a large supply of people who would do medicine even if it paid alot less.
So why are doctors still paid so much? Basic supply and demand states that when supply increases, price decreases. However the government still pays doctors high salaries even though there are many people not getting places into medicine, who would be willing to do the job without the motivation of money. I know that doctors undoubtedly deserve their wages, but if they were paid less we would only get applicants who want to do medicine for the right reasons.
I think its to deter graduates from going off to the private sector or even working at another country. But personally I don't think money is as big a influencing factor in those applying to medicine than the job security of being a doctor and the prestige.
The demand for medical care already far outstrips the amount able to be supplied, and medicine being a special industry we want to attempt to provide for as much demand as possible. Hence we need to increase the amount of people doing medicine and thus the supply of medical care by having incentives to join, which include wage.
Original post by Bubble87
It takes an awfully long time for doctors in the NHS to get up to a 6 figure salary! With The Agenda for Change scheme the highest pay point is actually £97,500 but I believe long serving consultants reach 6 figures. As a newly qualified doctor however you only get about £5000 more than a newly qualified nurse.
Agenda for change does not apply to medics or dentists. An F1's salary with added pay for overtime and unsociable hours is approximately £12,000 more than a nurse starting on the wards.
As it should be however, you have to take into account the difficulty of the job, length of training, responsibility etc
Because doctors are not paid that much compared to how much hassle they have to go through to get there. People think doctors are on £100 000+ but that is not the case at all. It takes 15 years after medical school to get fully qualified in some specialities and it takes enormous amounts of commitment and hard work to into medical school in the first place, to reduce wages would be wrong.Someone that goes into banking for example is probably on an intellectual level with someone than goes into medicine but they only do a three year degree and can earn 6/7 figure salary within a few years.
I personally think that anyone that understands the NHS pay scale fully would be deterred from medicine if they were if they were only in it for the money and otherwise they would be in for a rude awakening.
I personally think that anyone that understands the NHS pay scale fully would be deterred from medicine if they were if they were only in it for the money and otherwise they would be in for a rude awakening.
Original post by like a boss
Let's look at the facts about medicine:
- Thousands of people apply to do it, it is the single most competitive course in the country. Many of these people genuinely want to help people, however many applicants are motivated by the money.
- Only a fractions of applicants will get a place onto the course. The people that get places are not necessarily the ones who are most suited for the job. The ones motivated by money will make less caring doctors and waste government funded training.
- Doctors are still paid 6-figure salaries once they specialise, even though there is such a large supply of people who would do medicine even if it paid alot less.
So why are doctors still paid so much? Basic supply and demand states that when supply increases, price decreases. However the government still pays doctors high salaries even though there are many people not getting places into medicine, who would be willing to do the job without the motivation of money. I know that doctors undoubtedly deserve their wages, but if they were paid less we would only get applicants who want to do medicine for the right reasons.
- Thousands of people apply to do it, it is the single most competitive course in the country. Many of these people genuinely want to help people, however many applicants are motivated by the money.
- Only a fractions of applicants will get a place onto the course. The people that get places are not necessarily the ones who are most suited for the job. The ones motivated by money will make less caring doctors and waste government funded training.
- Doctors are still paid 6-figure salaries once they specialise, even though there is such a large supply of people who would do medicine even if it paid alot less.
So why are doctors still paid so much? Basic supply and demand states that when supply increases, price decreases. However the government still pays doctors high salaries even though there are many people not getting places into medicine, who would be willing to do the job without the motivation of money. I know that doctors undoubtedly deserve their wages, but if they were paid less we would only get applicants who want to do medicine for the right reasons.
Because the NHS is nationalised, not a business. It doesn't follow the market or the laws of supply and demand
Original post by Arekkusu
I know bugger-all about becoming a doctor but I have to say I just love TooSexyForMyStethoscope's username.
They're paid well because of the hours, because of the length of training, because of research and teaching opportunities which they could do instead.
As for applicants being suited to the job, I think most successful applicants will because of the work experience requirement and use of interviews.
As for applicants being suited to the job, I think most successful applicants will because of the work experience requirement and use of interviews.
There probably aren't the resources to train such an increase in the number of medical graduates. That could mean doctors become less skilled, or that you start getting unemployment in medical graduates (which is a huge waste of money).
Plus, the government aren't simply going to let the NHS become destabilised by market forces. They want to avoid a situation where more doctors simply leave the country. Medicine is expensive, not just for the country in terms of training, but also for the student. Whilst some might claim that they aren't motivated by money, it is a factor that will become more important to us in the long term.
Plus, the government aren't simply going to let the NHS become destabilised by market forces. They want to avoid a situation where more doctors simply leave the country. Medicine is expensive, not just for the country in terms of training, but also for the student. Whilst some might claim that they aren't motivated by money, it is a factor that will become more important to us in the long term.
I always thought doctors have a decent wage because they train for such a long time and are expected to do so much work but also are in a position of responsibility that they could easily abuse (e.g. Harold Shipman) so giving them a decent pay package would deter them (although I would doubt many of these kinds of people would be accepted into medicine in the first place)
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