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Reply 40
Student2806


:toofunny:
Reply 41
Tefhel
Are people not allowed to complain about it? Complaining has nothing whatsoever to do with asking for free speech to be taken away. If someone took a huge dump on a photo of your dead grandma, are you not allowed to tell them off or ask for an apology because you don't want 'to sacrifice their rights to free speech'? No, of course not :rolleyes:


Of course people are right to complain all they want. But they are not right to demand an apology. They are not right to demand censorship.

Why? Because their demands are unjustified. If you are a religious person who is prone to being insulted, then don't watch comedy shows, they're not for you, seriously. Don't complain about something that you need not subject yourself to, and don't demand what you are NOT rationally entitled to.
Reply 42
Pheylan
lolol it was a great episode


Indeed it was!
I think you're moronic for having such a narrow-minded opinion of religious people.
Reply 44
Phugoid
My description of faith is spot on. Faith is a result of NOT approaching the issue of religion and God with a rational and scientific mind and method. Sure, you can be a world class scientist and have faith, but you can NOT be a world class scientist and have faith if you have approached the issue of religion with a rational and scientific method.
Why?

Lol, by 'common sense' do you mean 'acknowledgement of the fact the religious people are so deluded by their foul beliefs that they are known to become unnecessarily violent and unjustifiably activist over any mention of their religion in a negative light'.
Again, you are lumping the likes of the WI in with Jihadists.

You people continue to mention that urinating on a picture of Christ is 'disrespectful' as if that's an inherently bad thing. Disrespect is not an inherently bad thing - it depends on the notion which is being disrespected. If I disrespect, say, Nick Griffin and BNP policy, then that's brilliant, because disrespect is exactly what is deserved by those things. If I disrespect, say, a man who loses his life in trying to save his loved ones, then that's clearly undeserved disrespect. If I disrespect religion, however, it falls into the same category as disrespecting the BNP. It's bloody well fine.
How can you compare Christianity with the BNP, I think its quite evident you know nothing about religion and just have some huge chip on your shoulder.

Secondly, he was not URINATING on a picture of Christ in the sense that he seen it, lay it down on the floor, whipped out his member and aimed right for the crown of thorns. It was SPLASHBACK... it's hardly the biggest marker of disrespect that could be imagined.
I know that, but the discussion began with people assuming the former and not the latter so we shall continue with the former.
I think it's calling for more compassion than anything, and I don't think compassion towards people, whether or not you believe them to be 'moronic', costs much. Is compassion so hard to express towards those you disagree with? Apparently so.

On another subject, many Christians I know are not easily offended about their beliefs as they have learned to just take it. As have I, at least to some extent, because I understand how sensitive people are about relgious issues, especially those who do not follow one.

Good grief, why on earth are you so angry?
Reply 46
That a really disrespectful thing to do.
If some who does like football ***** on the MAN UNI flag I don't think the fans would like his actions no matter what he does or does not think of football. Moreover that's not freedom of expression; that mocking others opinions.
Reply 47
Renner
Why?


What do you mean 'why?'. Why what? Why is it clear that religious people have not followed a rational method in approaching their religion?

Because there's no convincing evidence, that's why.

Again, you are lumping the likes of the WI in with Jihadists.


No, I'm really not.

How can you compare Christianity with the BNP, I think its quite evident you know nothing about religion and just have some huge chip on your shoulder.


I didn't compare Christianity to the BNP. What I was saying was that it's FINE to disrespect some things because some things don't deserve respect - they haven't earned it. Christianity hasn't earned respect for a variety of reasons, and the BNP hasn't earned respect for a variety of reasons. Some of these reasons are the same, some are not.

I know that, but the discussion began with people assuming the former and not the latter so we shall continue with the former.


Only a religious person could acknowledge that he was wrong, but still not admit it.

But aye, for the sake of comedy, let's assume that Larry David did purposefully piss all over a portrait of 'Christ' on TV. So what?
Reply 48
Phugoid
What do you mean 'why?'. Why what? Why is it clear that religious people have not followed a rational method in approaching their religion?

Because there's no convincing evidence, that's why.
There is evidence is in the scriptures, the evidence is in thousands of years and majority belief, the evidence is in the world around us, there is no evidence against god. Evidence, or lack of, is down to the individual.

No, I'm really not.

You believe religious people, in the main, react violently when people oppose there religion. This is not true, the majority are not violent (as there religion tells them) and there are many high end Christians who will happily enter debate with any high end atheist.


I didn't compare Christianity to the BNP. What I was saying was that it's FINE to disrespect some things because some things don't deserve respect - they haven't earned it. Christianity hasn't earned respect for a variety of reasons, and the BNP hasn't earned respect for a variety of reasons. Some of these reasons are the same, some are not.
Just because you don’t respect something doesn’t give you free reign to **** all over it. Christianity is an idea; it cannot really be respected or disrespected. People who are Christians do not deserve to be **** on by the likes of yourself for no good reason.


Only a religious person could acknowledge that he was wrong, but still not admit it.

But aye, for the sake of comedy, let's assume that Larry David did purposefully piss all over a portrait of 'Christ' on TV. So what?
I knew he didn’t piss on the picture, I always knew he didn’t piss on the picture, but for the purposes of the discussion he did.
I don't even get why they'd be offended by it. And I don't get why Muslims are offended by drawings of Muhammad. Yes, they think it's wrong and sinful but they should stay out of other people's sinning unless it actually harms someone.
Reply 50
Renner
There is evidence is in the scriptures, the evidence is in thousands of years and majority belief, the evidence is in the world around us, there is no evidence against god. Evidence, or lack of, is down to the individual.


Lol, no, evidence is not down to the 'individual'. There are standards of evidence that are acceptable, and there are standards of evidence that are unacceptable, and that is the cornerstone of modern science that has taken us so far in the past few centuries.

Majority belief is CERTAINLY not evidence, that's just plain stupid and you're showing your true colours by stating that. Majority belief was once that the earth was flat and situated at the centre of the universe, and this was also written in rather a lot of scriptures. Guess what. It's not true, and there was never any evidence to suggest that it was.

As for there not being evidence against God... who cares. We don't need any. The lack of evidence FOR God is enough to dismiss claims that he exists, because they are founded without evidence! There's no evidence that it's not Allah rather than Yahweh. There's no evidence that it's not Ganesha and Vishnu, rather than Allah. There's no evidence that it's not the Flying Spaghetti Monster, rather than Thor. There's no evidence against lots of things, but that doesn't mean you're justified in believing them.

You believe religious people, in the main, react violently when people oppose there religion. This is not true, the majority are not violent (as there religion tells them) and there are many high end Christians who will happily enter debate with any high end atheist.


I never said anything other than that? I was merely pointing out that I can't see any reason why it would be 'common sense' not to put this episode on the TV, and I can only conclude that you're attempting to be threatening. "Look at what the muslims would do to you if you put it on about them... it's common sense not to do it."

Just because you don’t respect something doesn’t give you free reign to **** all over it. Christianity is an idea; it cannot really be respected or disrespected. People who are Christians do not deserve to be **** on by the likes of yourself for no good reason.


Ideas can be respected and disrespected, and that too is the cornerstone of the thinking that has allowed science to get us to where we are today. If science offered the same level of respect (zero) to every hypothesis that came along, then we'd be exactly where we were 2000 years ago - nowhere. Science works on the basis of respecting/disrespecting an idea proportionally to the amount of evidence it has in its favour, and that method has worked for us for centuries. The idea that the universe started around 14 billion years ago as a single point with infinite density is a respectable idea because there are masses of evidence behind it. The idea that the universe started around 10,000 years ago when a man in the sky created it for a laugh... is a ridiculous idea because there's no evidence behind it, and such an idea should be shown nothing but disrespect.

An idea deserves respect if it has acceptable standards of evidence in its favour, if it makes predictions with great accuracy and explains observation with great accuracy. If an idea does none of these things, it is useless in uncovering the truth about the universe, and in the case of Christianity, it's also useless as a moral guide.

If 'ideas' are independent of the notion of 'respect', then are you saying that the policies of the BNP don't deserve to be disrespected? Do you think Genocide is an idea that should be free from disrespect? Don't be stupid. Ideas are as subject to respect and disrespect as anything else.

And no, you're right. Just because I don't disrespect Christianity doesn't mean I can **** all over. Free speech is what gives me that right and opportunity, and I feel rationally justified in doing so.

You people, who are complaining about this, also have the right to free speech, but you are NOT rationally justified in your complaints.

I knew he didn’t piss on the picture, I always knew he didn’t piss on the picture, but for the purposes of the discussion he did.


Lol what?

'Let's assume something that isn't true for the sake of having something to complain about.'

Morons.
Reply 51
Oh Please. Middle America hates gays, Muslims, Jews, Arabs and most others. Don't cry about mocking Christians when the people complaining preach far worse hate.
Reply 52
Nick_000
Oh Please. Middle America hates gays, Muslims, Jews, Arabs and most others. Don't cry about mocking Christians when the people complaining preach far worse hate.


Indeed. I'd be willing to bet that if Larry David was a southern man with Christian parents, there wouldn't be a word said about it.

But he's of Jewish descent, and that's where the outrage probably comes from.
Nick_000
Oh Please. Middle America hates gays, Muslims, Jews, Arabs and most others. Don't cry about mocking Christians when the people complaining preach far worse hate.

Oh please, this is simply not true, I know as I bloody well live in the States!

Those types of Americans are the ones the media shows you, and you're dumb enough to believe it, but the typical American is NOT like that.
Reply 54
pocketfulofposy
Oh please, this is simply not true, I know as I bloody well live in the States!

Those types of Americans are the ones the media shows you, and you're dumb enough to believe it, but the typical American is NOT like that.


Middle America doesn't equal the typical American. Middle America is terminology for the well to do American Middle Class (who are the one's complaining) who usually hold traditionally conservative views on subjects like morality, family values, immigration, homosexuality and so on.
Reply 55
Phugoid
People can complain 'til they're blue in the face, but it isn't justified in the slightest. As I have said, over the past years religious have shown continuously that they are constantly offended by things on TV, things on the radio, things in books, things on the internet, and things non-religious people say in conversation. If it is clearly the religious people do not agree with any of these things then why do they persist in watching them?

You know, Anton LaVey wrote a book called the Satanic Bible, and that is, in essence what it was. Now people would look at the word 'Satanic' and run a mile, but if you actually look at the list of rules within the Satanic Bible, some of them make a lot of sense. Would you like to hear one of my favourites? Here it is:

DO NOT COMPLAIN ABOUT THAT WHICH YOU NEED NOT SUBJECT YOURSELF TO.

Oh and yes, I am bitter and hateful. But again, being bitter and hateful aren't inherently bad things, it depends on what you're bitter and hateful about. I'm hateful of the BNP and bitter about the fact that they gained two seats in the EP. I'm hateful of murderers and rapists and bitter about the easy time they have with our broken justice system. I'm hateful of religion, and I'm bitter about the fact that people all over the world are deluded by this nonsense and I have to put up with them.


Satanic Bible was a good read, i like Levey he was less of an idiot than most people.

However the flaw with that rule is you cant see the future or know what it will come to, should I now stop talking to everyone in the world, because one day someone could say something that offends me.

Do you argue that I therefore have no right to complain about anything anyone says to me because I subjected myself to social interaction,?

the same applies to watching TV and this case in specific.
Reply 56
pocketfulofposy
Oh please, this is simply not true, I know as I bloody well live in the States!

Those types of Americans are the ones the media shows you, and you're dumb enough to believe it, but the typical American is NOT like that.


I beg to differ, massively.
Nick_000
Middle America doesn't equal the typical American. Middle America is terminology for the well to do American Middle Class (who are the one's complaining) who usually hold traditionally conservative views on subjects like morality, family values, immigration, homosexuality and so on.


I live within one of the most affluent Middle Class areas of the USA and I know no-one like what you are describing!
Reply 58
Phugoid
Yes, and I do remember what happened after the cartoons of Muhammed. Muslims went out and started murdering people in riots, firebombing embassies, and putting fatwas on the heads of cartoonists.

I also remember what happened to Theo van Gogh after releasing his 10 minute video about women in Islam called 'Submission'. He was shot 8 times in the middle of the street, followed by being nearly decapitated, stabbed multiple times and having a 5 page note pinned to his torso with a knife - a note that listed a bunch of people who would be future targets for this particularly irate muslim.

I also remember what happened when Salman Rushdie published a FICTIONAL NOVEL called the Satanic Verses which had a less-than-friendly depiction of Islam. He had a Fatwa put on his head by powerful Islamic officials and had to live in hiding for a decade.

But I think we'll both agree that the BAD guys in these stories are not the artists. The bad guys in these stories are the religious nutjobs who went about murdering people for no good reason.

So why even bother suggesting that it's unfair that Islam doesn't get offended as much? First of all, it isn't true. Islam is constantly depicted in a negative light in comedy. Secondly, even if it was true, it would be for all the wrong reasons.

If you want Christianity to be free from criticism, then I suggest you follow the methods of Islam, and revert back to Christianity as it was during most of the last century - an evil, murderous tirade against innocents.



Brilliant post.
Reply 59
Phugoid
Lol, no, evidence is not down to the 'individual'. There are standards of evidence that are acceptable, and there are standards of evidence that are unacceptable, and that is the cornerstone of modern science that has taken us so far in the past few centuries.

Majority belief is CERTAINLY not evidence, that's just plain stupid and you're showing your true colours by stating that. Majority belief was once that the earth was flat and situated at the centre of the universe, and this was also written in rather a lot of scriptures. Guess what. It's not true, and there was never any evidence to suggest that it was.

As for there not being evidence against God... who cares. We don't need any. The lack of evidence FOR God is enough to dismiss claims that he exists, because they are founded without evidence! There's no evidence that it's not Allah rather than Yahweh. There's no evidence that it's not Ganesha and Vishnu, rather than Allah. There's no evidence that it's not the Flying Spaghetti Monster, rather than Thor. There's no evidence against lots of things, but that doesn't mean you're justified in believing them.
But religion and science are not comparable, they are two separate fields. Religion is a set of moral beliefs and a world view by which people live there lives, modern progressive religious sects such as the CofE do not dispute science but works alongside it.



I never said anything other than that? I was merely pointing out that I can't see any reason why it would be 'common sense' not to put this episode on the TV, and I can only conclude that you're attempting to be threatening. "Look at what the muslims would do to you if you put it on about them... it's common sense not to do it."
I don’t have much money so I could rob a bank but common sense tells me not to as there would be repercussions. Similar situation, the makers of this show knew showing this would cause a huge hassle and media storm and could lower ratings so I wouldn’t show it. That really has nothing to do with religion

Lol what?

'Let's assume something that isn't true for the sake of having something to complain about.'

Morons.
Seeing as your so keen on science, have you never heard ‘for the purposes of this demonstration blah is blah’ or ‘assume the object is a single particle and air resistance doesn’t apply (A-level maths ftw)’

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