It often occurs, that in smaller school...such as mine...a lot of the lessons instead of being based on your ability are mixed at random.
This is fine to an extent on some subjects. But I sometimes find that the "lesser abled" students hold me back.
I was speaking to a teacher about this situation and he agrees. There are a vast majority of people with different abilities henceforth affecting the classes overall progress.
He suggested that he found it preferential for schools to split into Grammar and Secondary modern. As he had previously taught at a Grammar and went himself and found that students integrate better with other students of the same ability.
Although I don't feel how clever you are determines how clever your friends will be. But To be honest...I couldn't agree more, that students who are capable are able to do more when surrounded by other capable students.
I used to live not so far away from an area where the grammar school and secondary modern school situation was still at hand. It worked well I think. The majority of the kids at the grammar school were able to do well. And those who wanted to at the secondary modern could too. It wasn't as strict as the old fashion rules. Entry to the grammar was reasonably flexible to get in. And there wasn't the belief that the secondary modern students couldn't recieve the grades, they could.
But still theres that old prejudice, that if you didn't get into the grammar and were still extremely capable, being in a secondary modern environment may not be beneficial.
Also they're used to be be (and still is...I took it to attend a private school) the problem of the 11+. The examination to get into the grammar. From what I've gathered the 11+ for the majority of grammar schools has been abolished with private systems. But this was always a big deal...between the sec mod and grammar.
What does anyone else think? I reasonably like the idea...however I agree its not perfect. Thought?
Well Grammar schools still exist, but now comp students have a right to go on to further education if they become capable a bit later on... I don't really see a problem with that, it's fairer. xD
Perhaps make the 11+ more accessable, at my primary school we were never offered it, so this way bright students can realise their potential and be pushed.
It often occurs, that in smaller school...such as mine...a lot of the lessons instead of being based on your ability are mixed at random.
This is fine to an extent on some subjects. But I sometimes find that the "lesser abled" students hold me back.
I was speaking to a teacher about this situation and he agrees. There are a vast majority of people with different abilities henceforth affecting the classes overall progress.
He suggested that he found it preferential for schools to split into Grammar and Secondary modern. As he had previously taught at a Grammar and went himself and found that students integrate better with other students of the same ability.
Although I don't feel how clever you are determines how clever your friends will be. But To be honest...I couldn't agree more, that students who are capable are able to do more when surrounded by other capable students.
I used to live not so far away from an area where the grammar school and secondary modern school situation was still at hand. It worked well I think. The majority of the kids at the grammar school were able to do well. And those who wanted to at the secondary modern could too. It wasn't as strict as the old fashion rules. Entry to the grammar was reasonably flexible to get in. And there wasn't the belief that the secondary modern students couldn't recieve the grades, they could.
But still theres that old prejudice, that if you didn't get into the grammar and were still extremely capable, being in a secondary modern environment may not be beneficial.
Also they're used to be be (and still is...I took it to attend a private school) the problem of the 11+. The examination to get into the grammar. From what I've gathered the 11+ for the majority of grammar schools has been abolished with private systems. But this was always a big deal...between the sec mod and grammar.
What does anyone else think? I reasonably like the idea...however I agree its not perfect. Thought?
I did the 11 plus and go to a grammar school. I'm in favour of keeping the system (we still have it here in NI but it's officially being/been abolished) but obviously I'm biased. Personally I think it's a much fairer system than private schools where entrance is based on money rather than ability?
Well, going to a grammar school myself, I'm probably biased, but when I hear about the English system on the TV it seems mad. I'd rather go to school based on my ability rather than where I lived, I like our system as it is.
The only place that didn't abolish them was Essex
I GO TO ONE.
and if you reply saying "i go to __ grammar school" outside essex, say, manchester or kent or something, it's actually a private grammar school which though required the 11+ isn't counted as a grammar school in the same sense
I went to a grammar school in kent, and actually it isn't a private grammar school.
There are loads of state grammar schools where I live, and the comprehensives get so much money pumped into them its rediculous. We had to raise our own money via sponsored walks etc to buy bike sheds, whereas one of the local comprehensives had a whole sports athletic track and olympic pool built from them paid off the state.
The only place that didn't abolish them was Essex
I GO TO ONE.
and if you reply saying "i go to __ grammar school" outside essex, say, manchester or kent or something, it's actually a private grammar school which though required the 11+ isn't counted as a grammar school in the same sense
That's a load of rubbish. There are 164 state grammar schools left dotted around the country. There are more in Kent (33) than any other county — there are only four in Essex.
That's a load of rubbish. There are 164 state grammar schools left dotted around the country. There are more in Kent (33) than any other county — there are only four in Essex.
There are more than 4 in Essex.
I went to one and it was good - they really benefit people I think. My parents would never have afforded a private school, and the local comps were pretty terrible. They should restore them across the country and let those who have the ability and want to learn get on, regardless of their wealth.
I agree. People should be tested at the age of 11 and sent to a school with others of their ability. Ideally there would be at least 2 tiers, if not three. Teaching to achieve a certain level of A-C grades, or a certain number of passes is never going to benefit the most able. Plato advocates this idea in his Republic, that children from a young age should be split into three categories, the most able, the fairly able, and those of low ability. Those of the highest ability should be taught to the highest standards, while those of the lowest ability would learn a craft, or whatever they are good at. The current system here is inadequate.
Well Grammar schools still exist, but now comp students have a right to go on to further education if they become capable a bit later on... I don't really see a problem with that, it's fairer. xD
Perhaps make the 11+ more accessable, at my primary school we were never offered it, so this way bright students can realise their potential and be pushed.
Imo segregating children on how they perform on one day at the age of 11 is stupid, maybe at 13 or later it could work. Where I live there are grammar schools but no 11+, you take entrance exams and your SATs are completely inconsequencial. This way, it's the children whose parents know the ins and outs of the system who get into the "best" schools, not the brightest ones regardless of background. I went to a average comp, personally I didn't give a **** how "bright" the other people in my year were as long as I had the same access to facilities and teaching that other schools have, which due to this whole two tier system in place where I live I didn't. Either way, I learnt a lot, in life you're gonna have to deal with people who are a lot dumber or waaay cleverer than you.
Great for the people that get into grammar school. Sucks for those that don't - in a massive way. I think secondary modern would be a sure way to stamp out a lot of the ambition/prospects people have and secure lower achievements.
I agree though, it drives me insane that I'm in the same class with people who got U's at AS and take literally 10 times longer than me to understand things - it holds the higher ability people back.
Well Grammar schools still exist, but now comp students have a right to go on to further education if they become capable a bit later on... I don't really see a problem with that, it's fairer. xD
Perhaps make the 11+ more accessable, at my primary school we were never offered it, so this way bright students can realise their potential and be pushed.
I very much agree with this, I was the only student at my primary school to take the 11+ and I don't believe that there was much awareness about other oppurtunities outside the local comprehensive.
Having said that, by continuing the grammar school system, it could mean that talented kids that develop later are lost in the comprehensive system. I would be more in favour of improving comprehensives to the standard of grammars and private schools, but I realise thats somewhat unlikely.
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