[awm55]

(Original post by DarkWhite)
As has been said, that's low, not lowest. 1 is the lowest positive integer; 3 is just a low positive integer.

I see nothing wrong with the UK or the US in terms of access to HE, and to be perfectly honest, I'd say that they're the same as a result.

Access to HE is concerned with financial access, demonstrating ability to obtain an offer, and competition. We're concerned specifically with poor people, so financial access it is. Both countries I'd hazard a guess at saying are pretty much equal in this regard, as both offer student loans, only the US tends to have more university-offered scholarships, whilst we have student grants.

see the other article i posted, or perhaps do your own research, its a well known fact

[iwilson03]

(Original post by awm55)
the US and the UK were at the bottom, the article was from 2005 and mobility was static in the USA and declining in the UK...do the math

So? That doesn't mean anything without context. Who is to say what has happened in the years after 2005? What was the effect of the recession? What if the UK had a better starting position and so the decline actually did more to level the two countries off? And what is the actual level of decline? How is it been defined?

[miloscruggs]

(Original post by Aeolus)
In the USA you are rewarded for your effort and not punished for your success. In the UK a large portion of your effort is taken away and given to those who refuse to try as hard or find themselves in a more unfortunate position. This in itself encourages mediocrity and laziness. That is not an oppurtunity to excel or to be excellent. Jobseekers allowance for instance is now £58 a week.

I refuse to take that point seriously, because I'm proud of the fact that we have a government that cares for those who fall upon hard times. Especially so now that we're in the longest recession in which we've ever found ourselves.

Also, £58 a week for JSA? Hardly generous. Hardly enough to convince myself, and many I know, to drop their plans of a successful career in order to reach the dizzying heights of the lifestyle offered by £58 a week.

[paperclip]

The UK as it has greater access to healthcare, housing and education.

[Witty Username]

(Original post by calamityx)
US .. in terms of collegeapps yep..especially if you are black/latino and have lower sat scores it will not ruin chances at all..and the universities there are very generous on grants and scholarships. I know ucas has this refugee thing but other than that not much that I know of..as in in higher ed. Should that poor person get seriously ill however.. US health care have leaves much to be desired..

[awm55]

(Original post by iwilson03)
So? That doesn't mean anything without context. Who is to say what has happened in the years after 2005? What was the effect of the recession? What if the UK had a better starting position and so the decline actually did more to level the two countries off? And what is the actual level of decline? How is it been defined?

the recession? the UK is the only developed country still in a recession! stop trying to prove me wrong, look at the other article I posted which states it explicitly.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/7607895.stm

[Edamame]

Neither...

[iwilson03]

(Original post by awm55)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/7607895.stm

"issues of social equality when she's part of government that has been in power for over 11 years, presiding over a 900,000 growth in the number of people living in severe poverty and over a country that has the lowest social mobility in the developed world "

better?

Well actually not really lol. That comment is from an opposition member, it has no data backing the statement that we are at the 'lowest' point and indeed all the other evidence that we have seen shows that we are 'low' but not 'lowest'.

You really cannot take the opinions of Conservative opposition politicians as established fact...

[iwilson03]

(Original post by awm55)
the recession? the UK is the only developed country still in a recession! stop trying to prove me wrong, look at the other article I posted which states it explicitly.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/7607895.stm

The USA is still very damaged economically, try comparing unemployment rates and realise that there is more than one factor governing 'success'..

and see my response to that article.

[miloscruggs]

Another testament to the successes of social mobility in the US is the fact that nearly 20% of its population couldn't afford access to basic healthcare, and an attempt to tackle this met fierce opposition.

[awm55]

(Original post by miloscruggs)
Another testament to the successes of social mobility in the US is the fact that nearly 20% of its population couldn't afford access to basic healthcare, and an attempt to tackle this met fierce opposition.

I have experienced the healthcare system in the UK and it was frightening. I am actually scared to get sick there, seriously.

[iwilson03]

(Original post by awm55)
I have experienced the healthcare system in the UK and it was frightening. I am actually scared to get sick there, seriously.

Really? What was so terrible?

Anyway the point is that there is a service which is free to all. You don't have to use it, you can go private. However if you fall on hard times you will not be left without healthcare. Thats a pretty big bonus imo.

[coldfusion]

UK by far. If you're poor and have no credit (most probably), you can't take a loan and full grants that gets you all tuition and living expenses covered in the US is very rare, you'd really have to be a genius to get the scholarships. In the UK you can pretty much always get to uni level.

[awm55]

(Original post by iwilson03)
The USA is still very damaged economically, try comparing unemployment rates and realise that there is more than one factor governing 'success'..

and see my response to that article.

please, it is well known the UK got hit the hardest by far by the recession. do some research, i don't have time to search for articles when all you have to do is google it for yourself.

[Witty Username]

(Original post by awm55)
I have experienced the healthcare system in the UK and it was frightening. I am actually scared to get sick there, seriously.

Whar happened? On the contrary I have experienced healthcare in the USA, found the system to be frightning and I'm now quite scared to get sick there!
With underlying heath problems it would be nigh impossible for me to get insurance cover, at least in the UK it's possible to get that basic level of cover and then pay extra if you want to go private

[doggyfizzel]

(Original post by awm55)
the US and the UK were at the bottom, the article was from 2005 and mobility was static in the USA and declining in the UK...do the math

Definitely a bias opinion!

I'm not 100% sure how the US education system works but I would say the UK; as in both countries everyone gets to go to school and has the ability to go on to uni, but uni in the US is much more expensive, unless you get a scholarship which only a select few can, plus I know the poorer you are the more money the UK government/uni will throw at you if you go to uni.

[awm55]

(Original post by coldfusion)
UK by far. If you're poor and have no credit (most probably), you can't take a loan and full grants that gets you all tuition and living expenses covered in the US is very rare, you'd really have to be a genius to get the scholarships. In the UK you can pretty much always get to uni level.

then why is more of the US's population educated to degree level?

[HDS]

To Excel - The US
To Move Poor ---> Average - The UK

[awm55]

(Original post by Witty Username)
Whar happened? On the contrary I have experienced healthcare in the USA, found the system to be frightning and I'm now quite scared to get sick there!
With underlying heath problems it would be nigh impossible for me to get insurance cover, at least in the UK it's possible to get that basic level of cover and then pay extra if you want to go private

says the girl with the USSR flag...

[Witty Username]

(Original post by awm55)
says the girl with the USSR flag...

Oh that, just picked a random flag- forgot it was there!