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redbuthotter
thats fair enough.... but bear in mind that athlete had to cut to 85 and probs could CnJ 220 in training.

Also out of such a big population.... with or without gene doping I'm pretty sure we could produce a super heavy, they just aren't winning medals yet. The same thing with running, I know most people doubt chinese could win 100m, but somewhere down the line if we focus on it, we should get it eventually. Chinese people are naturally weak.... 50 years ago our CnJ were less than the presses of most countries. I personally think that winning 100m will be more difficult than producing a lifter who can CnJ 260kg.... purely down to the fact the athletics system is a joke atm... sports cheif just doesn't care that much about it.
i just dont see it happening if a 6ft 3 and 20 stone bloke went to china he'd be looked upon like godzillal....a lot of bouncers are that big....plus a few others are just around town on saturday night...they're v ery rare to have a chinese person that big...not that rare in nortern europe....now the likes of savickas and terry hollands are rare in europe and i just cant see any chinese people being that big particularly in terms of thickness... giantism dont count.....sprinting isn't going to happen either....long legs narrow hips and silly percentage of fast twitch fibres...chinese generally have wide hips and short legs which is good for gymnastics...plus being short....bolts changed how people see sprinting...tallers athletes definitely have the advantage
I see what your saying and it will be incredibly difficult... but like I said out of such a large population there will be some who are gifted enough to train..... would you have believed that a chinese man would beat a black man in hurdles? (he's 6"2) we have tall people and strong... we just need to find the right combo... and if not some day maybe engineer it, like those black super slaves, but in a lab. Obviously its just speculation... and lol at 20 stone bloke in china... hong kong is where tiny people are at :wink: where the average male weighs around 60kg. Your right its not natural.... but I think your wrong about it being impossible. We'll see what happens at 2012 eh.

Hugh-Jackman
i just dont see it happening if a 6ft 3 and 20 stone bloke went to china he'd be looked upon like godzillal....a lot of bouncers are that big....plus a few others are just around town on saturday night...they're v ery rare to have a chinese person that big...not that rare in nortern europe....now the likes of savickas and terry hollands are rare in europe and i just cant see any chinese people being that big particularly in terms of thickness... giantism dont count.....sprinting isn't going to happen either....long legs narrow hips and silly percentage of fast twitch fibres...chinese generally have wide hips and short legs which is good for gymnastics...plus being short....bolts changed how people see sprinting...tallers athletes definitely have the advantage
redbuthotter
I see what your saying and it will be incredibly difficult... but like I said out of such a large population there will be some who are gifted enough to train..... would you have believed that a chinese man would beat a black man in hurdles? (he's 6"2) we have tall people and strong... we just need to find the right combo... and if not some day maybe engineer it, like those black super slaves, but in a lab. Obviously its just speculation... and lol at 20 stone bloke in china... hong kong is where tiny people are at :wink: where the average male weighs around 60kg. Your right its not natural.... but I think your wrong about it being impossible. We'll see what happens at 2012 eh.
110h is a very technical event...lui xiang is about a 10.3 100m runner....million miles away from 9.6....there is 15yr old kids running 10.3 in jamaica.....i agree its a possibility one day...a rare one though.....out of curiosity do you know the best deadlift and squat by a chinese person?
I'll have a look.. I was trying to find the biggest CnJ... but thats actually very difficult to track down... will have to use chinese search engines later.
oh he's a hurdler...i knew there was a chinese sprinter who was destined for gold a few years back but then came up with cramp or some shiz.....can't remember who mind you :frown:.
Well weight lifters and body builders are more often than not, obese.

Betchya didn't know that :yes:
Reply 46
FluxD
Entirely depends on what you define strength as.

Boom.

That and most strength is acquired/specific strength.

There is no reliable way of saying who is stronger.

It's like saying who is faster? Bolt or some marathon runner? over what distance?
Reply 47
I'm a weak weightlifter, my cousins an international gymnast. We went to his gym together and I could lift at least 40kg more than him on the main lifts (squat, bench, dead). With dips and chinups he beat me - but I was still strong enough to do a few of each. His coach told me that most of gymnastics is technique - brute force doesn't make world champions.

So, from my first hand experience I;d say weightlifters are stronger. Taking strength as 'the most lifted' rather than 'the most times lifted'.
Reply 48
Pound for pound gymnasts trounce all other athletes. Objectively though, weightlifters are going to be stronger.
Reply 49
SpamBa
Pound for pound gymnasts trounce all other athletes. Objectively though, weightlifters are going to be stronger.


In what way?

And how do you know?

And I disagree; but lets see what you have to say.
How exactly are we defining pound for pound? By Sinclair, ratio or who is better at gymnastics? Obviously the latter favours gymnasts and obviously the former favours weightlifters. Ratio is just stupid for anything.

It's a silly question - WLers are better at WLing, gymnasts are better at gymnastics. FluxD and Adonis are right.
this should be funny
Reply 52
Take out the skill equation, and get them both to apply maximal force to something, and measure it. Both gymnastics and Olympic weightlifting is HIGHLY specialised. Get them to do a leg press and/or teach them both to deadlift and see who is stronger.

I bet I know who wins.
yap... if im honest I was bored last night and just wanted to see people explain why one is stronger than the other.
Reply 54
SpamBa
Pound for pound gymnasts trounce all other athletes. Objectively though, weightlifters are going to be stronger.

forgetting that

C&P because I cba to type it myself;

This is because the formula ignores one fundamental law of physics, that being that volume (and therefore mass & weight) increases by the cube of the scale factor rather than the square of the scale factor.

BOOM
SMed
Take out the skill equation, and get them both to apply maximal force to something, and measure it. Both gymnastics and Olympic weightlifting is HIGHLY specialised. Get them to do a leg press and/or teach them both to deadlift and see who is stronger.

I bet I know who wins.

Better idea: find a bunch of WLers and gymnasts that weigh the same and put them in a strongman competition.

My guess is
1st place: WLers
2nd place: ambulance guys
3rd place: gymnasts
DNF: gymnasts' spines
The scale factor being? Height?

Adonis
forgetting that

C&P because I cba to type it myself;

This is because the formula ignores one fundamental law of physics, that being that volume (and therefore mass & weight) increases by the cube of the scale factor rather than the square of the scale factor.

BOOM
Reply 57
Adonis
forgetting that

C&P because I cba to type it myself;

This is because the formula ignores one fundamental law of physics, that being that volume (and therefore mass & weight) increases by the cube of the scale factor rather than the square of the scale factor.

BOOM


That noise is the sound of my brain exploding, you're talking to someone who scraped GCSE physics.

I think you could train gymnasts to deadlift an awful lot relative to their bodyweight. But I don't think you could ever teach a weightlifter how to do this
Reply 58
SpamBa
That noise is the sound of my brain exploding, you're talking to someone who scraped GCSE physics.

I think you could train gymnasts to deadlift an awful lot relative to their bodyweight. But I don't think you could ever teach a weightlifter how to do this


Because doing 'that' is strong? wtf?

One reason a gymnast could deadlift a decent amount is because they're all 4'10" and the range of motion is 6".

I'm with George. Make them both do strongman style events.
the thing with gymnast is ill watch em on the rings and think how amazingly muscular they are particularly their delts....then once they've finished a decrepid old official thats about 5ft 8 will pick them up no problem and it just reminds me of gandolf picking up a hobbit....i then just cant take them serious

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