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Reply 100
It depends what you mean by comparing yourself with others.

I certainly think there is a need for it in some ways.
crana9
It depends what you mean by comparing yourself with others.

I certainly think there is a need for it in some ways.



ok then, but i really do not see a point in doing so. i understand what you mean by being able to get a job etc by getting a better grade, if that is what you call how they mark degrees!, but really if you need a 2.1 then you should do it for yourself, i still dont see a need for comparison.
Reply 102
I didn't actually call it a better grade. You puzzle me.

I'll give you an example:
I observe the other people in my supervision groups and compare myself to them, and I also swap essays etc. with friends (not for plagiarism!) and compare their essays on a topic/in general with mine. I also look at other peoples' lab writeups and techniques.

This can:
a) Act as a progress check. Phew, I'm about the same standard as most of the others in my college - I'm probably doing about the right amount of work (for me) to keep my head above water. Even though I feel like I'm finding everything impossibly difficult, it's obvious that a lot of other people I know are as well - we're in the same position, more or less, and I know I'm not actually about to fail.

Since the exams are marked by you being in competition with the others (rather than criterion referencing) it's more important for you to know how you're doing relative to everyone else than it is, for example, with A-levels (criterion-referenced)

b) Let me pick up on their strengths and weaknesses compared to my own. Hmm, so-and-so always does this annoying thing in her essays. Oops, I do that too, to a greater or lesser degree. I better stop doing that.

Or... So-and-so always seems so well prepared for supervisions, much more than me. I would probably benefit if I tried to be as well prepared as she is. I'm going to spend longer reading through stuff in advance now.

Comparing yourself to others in petty ways (She got 2% more than me on that essay! OH EM GEE!) is not the same.
Reply 103
Just out of interest are there people who obviously stand out as being super geniuses (genii?) I remember a lot of people going on about some maths genius at oxford, I think hes a fellow at Keble now. But what about other subjects like history/SPS. And if so, does anyone know who they are and what it feels like to be one of the top, if not the top.
Reply 104
visesh
He got a first:biggrin:

Sweet, give him my congrats when you next see him. :smile:

A.
Reply 105
adampogonowski
ok then, but i really do not see a point in doing so. i understand what you mean by being able to get a job etc by getting a better grade, if that is what you call how they mark degrees!, but really if you need a 2.1 then you should do it for yourself, i still dont see a need for comparison.

We had a discussion a while ago on TSR about which subjects in Cambridge employed relative marking. I know the first two years of Natsci does and all of compsci and, if my memory serves me correctly, a current law student indicated that it was also relatively marked. That means you are in very real competition and comparison with the other students. You may not feel the need to compare, but others will.

A.
crana9
I didn't actually call it a better grade. You puzzle me.

I'll give you an example:
I observe the other people in my supervision groups and compare myself to them, and I also swap essays etc. with friends (not for plagiarism!) and compare their essays on a topic/in general with mine. I also look at other peoples' lab writeups and techniques.

This can:
a) Act as a progress check. Phew, I'm about the same standard as most of the others in my college - I'm probably doing about the right amount of work (for me) to keep my head above water. Even though I feel like I'm finding everything impossibly difficult, it's obvious that a lot of other people I know are as well - we're in the same position, more or less, and I know I'm not actually about to fail.

Since the exams are marked by you being in competition with the others (rather than criterion referencing) it's more important for you to know how you're doing relative to everyone else than it is, for example, with A-levels (criterion-referenced)

b) Let me pick up on their strengths and weaknesses compared to my own. Hmm, so-and-so always does this annoying thing in her essays. Oops, I do that too, to a greater or lesser degree. I better stop doing that.

Or... So-and-so always seems so well prepared for supervisions, much more than me. I would probably benefit if I tried to be as well prepared as she is. I'm going to spend longer reading through stuff in advance now.

Comparing yourself to others in petty ways (She got 2% more than me on that essay! OH EM GEE!) is not the same.



ok now i understand you - thanks!

so why are the exams marked in comparison to others'?
Alaric
We had a discussion a while ago on TSR about which subjects in Cambridge employed relative marking. I know the first two years of Natsci does and all of compsci and, if my memory serves me correctly, a current law student indicated that it was also relatively marked. That means you are in very real competition and comparison with the other students. You may not feel the need to compare, but others will.

A.



oh ok thanks! can you explain why it is marked in this way then? rather than based on criterion?
Reply 108
In case anybody has taken what i have said the wrong way, I do not want to constantly compete with others and have no burning desire to be some kind of genius who gets in the top 5 in the year for every single paper etc. I am going to university purely for myself and the experience, something i just felt might be ruined slightly by feeling significantly inferior to everyone else there. Sorry if I offended anyone.
Reply 109
Everyone I know goes through a phase of feeling inferior, whether it be in their first term or in the middle of 2nd year (when I really hit mine). But you're not. It's just odd being average when you're used to flying high.
Reply 110
Helenia
Everyone I know goes through a phase of feeling inferior, whether it be in their first term or in the middle of 2nd year (when I really hit mine). But you're not. It's just odd being average when you're used to flying high.


thanks for the reassurance. Average in Cambridge seems like a pretty damn enviable position to me... :smile:
Reply 111
adampogonowski
ok now i understand you - thanks!

so why are the exams marked in comparison to others'?


Sorry if I was misleading - I thought all the exams were marked how mine are, but it appears from what Alaric says that some are criterion-referenced.

I don't know why they do it that way.

One suggestion is that it helps to avoid grade inflation.
Reply 112
crana9
I didn't actually call it a better grade. You puzzle me.

I'll give you an example:
I observe the other people in my supervision groups and compare myself to them, and I also swap essays etc. with friends (not for plagiarism!) and compare their essays on a topic/in general with mine. I also look at other peoples' lab writeups and techniques.

This can:
a) Act as a progress check. Phew, I'm about the same standard as most of the others in my college - I'm probably doing about the right amount of work (for me) to keep my head above water. Even though I feel like I'm finding everything impossibly difficult, it's obvious that a lot of other people I know are as well - we're in the same position, more or less, and I know I'm not actually about to fail.

Since the exams are marked by you being in competition with the others (rather than criterion referencing) it's more important for you to know how you're doing relative to everyone else than it is, for example, with A-levels (criterion-referenced)

b) Let me pick up on their strengths and weaknesses compared to my own. Hmm, so-and-so always does this annoying thing in her essays. Oops, I do that too, to a greater or lesser degree. I better stop doing that.

Or... So-and-so always seems so well prepared for supervisions, much more than me. I would probably benefit if I tried to be as well prepared as she is. I'm going to spend longer reading through stuff in advance now.

Comparing yourself to others in petty ways (She got 2% more than me on that essay! OH EM GEE!) is not the same.

Well said. :smile:
Reply 113
Niccolo
I'll apologize in advance in case this pisses anyone off, but ive made my offer for history at jesus fairly comfortably and was feeling pretty proud of myself, but the other day an obese friend of mine (who got DDDC and is going to northampton, despite being fairly intelligent) said with obvious relish, 'haha, you're going to go from being at the top of our school (an average-ish non-selective liverpool comp) to academically weaker than most other people at cambridge. Now you'll know how I felt!' I realise the whopper was probably just trying to wind me up, but does anyone who goes there/is going think that i will actually be at a significant disadvantage compared to other students who have been to better schools? I got AAAAa in History, Politics, Spanish and general studies and English AS and got over 95% of the UMS marks available in each subject overall, but I realise that there are other people who will have done more subjects etc. Also, due to adolescent laziness my GCSEs were 4A*s, 3As and 2Bs (I know they're pretty good but in Cambridge terms only average). Will most other people be significantly stronger than me academically? (I realise that a conclusive answer cannot be drawn from this limited info, but your thoughts would help).

Cheers, I know i'm an insecure bastard. sorry. I just want to enjoy my time and not feel stupid.



Ok, well I havent read the whole thread but I've been looking forwards for ages to being average or even in the lower half of my class. Constantly being seen as 'the clever one' can get pretty boring, plus not having enough competition in class or people who want to discuss the topics was annoying. So I'm really excited to be going somewhere where I'm likely to just be normal academically, and also where there will be so many people who are enthusiastic and good at their subjects that you can learn from.

Also, I dont think the better/worse school thing will matter - cam was looking for potential, right?

Dont worry!

Em

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