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The Indie/Alternative Society

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    (Original post by there's too much love)
    No crime. Friendly. Has vegan food on site (only during the festival).
    It's really funny, lots of dancing, no-one caring if you look stupid or not.
    Lots of nice indie pop and twee.

    And it's cheap!

    There's also almost no litter.


    I've never been to a festival before, I really should go to one sometime.
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    not trying to hate on this thread but there were good bands before radiohead you know...noone has mentioned

    the smiths
    R.E.M.
    stone roses
    Jesus and mary chain
    sonic youth
    dinosaur jr
    Hüsker Dü
    pixies
    MBV


    I mean I suppose this thread is for more modern stuff but so much of the modern stuff...what exactly is alternative about it? it's not loud or aggressive, or even really got a point to make, it's just indie landfill.

    loads of it is also on major labels so it isn't even technically indie. most of the songs are just about girls or getting drunk/stoned etc. not exactly challenging the audience.

    p.s neg me all you want I know it's such a hipster post to make but it had to be done...
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    (Original post by Jim_Reid)
    not trying to hate on this thread but there were good bands before radiohead you know...noone has mentioned

    the smiths
    R.E.M.
    stone roses
    Jesus and mary chain
    sonic youth
    dinosaur jr
    Hüsker Dü
    pixies
    MBV


    I mean I suppose this thread is for more modern stuff but so much of the modern stuff...what exactly is alternative about it? it's not loud or aggressive, or even really got a point to make, it's just indie landfill.

    loads of it is also on major labels so it isn't even technically indie. most of the songs are just about girls or getting drunk/stoned etc. not exactly challenging the audience.

    p.s neg me all you want I know it's such a hipster post to make but it had to be done...
    Since when did indie mean loud or aggressive?

    http://grooveshark.com/#!/s/To+The+E...o/3KzQKO?src=5







    :holmes: Your move.
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    not their best song but i like it lots today
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    (Original post by Jim_Reid)
    not trying to hate on this thread but there were good bands before radiohead you know...noone has mentioned

    the smiths
    R.E.M.
    stone roses
    Jesus and mary chain
    sonic youth
    dinosaur jr
    Hüsker Dü
    pixies
    MBV


    I mean I suppose this thread is for more modern stuff but so much of the modern stuff...what exactly is alternative about it? it's not loud or aggressive, or even really got a point to make, it's just indie landfill.

    loads of it is also on major labels so it isn't even technically indie. most of the songs are just about girls or getting drunk/stoned etc. not exactly challenging the audience.

    p.s neg me all you want I know it's such a hipster post to make but it had to be done...
    don't worry, you don't come across as hipster, more entirely mainstream.
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    (Original post by 1:03)
    don't worry, you don't come across as hipster, more entirely mainstream.
    (Original post by there's too much love)
    Since when did indie mean loud or aggressive? :holmes: Your move.
    well I listened to that stuff and, the first one was just a little embarrassing to watch. the other 2, while I guess they were well put together and had some variety, but to me they were pure pop music, there wasn't enough bite in it. I couldn't really tell you what the lyrics were about after just 1 listen of them though.

    not saying all music needs to be loud and aggressive, the smiths, R.E.M, Stone roses etc weren't but they were still great. the smiths especially, Morrissey was singing about stuff that was taboo or challenging old beliefs. R.E.M was in a way but sometimes the lyrics just make no sense.

    these bands just seem to be singing pop music (nothing wrong with that) but then trying to pass it off as alternative to gain "cred". they aren't challenging their audience at all, it's just very sweetly sung songs. what makes it alternative?

    also for the guy who said the stuff I posted is entirely mainstream. to be honest if it was i'd be so happy. literally none of the people on my course and in my flat have even heard of the smiths, let alone Jesus and Mary chain, dino jr, Husker du etc
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    (Original post by Jim_Reid)
    well I listened to that stuff and, the first one was just a little embarrassing to watch. the other 2, while I guess they were well put together and had some variety, but to me they were pure pop music, there wasn't enough bite in it. I couldn't really tell you what the lyrics were about after just 1 listen of them though.

    not saying all music needs to be loud and aggressive, the smiths, R.E.M, Stone roses etc weren't but they were still great. the smiths especially, Morrissey was singing about stuff that was taboo or challenging old beliefs. R.E.M was in a way but sometimes the lyrics just make no sense.

    these bands just seem to be singing pop music (nothing wrong with that) but then trying to pass it off as alternative to gain "cred". they aren't challenging their audience at all, it's just very sweetly sung songs. what makes it alternative?

    also for the guy who said the stuff I posted is entirely mainstream. to be honest if it was i'd be so happy. literally none of the people on my course and in my flat have even heard of the smiths, let alone Jesus and Mary chain, dino jr, Husker du etc
    mainstream in regards to people who have an interest in music,

    also you're entirely correct, those bands are entirely pop.
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    WU LYF ARE THE MOST IMPORTANT THING TO HAPPEN TO MUSIC. EVER.
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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxuDoYhQI2o

    <3
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    (Original post by Jim_Reid)
    well I listened to that stuff and, the first one was just a little embarrassing to watch. the other 2, while I guess they were well put together and had some variety, but to me they were pure pop music, there wasn't enough bite in it. I couldn't really tell you what the lyrics were about after just 1 listen of them though.

    not saying all music needs to be loud and aggressive, the smiths, R.E.M, Stone roses etc weren't but they were still great. the smiths especially, Morrissey was singing about stuff that was taboo or challenging old beliefs. R.E.M was in a way but sometimes the lyrics just make no sense.

    these bands just seem to be singing pop music (nothing wrong with that) but then trying to pass it off as alternative to gain &quot;cred&quot;. they aren't challenging their audience at all, it's just very sweetly sung songs. what makes it alternative?

    also for the guy who said the stuff I posted is entirely mainstream. to be honest if it was i'd be so happy. literally none of the people on my course and in my flat have even heard of the smiths, let alone Jesus and Mary chain, dino jr, Husker du etc

    (Original post by 1:03)
    mainstream in regards to people who have an interest in music,

    also you're entirely correct, those bands are entirely pop.
    They're indie pop/twee.

    OR can inide only mean inide rock? :lolwut: .

    And yes, everything you posted was mainstream.
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    Little obsessed with this song as well

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    (Original post by there's too much love)
    They're indie pop/twee.

    OR can inide only mean inide rock? :lolwut: .

    And yes, everything you posted was mainstream.
    not really bothered if it is considered mainstream or not but if it was so mainstream then people would of heard of it whenever music is talked about.

    I couldn't say how many people iv'e met, got onto the subject of music...told them some of those bands I listed and them having never heard of any of it. if people generally haven't heard of it, it can't be that mainstream.

    id say stuff like jessie j, pitbull, katy perry, LMFAO etc is mainstream.

    my bloody valentine and the Jesus and Mary chain aren't exactly played on radio 1 every day. the bands I mentioned might get played on radio 6 once a week if you're lucky...

    meanwhile stuff like noah and the whale gets constant airplay...i've seen them on the tv on adverts. they are described as indie but "indie" was never meant to be about selling millions of records or an image/brand but sadly this is what it's come to...
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    (Original post by Jim_Reid)
    not really bothered if it is considered mainstream or not but if it was so mainstream then people would of heard of it whenever music is talked about.

    I couldn't say how many people iv'e met, got onto the subject of music...told them some of those bands I listed and them having never heard of any of it. if people generally haven't heard of it, it can't be that mainstream.

    id say stuff like jessie j, pitbull, katy perry, LMFAO etc is mainstream.

    my bloody valentine and the Jesus and Mary chain aren't exactly played on radio 1 every day. the bands I mentioned might get played on radio 6 once a week if you're lucky...

    meanwhile stuff like noah and the whale gets constant airplay...i've seen them on the tv on adverts. they are described as indie but "indie" was never meant to be about selling millions of records or an image/brand but sadly this is what it's come to...
    so out of touch it's unreal.
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    (Original post by Jim_Reid)
    not really bothered if it is considered mainstream or not but if it was so mainstream then people would of heard of it whenever music is talked about.

    I couldn't say how many people iv'e met, got onto the subject of music...told them some of those bands I listed and them having never heard of any of it. if people generally haven't heard of it, it can't be that mainstream.

    id say stuff like jessie j, pitbull, katy perry, LMFAO etc is mainstream.

    my bloody valentine and the Jesus and Mary chain aren't exactly played on radio 1 every day. the bands I mentioned might get played on radio 6 once a week if you're lucky...

    meanwhile stuff like noah and the whale gets constant airplay...i've seen them on the tv on adverts. they are described as indie but "indie" was never meant to be about selling millions of records or an image/brand but sadly this is what it's come to...

    So to you something is only mainstream if it's only currently in the charts?

    I suppose you think Belle & Sebastian is terribly underground?
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    (Original post by Jim_Reid)

    also for the guy who said the stuff I posted is entirely mainstream. to be honest if it was i'd be so happy. literally none of the people on my course and in my flat have even heard of the smiths, let alone Jesus and Mary chain, dino jr, Husker du etc
    erm I think those are like just not mainstream chart music, I mean they're not very modern there kind of eighties classics. If you liked it back then it would probably be mainstream, so maybe it is 'alternative' now?
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    uhhhh...this is why I didn't want post. I should of kept my big mouth shut.
    it's causing arguments. im not gonna post again it just seems pointless.

    I don't think belle and Sebastian are underground but if you asked the average man in the street he's probably never heard of them so to him they might as well be. I know a little about music so to me they are not underground but I know they're not well known. not like oasis or something. probably bigger in america than here though.

    I can't be bothered arguing about if the music I like is mainstream or not. were they played on commercial radio stations back in their day? mostly not. did they sell millions of records? nope. has anyone I know heard of them? nope. they aren't like oasis where everyone knows the words.

    I don't know what seems to qualify a band as alternative in your books. they have to be basically unheard, unsigned, played 2 gigs in their whole existence, print their own records in their front rooms, dress with Morrissey glasses, skinny jeans, messed up hair, be white and skinny, possibly with a female singer, studied some arts degree at a university, who's members work in a coffee shop or a library, be straight edge vegan and sing songs about having sex with all your friends and then being upset because they all hate each other for it.

    and the fact you regard me to be out of touch is nice for me. im not the only person who thinks most modern music is lacking, to me it lacks edge, it is not aggressive enough, loud enough or has anything relevant to say. im starting a band after I finish uni and by the sound of it we will be very different to what people are listening to these days. hopefully most people will hate us. that way we know we're on the right path. it's going to be like dinosaur jr on steroids. but not metal.

    that's my last post anyway...ultimately (rightly or wrongly) I associate alternative to mean music holding values alternative to the mainstream and/or music you would hear and consider not to have mainstream appeal. screaming feedback was never going to have a truly mass market so to me it is alternative. people singing twee songs, to be honest I don't see why it needs to be classified as indie or alternative when pop would suffice.

    awaiting the negs for this now....................im not responding either way so say any demeaning and derivative comments you want
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    An argument about what constitutes 'mainstream' was inevitable :rolleyes:
    It's like people listen to music to fit into a stereotype, rather than to enjoy it
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    (Original post by Jim_Reid)
    uhhhh...this is why I didn't want post. I should of kept my big mouth shut.
    it's causing arguments. im not gonna post again it just seems pointless.

    I don't think belle and Sebastian are underground but if you asked the average man in the street he's probably never heard of them so to him they might as well be. I know a little about music so to me they are not underground but I know they're not well known. not like oasis or something. probably bigger in america than here though.

    I can't be bothered arguing about if the music I like is mainstream or not. were they played on commercial radio stations back in their day? mostly not. did they sell millions of records? nope. has anyone I know heard of them? nope. they aren't like oasis where everyone knows the words.

    I don't know what seems to qualify a band as alternative in your books. they have to be basically unheard, unsigned, played 2 gigs in their whole existence, print their own records in their front rooms, dress with Morrissey glasses, skinny jeans, messed up hair, be white and skinny, possibly with a female singer, studied some arts degree at a university, who's members work in a coffee shop or a library, be straight edge vegan and sing songs about having sex with all your friends and then being upset because they all hate each other for it.

    and the fact you regard me to be out of touch is nice for me. im not the only person who thinks most modern music is lacking, to me it lacks edge, it is not aggressive enough, loud enough or has anything relevant to say. im starting a band after I finish uni and by the sound of it we will be very different to what people are listening to these days. hopefully most people will hate us. that way we know we're on the right path. it's going to be like dinosaur jr on steroids. but not metal.

    that's my last post anyway...ultimately (rightly or wrongly) I associate alternative to mean music holding values alternative to the mainstream and/or music you would hear and consider not to have mainstream appeal. screaming feedback was never going to have a truly mass market so to me it is alternative. people singing twee songs, to be honest I don't see why it needs to be classified as indie or alternative when pop would suffice.

    awaiting the negs for this now....................im not responding either way so say any demeaning and derivative comments you want
    So-Much-FAIL.

    AAARRGGHHH.

    Okay, lets start with the basics.
    You're replying to, well someone? Some people.
    So you need to quote them so we can see who you're replying to and when. As well as which posts.

    Or explicitly mention the points you're talking about. You did do this a bit, but not a lot.


    Now let us move onto the more pressing issue, the content of your post:

    Belle and Sebastian are a very well known band. Sure, not every body knows about them, but they do have a very large fan base. The vast vast vast majority of people who like Indie/alternative rock/pop or twee, will know who they are. In fact, a hell of a lot of them will be fans.

    They are almost entirely Scottish, whilst I'm not sure where they're based, I would be surprised if it wasn't Glasgow.

    I'm unsure of why you think that they are "probably bigger in America than here".
    There seems to be no basis for that.
    Perhaps they have a larger fan base than here? But even if that's the case (which I see no evidence for) it would not follow that a larger percentage of Americans like belle and Sebastian (relative to the American population) than British people (relative to the British population).

    Now onto the alternative issue.
    Generally like it when bands write their own music and lyrics.
    I like it when they do something new, original, and that sounds nice (or alternatively, makes me laugh).
    Being a DIY band isn't part of the criteria either way, sometimes DIY bands use this in a funny way, that makes me enjoy the atmosphere or watching them play even more. Other times they fall flat on their arses and just seem to be trying way too hard, which detracts from the enjoyment of a show.

    Dress sense only enters into it on the basis of fur/leather for me (or if they're wearing things which perpetuate bigotry, though I've not come across that). I personally abstain from all animal products that I can because I think it's immoral (though that's a different discussion). Apart from that, it doesn't come into it.

    I don't understand why the sex of the singer matters.
    Nor what degree they studied. Out of interest do you mean any BA degree, or just very specific ones relating to arts? Please, elaborate.

    Furthermore, why does it matter what their job is?
    I don't know of any straight edge vegan bands that I listen to.
    Perhaps there are some, but if there are they certainly haven't made their beliefs on the matter a public issue.

    Finally, "having sex with all your friends and then being upset because they all hate each other for it"?

    What?


    You seem to be trying to pin down what I listen to as some set of ridiculous stereotypes. Ironically, your next paragraph is all about how being out of touch is nice for you. You realise you're coming off as a bigot though, right?
    Perhaps if you realised being out of touch isn't intrinsically good, you might understand why being a bigot isn't intrinsically good? Who knows.


    But I don't see any reason to put importance in the stereotype you're paying so much attention to. It says a lot about you, and nothing about the music I listen to.

    A lot of music now does seem to be lacking. But there's also a lot of music in the world, and if you open your ears up you can find good and bad music both now, and in the past. That said, if everything has to be loud and aggressive, and vegans, people in poly based relationships who get insecure every now and then, and people who dress a certain way aren't possible capable of making music that you could judge without judging it before you're listen to it, I can see why you're having issues. I mean there's still a lot to be angry about in our society on the discrimination level, but with LGTB/sex issues becoming less intolerable and racism becoming more and more a thing of the past, there's not nearly as much to be angry about. Bar of course issues that somehow degrade the music that's being played. Damn those stupid vegans and people in poly based relationships!











    "hopefully most people will hate us".

    You're so hipster.

    But you don't want to be!
    Because you want more people to like the music you like that isn't hipster. But it is hipster. But it isn't hipster.


    OH NOES!!! People do know The Smiths. But they don't know The Smiths. But they do know The Smiths.


    I'm so confused :s :s .

    Thank you for making me go like this:
    Spoiler:
    Show
    :facepalm2:






    You think that The Smittens, Pocketbooks and Camera Obscura should be defined as pop despite not having mainstream appeal?
    Or you're so clueless that you think they do have mainstream appeal?

    Why does anything NEED to be classified a certain way?
    It doesn't, it's just convenient to do so.


    I do love the last line:
    "NO MATTER WHAT YOU SAY I WON'T REPLY".

    Nice debating techniques.
    And why are you so obsessed with being negged. Last I checked none of your posts in this thread have been negged. Yet it remains a constant theme in them.

    Well I'll sign this post off with one final message. I hope to God you're a troll. If you honestly do hold the opinions I've just read, I hope I never meet you in real life. You sound like a complete and utter muppet.
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    You're taking this **** farrrrrrr too seriously. It's music, not a competition.
    I'm just going to go to Spotify and listen to what I want, because it doesn't bear any significance to my life, as a whole, as I don't participate in idiotic music cults, but listen to what I think sounds good...
    Right now I like indi style music, in a couple of months I may listen to loads of d&b. Slate me for that if you want, I'm quite happy that I'm not narrow minded

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