[obi_adorno_kenobi]

(Original post by cab12)
Here we go again, you just can't let it go. I am so glad you left the party as you were just a pain. Ysolt didn't call the VoNC or second it so he hardly dictated what happened. Also I would say you more than anyone tried to dictate what happened!

He's always been a right-wing stooge. You really are better off without him as a party!

[misterxninja]

(Original post by cab12)
Here we go again, you just can't let it go. I am so glad you left the party as you were just a pain. Ysolt didn't call the VoNC or second it so he hardly dictated what happened. Also I would say you more than anyone tried to dictate what happened!

Because I tried to stop a coup and sniffed out this dodgy stuff going on behind the scenes and caught T_C out when his tonne changed. I left the party because the conspirators and dodgy dealers won, they went for me as I went for them. More people like you should of listened and your party wouldn't be in this mess because Addzter and Yvolt wouldn't of been members after threatening to do harm to the party.

I tried to steer us to honesty and fairness away from this corruption, hardly a bad thing to stand up against is it injustice, I guess the TSR Lib Dems don't stand for justice like the real ones do. Then again what did you expect of TSR Lib Dems turning to Socialism if not injustice and corruption its obvious historic by-products.

Let go, that someone doesn't deserve to be the leader...? Let it go, that there was corruption in the party deeper than just Yvolt/JPKC with more involved than just that... Why else have the dupe, it was obvious a plan was made and deal broke that T_C would deliver the TSR Lib Dems to a left-wing coalition grouping with Labour and the Socialists, in return for the vote he needed that made the difference.

Yea because letting go of a party you belong to IRL and have been alienated from on TSR as it unnaturally resembles something it is not, is something people just... let go... Some people actually care about the Lib Dems unlike some of you who call yourself TSR Lib Dems but rubbish the Lib Dem name as part of your strategy because you actually think slagging off Nick Clegg will win you voters, ahahaha.

Seriously there has never been a least Lib Dem TSR Lib Dem leader than T_C, what a total fudge! You enjoy your leader because since he took over things carried on being bad, nout has got better and your going to get stuffed at the election because your electoral strategy is "if we tell people Nick Clegg is a tosser enough we might get some votes back to show we don't like him..." DEFEATISTS!

[misterxninja]

(Original post by obi_adorno_kenobi)
He's always been a right-wing stooge. You really are better off without him as a party!

Not at all am a centrist, orange book is the centre... The idea of balancing perfectly Personal Liberalism, Economic Liberalism and Social Liberalism is key, the problem is the TSR Lib Dems forget the other important two that keeps them Liberals by forgetting them other two they become Socialists.

[obi_adorno_kenobi]

(Original post by misterxninja)
Not at all am a centrist, orange book is the centre... The idea of balancing perfectly Personal Liberalism, Economic Liberalism and Social Liberalism is key, the problem is the TSR Lib Dems forget the other important two that keeps them Liberals by forgetting them other two they become Socialists.

The obvious retort is that the centre is fluid. The centre today is not the centre of 1964 or even 1990. It is quite far to the right and settles on treating those with little money with utter contempt. The Lib Dems are in no danger of becoming socialists, they have to turn social democrats first! Liberalism is a fairly noxious political philosophy and advocates of the Orange Book are especially so. Can't you see what its ideas are doing to ordinary Britons?

[Mazzini]

(Original post by misterxninja)
QFA

I'd just like to say that none of us knew that Ysolt was JPKC's dupe.

[toronto353]

(Original post by misterxninja)
Because I tried to stop a coup and sniffed out this dodgy stuff going on behind the scenes and caught T_C out when his tonne changed. I left the party because the conspirators and dodgy dealers won, they went for me as I went for them. More people like you should of listened and your party wouldn't be in this mess because Addzter and Yvolt wouldn't of been members after threatening to do harm to the party.

I tried to steer us to honesty and fairness away from this corruption, hardly a bad thing to stand up against is it injustice, I guess the TSR Lib Dems don't stand for justice like the real ones do. Then again what did you expect of TSR Lib Dems turning to Socialism if not injustice and corruption its obvious historic by-products.

Let go, that someone doesn't deserve to be the leader...? Let it go, that there was corruption in the party deeper than just Yvolt/JPKC with more involved than just that... Why else have the dupe, it was obvious a plan was made and deal broke that T_C would deliver the TSR Lib Dems to a left-wing coalition grouping with Labour and the Socialists, in return for the vote he needed that made the difference.

Yea because letting go of a party you belong to IRL and have been alienated from on TSR as it unnaturally resembles something it is not, is something people just... let go... Some people actually care about the Lib Dems unlike some of you who call yourself TSR Lib Dems but rubbish the Lib Dem name as part of your strategy because you actually think slagging off Nick Clegg will win you voters, ahahaha.

Seriously there has never been a least Lib Dem TSR Lib Dem leader than T_C, what a total fudge! You enjoy your leader because since he took over things carried on being bad, nout has got better and your going to get stuffed at the election because your electoral strategy is "if we tell people Nick Clegg is a tosser enough we might get some votes back to show we don't like him..." DEFEATISTS!

In the nicest possible way, drop it. It's tiring watching you come up with all these theories and them come up with various retorts. The House has got no interest in this. If you don't like what's happening, take it to PMs, but stop dragging this up every week or so. It's boring and it's tedious now. With all due respect, get over it.

So to bring this thread vaguely back to topic, what do the Lib Dems think of the Olympics so far?

[Mazzini]

(Original post by toronto353)
In the nicest possible way, drop it. It's tiring watching you come up with all these theories and them come up with various retorts. The House has got no interest in this. If you don't like what's happening, take it to PMs, but stop dragging this up every week or so. It's boring and it's tedious now. With all due respect, get over it.

I completely agree.

So to bring this thread vaguely back to topic, what do the Lib Dems think of the Olympics so far?

Personally I think they've been much better than expected (especially 'cause we've won 15 gold medals ). I think a lot of people thought it would be a right mess and a national embarrassment but it's been remarkably good and has been pulled off well.

[thunder_chunky]

(Original post by toronto353)
In the nicest possible way, drop it. It's tiring watching you come up with all these theories and them come up with various retorts. The House has got no interest in this. If you don't like what's happening, take it to PMs, but stop dragging this up every week or so. It's boring and it's tedious now. With all due respect, get over it.

So to bring this thread vaguely back to topic, what do the Lib Dems think of the Olympics so far?

Most if not all his accusations are basess. He makes them in long winded posts and never backs them up. He then moves on and never responds to requests to back up those claims.

There's a word for that.

And to answer your question, I have been thoroughly enjoying the Olympics thus far. I have been to one vent and am due to go to another this Friday. Plus I have tickets for the Paralympics.

So it's all good. I've enjoyed the Judo immensely.

[misterxninja]

(Original post by obi_adorno_kenobi)
The obvious retort is that the centre is fluid. The centre today is not the centre of 1964 or even 1990. It is quite far to the right and settles on treating those with little money with utter contempt. The Lib Dems are in no danger of becoming socialists, they have to turn social democrats first! Liberalism is a fairly noxious political philosophy and advocates of the Orange Book are especially so. Can't you see what its ideas are doing to ordinary Britons?

The Orange Book hasn't been implemented you never got a Lib Dem government nor did you get all the Lib Dems accepting the deep well articulated points of Laws in chapter 1 to the challenging concept to some Lib Dems.

It will fix Britain right up, I'm sure of it. It has the best of the 3 spheres of Liberalism covers all posts and is the fairest set up a society can have, its not a side taker.

The TSR Lib Dems are not in danger, they are Socialists they abandoned their Personal Liberalism and Economic Liberalism and dragged out Social Liberalism to the point it is Social Democracy which is pretty much Socialism's baby sister anyway. They have wrecked what it means to be a Lib Dem and they have abandoned their natural position.

The centre at current is the Orange book it pulls on a long tradition of centrism that despite history is still true to its original values and has reclaimed them, that is the point of it. The Lib Dems in real life are re-aligning to their natural self after lending left-wing votes for many years riding Labour's mistakes, they now need to pave their own identity and it will be hard but it will be fruitful long term.

The centre accumulated and constantly modernizes yes, but it is still the centre it never stopped being that and to say the centre of today is right is laughable. No your just left-wing and think anything right of you is obviously right-wing, because you think as a lefty that your a rational centrist and what you believe makes total sense leading to you to fib yourself into thinking your not far from the centre when in reality you are.

The big error you make and always will standard of Socialist behaviour, is they seem to think they are quiet moderate. It was always the centre you just didn't know what the centre was clearly and what it was made up of, thus you think it is more right-wing today, because of that sole reason you always fought of yourself an fancied yourself as centre-left, thus your perception of the centre is deluded by your own bias. Where as in fact it is more centrist today than it was before.

The centre is Liberalism it always will be, what has actually happened is the right-wing have become more centrist, so you begin to associate the centre with the right-wing, when you should be identifying the former right-wing with the centre. Liberalism has won that is why you have Centre-left, Centre-Centre and Centre-Right in British politics today, the other two ideologies lost, because what they were based on was static and inflexible so they had little room to budge and had to adopt Liberalism to preserve small remnants of their ideologies. Liberalism was the most adaptable flexible ideology it survived and outlasted the other two and delivered better results in societies that chose it.

What part of Liberalism you are depends what you prioritize in Liberalism. Left-Right is defined on a Liberal scale in many a senses by the three parties now because it won so significantly. Too many people to my concern put too many eggs in the Social Liberalism basket than they should, others put too many eggs in the Economic Liberalism basket than they should and others become libertarians and put too much in the Personal Liberalism basket. David Laws is the centrist he suggests re-alignment and equilibrium of the Liberalisms to reclaim it, balancing the three is key and should be important to the current modern Lib Dem agenda.

He get's called right-wing because the Lib Dems had forgot their Economic Liberalism and so he wants to put more eggs in that basket which, to a lefty it makes him a big evil righty, when in reality he is a centrist. Reclaiming Liberalism is all about doing just that reclaiming the three spheres of Liberalism and balancing them with each other and not letting one of them dominate the others too much or you end up taking a side and supporting an interest, this is what the Lib Dems fairness agenda actually is, re-alignment to the Lib Dem natural position reclaiming the ideology and not choosing sides. It truly is the pure centre and David Laws is massively misunderstood and is the biggest Liberal Democrat with the Orange Book grouping you could find. Liberalism is naturally pragmatism when you balance those three spheres it is the ideal.

[misterxninja]

(Original post by Mazzini)
I'd just like to say that none of us knew that Ysolt was JPKC's dupe.

Maybe not, maybe you didn't. Maybe T_C did, maybe he didn't but the plan was to usurp the leadership of the Lib Dems and he collaborated in this, which he has achieved and achieved it by a dupe vote and drag the Lib Dems to Socialism, which he has. So again it matters not the plan in place is apparent and the next step of the party is obvious too - it was all planned what would happen and so far its gone to those who planned its plan...

But I hope in light of this JPKC incident, people will come back and reconsider what I said initially when I called TC out very very early on, as it is very obvious now.

TC would of acted very differently if Yvolt was never in the party influencing outcomes, it would of changed the electoral outcome massively and the VoNC to the leadership and all that happened between. Remove Yvolt, you would have Morgsie as your leader or Birchington and the party would still be centrist where it should be and naturally sits and it would be open minded to coalitions with either side - it is not open minded to coalitions at current despite TC's empty words, actions make it clear the Lib Dem intent.

[obi_adorno_kenobi]

(Original post by misterxninja)
The Orange Book hasn't been implemented you never got a Lib Dem government nor did you get all the Lib Dems accepting the deep well articulated points of Laws in chapter 1 to the challenging concept to some Lib Dems.

It will fix Britain right up, I'm sure of it. It has the best of the 3 spheres of Liberalism covers all posts and is the fairest set up a society can have, its not a side taker.

The TSR Lib Dems are not in danger, they are Socialists they abandoned their Personal Liberalism and Economic Liberalism and dragged out Social Liberalism to the point it is Social Democracy which is pretty much Socialism's baby sister anyway. They have wrecked what it means to be a Lib Dem and they have abandoned their natural position.

The centre at current is the Orange book it pulls on a long tradition of centrism that despite history is still true to its original values and has reclaimed them, that is the point of it. The Lib Dems in real life are re-aligning to their natural self after lending left-wing votes for many years riding Labour's mistakes, they now need to pave their own identity and it will be hard but it will be fruitful long term.

The centre accumulated and constantly modernizes yes, but it is still the centre it never stopped being that and to say the centre of today is right is laughable. No your just left-wing and think anything right of you is obviously right-wing, because you think as a lefty that your a rational centrist and what you believe makes total sense leading to you to fib yourself into thinking your not far from the centre when in reality you are.

The big error you make and always will standard of Socialist behaviour, is they seem to think they are quiet moderate. It was always the centre you just didn't know what the centre was clearly and what it was made up of, thus you think it is more right-wing today, because of that sole reason you always fought of yourself an fancied yourself as centre-left, thus your perception of the centre is deluded by your own bias. Where as in fact it is more centrist today than it was before.

The centre is Liberalism it always will be, what has actually happened is the right-wing have become more centrist, so you begin to associate the centre with the right-wing, when you should be identifying the former right-wing with the centre. Liberalism has won that is why you have Centre-left, Centre-Centre and Centre-Right in British politics today, the other two ideologies lost, because what they were based on was static and inflexible so they had little room to budge and had to adopt Liberalism to preserve small remnants of their ideologies. Liberalism was the most adaptable flexible ideology it survived and outlasted the other two and delivered better results in societies that chose it.

What part of Liberalism you are depends what you prioritize in Liberalism. Left-Right is defined on a Liberal scale in many a senses by the three parties now because it won so significantly. Too many people to my concern put too many eggs in the Social Liberalism basket than they should, others put too many eggs in the Economic Liberalism basket than they should and others become libertarians and put too much in the Personal Liberalism basket. David Laws is the centrist he suggests re-alignment and equilibrium of the Liberalisms to reclaim it, balancing the three is key and should be important to the current modern Lib Dem agenda.

He get's called right-wing because the Lib Dems had forgot their Economic Liberalism and so he wants to put more eggs in that basket which, to a lefty it makes him a big evil righty, when in reality he is a centrist. Reclaiming Liberalism is all about doing just that reclaiming the three spheres of Liberalism and balancing them with each other and not letting one of them dominate the others too much or you end up taking a side and supporting an interest, this is what the Lib Dems fairness agenda actually is, re-alignment to the Lib Dem natural position reclaiming the ideology and not choosing sides. It truly is the pure centre and David Laws is massively misunderstood and is the biggest Liberal Democrat with the Orange Book grouping you could find. Liberalism is naturally pragmatism when you balance those three spheres it is the ideal.

Your key fallacy is this: as a democratic socialist, I am not interested in the centre ground; rather, I'm interested in pursuing socialist policies. Anything else is mute. Socialists don't see themselves as moderates, far from it.

To be honest, one person can posts stuff of this length and be anywhere near accurate. Melancholy you are not.

[Mazzini]

(Original post by misterxninja)
Maybe not, maybe you didn't. Maybe T_C did, maybe he didn't but the plan was to usurp the leadership of the Lib Dems and he collaborated in this, which he has achieved and achieved it by a dupe vote and drag the Lib Dems to Socialism, which he has. So again it matters not the plan in place is apparent and the next step of the party is obvious too - it was all planned what would happen and so far its gone to those who planned its plan...

But I hope in light of this JPKC incident, people will come back and reconsider what I said initially when I called TC out very very early on, as it is very obvious now.

TC would of acted very differently if Yvolt was never in the party influencing outcomes, it would of changed the electoral outcome massively and the VoNC to the leadership and all that happened between. Remove Yvolt, you would have Morgsie as your leader or Birchington and the party would still be centrist where it should be and naturally sits and it would be open minded to coalitions with either side - it is not open minded to coalitions at current despite TC's empty words, actions make it clear the Lib Dem intent.

Or perhaps not...

Seriously, just let it go now.

[toronto353]

(Original post by misterxninja)
Maybe not, maybe you didn't. Maybe T_C did, maybe he didn't but the plan was to usurp the leadership of the Lib Dems and he collaborated in this, which he has achieved and achieved it by a dupe vote and drag the Lib Dems to Socialism, which he has. So again it matters not the plan in place is apparent and the next step of the party is obvious too - it was all planned what would happen and so far its gone to those who planned its plan...

But I hope in light of this JPKC incident, people will come back and reconsider what I said initially when I called TC out very very early on, as it is very obvious now.

TC would of acted very differently if Yvolt was never in the party influencing outcomes, it would of changed the electoral outcome massively and the VoNC to the leadership and all that happened between. Remove Yvolt, you would have Morgsie as your leader or Birchington and the party would still be centrist where it should be and naturally sits and it would be open minded to coalitions with either side - it is not open minded to coalitions at current despite TC's empty words, actions make it clear the Lib Dem intent.

(Original post by misterxninja)
The Orange Book hasn't been implemented you never got a Lib Dem government nor did you get all the Lib Dems accepting the deep well articulated points of Laws in chapter 1 to the challenging concept to some Lib Dems.

It will fix Britain right up, I'm sure of it. It has the best of the 3 spheres of Liberalism covers all posts and is the fairest set up a society can have, its not a side taker.

The TSR Lib Dems are not in danger, they are Socialists they abandoned their Personal Liberalism and Economic Liberalism and dragged out Social Liberalism to the point it is Social Democracy which is pretty much Socialism's baby sister anyway. They have wrecked what it means to be a Lib Dem and they have abandoned their natural position.

The centre at current is the Orange book it pulls on a long tradition of centrism that despite history is still true to its original values and has reclaimed them, that is the point of it. The Lib Dems in real life are re-aligning to their natural self after lending left-wing votes for many years riding Labour's mistakes, they now need to pave their own identity and it will be hard but it will be fruitful long term.

The centre accumulated and constantly modernizes yes, but it is still the centre it never stopped being that and to say the centre of today is right is laughable. No your just left-wing and think anything right of you is obviously right-wing, because you think as a lefty that your a rational centrist and what you believe makes total sense leading to you to fib yourself into thinking your not far from the centre when in reality you are.

The big error you make and always will standard of Socialist behaviour, is they seem to think they are quiet moderate. It was always the centre you just didn't know what the centre was clearly and what it was made up of, thus you think it is more right-wing today, because of that sole reason you always fought of yourself an fancied yourself as centre-left, thus your perception of the centre is deluded by your own bias. Where as in fact it is more centrist today than it was before.

The centre is Liberalism it always will be, what has actually happened is the right-wing have become more centrist, so you begin to associate the centre with the right-wing, when you should be identifying the former right-wing with the centre. Liberalism has won that is why you have Centre-left, Centre-Centre and Centre-Right in British politics today, the other two ideologies lost, because what they were based on was static and inflexible so they had little room to budge and had to adopt Liberalism to preserve small remnants of their ideologies. Liberalism was the most adaptable flexible ideology it survived and outlasted the other two and delivered better results in societies that chose it.

What part of Liberalism you are depends what you prioritize in Liberalism. Left-Right is defined on a Liberal scale in many a senses by the three parties now because it won so significantly. Too many people to my concern put too many eggs in the Social Liberalism basket than they should, others put too many eggs in the Economic Liberalism basket than they should and others become libertarians and put too much in the Personal Liberalism basket. David Laws is the centrist he suggests re-alignment and equilibrium of the Liberalisms to reclaim it, balancing the three is key and should be important to the current modern Lib Dem agenda.

He get's called right-wing because the Lib Dems had forgot their Economic Liberalism and so he wants to put more eggs in that basket which, to a lefty it makes him a big evil righty, when in reality he is a centrist. Reclaiming Liberalism is all about doing just that reclaiming the three spheres of Liberalism and balancing them with each other and not letting one of them dominate the others too much or you end up taking a side and supporting an interest, this is what the Lib Dems fairness agenda actually is, re-alignment to the Lib Dem natural position reclaiming the ideology and not choosing sides. It truly is the pure centre and David Laws is massively misunderstood and is the biggest Liberal Democrat with the Orange Book grouping you could find. Liberalism is naturally pragmatism when you balance those three spheres it is the ideal.

See my post above and also I'd like to combat this point about the Lib Dems only wanting a left wing coalition. UKIP has also worked in both right wing and left wing coalitions and so, even if T_C isn't going to make strong overtones and efforts to talk to UKIP now (and I wouldn't expect him to do so as I'm not doing so at the moment either - not intentionally I might add, but I'm not), I have faith that he will consider UKIP as potential coalition partners in the future. The same goes for any party, but this scaremongering isn't working. UKIP is at home working with any party and just because he's not going out of his way to build bridges doesn't mean that he's ruled any party out.

Anyway, seriously, leave it now.

[misterxninja]

(Original post by Mazzini)
Or perhaps not...

Seriously, just let it go now.

When TC moves on I will and the Lib Dems are open minded to political coalition rather than sabotaged from the inside to hate the right parties and slurp it up with the left parties, a centre party considers both options not rules one out before the offer was even made.

Or perhaps I'm right and was all along proved to be correct about something not right with Yvolt and right again about this... My track record is better than yours, you fought Yvolt was great and cosied up look a fool to the JPKC dupe.

The TSR Lib Dems let JPKC someone who targeted and tried for a long time to bring Morgsie down, because he wanted a more left-wing Lib Dems - you let him succeed in influencing the party away from its principles. You let Morgsie fall when Morgsie was right to challenge this dodgy shady Yvolt so was I, remove Yvolt you would never be in the mess your in. All the disunity was created by Yvolt to facilitate a reason to remove Morgsie as leader and place a lefty in the party leadership.

It ain't going away because something corrupt to the core has gone on here and you need to learn to trust me, because I was right all along. Morgsie was a good leader, JPKC made his daily ability to lead difficult problematic and then using Yvolt used it to facilitate a VoNC then a leadership election where the vote of Yvolt made the difference in the outcome and the actions of Yvolt, whom called for me to leave.

Birchington or Morgsie would still be your leader right now, if you had listened to me ousted Yvolt and Addzter you would still be a united centrist party. If you think your party is united your wrong, half of the members are still simmering away quietly going along with things. Soon as the opportunity presents itself those who got done over will reclaim the party they deserve from the corrupt dodgy dealings and bring it back to reputation honesty and good conducts, it will then be more open minded centrist again.

Your going to lose another seat next election, because your strategy is flawed, your success is tied to the real life Lib Dem success. So you best start singing real life Lib Dem successes if you ever want any success yourself. If you truly don't want to be tied to the Lib Dem party, then the obvious thing to do is change your name to the Social Liberals, then your fate is not tied to the Lib Dems and you will be judged on your own successes. If your not going to argue as Lib Dems an support Nick Clegg, then what is the point using the Lib Dem's name and slagging Clegg off...? It won't get you voters, because your fate is attached to Nick Clegg whether you like him or not and your electoral interest is to make him look good as it makes you look good, because you choose to tie yourself to him and the Lib Dem party. If you can make people see Nick Clegg isn't that bad and is nice after all and get people to respect him again, then you have a chance at gaining more votes. But since you don't agree with the Lib Dems and are clearly not Lib Dems and are something different, why do you continue to be tied down by Nick Cleggs unpopularity and add to his unpopularity by openly as a party slagging him off?

You really are not a very smart bunch of people are you, you defeat yourselves completely. You would get more votes detached from the Lib Dems since there so unpopular amongst students apparently.

[Mazzini]

(Original post by misterxninja)
When TC moves on I will and the Lib Dems are open minded to political coalition rather than sabotaged from the inside to hate the right parties and slurp it up with the left parties, a centre party considers both options not rules one out before the offer was even made.

Or perhaps I'm right and was all along proved to be correct about something not right with Yvolt and right again about this... My track record is better than yours, you fought Yvolt was great and cosied up look a fool to the JPKC dupe.

The TSR Lib Dems let JPKC someone who targeted and tried for a long time to bring Morgsie down, because he wanted a more left-wing Lib Dems - you let him succeed in influencing the party away from its principles. You let Morgsie fall when Morgsie was right to challenge this dodgy shady Yvolt so was I, remove Yvolt you would never be in the mess your in. All the disunity was created by Yvolt to facilitate a reason to remove Morgsie as leader and place a lefty in the party leadership.

It ain't going away because something corrupt to the core has gone on here and you need to learn to trust me, because I was right all along. Morgsie was a good leader, JPKC made his daily ability to lead difficult problematic and then using Yvolt used it to facilitate a VoNC then a leadership election where the vote of Yvolt made the difference in the outcome and the actions of Yvolt, whom called for me to leave.

Birchington or Morgsie would still be your leader right now, if you had listened to me ousted Yvolt and Addzter you would still be a united centrist party. If you think your party is united your wrong, half of the members are still simmering away quietly going along with things. Soon as the opportunity presents itself those who got done over will reclaim the party they deserve from the corrupt dodgy dealings and bring it back to reputation honesty and good conducts, it will then be more open minded centrist again.

Your going to lose another seat next election, because your strategy is flawed, your success is tied to the real life Lib Dem success. So you best start singing real life Lib Dem successes if you ever want any success yourself. If you truly don't want to be tied to the Lib Dem party, then the obvious thing to do is change your name to the Social Liberals, then your fate is not tied to the Lib Dems and you will be judged on your own successes. If your not going to argue as Lib Dems an support Nick Clegg, then what is the point using the Lib Dem's name and slagging Clegg off...? It won't get you voters, because your fate is attached to Nick Clegg whether you like him or not and your electoral interest is to make him look good as it makes you look good, because you choose to tie yourself to him and the Lib Dem party. If you can make people see Nick Clegg isn't that bad and is nice after all and get people to respect him again, then you have a chance at gaining more votes. But since you don't agree with the Lib Dems and are clearly not Lib Dems and are something different, why do you continue to be tied down by Nick Cleggs unpopularity and add to his unpopularity by openly as a party slagging him off?

You really are not a very smart bunch of people are you, you defeat yourselves completely. You would get more votes detached from the Lib Dems since there so unpopular amongst students apparently.

You have no idea of my actions and are telling me that I supported the 'rebels' as you call them when in fact I supported Morgsie the whole way through.

[misterxninja]

(Original post by Mazzini)
You have no idea of my actions and are telling me that I supported the 'rebels' as you call them when in fact I supported Morgsie the whole way through.

Yea perhaps you did, but you still cosied up and got sucked in by Yvolt I witnessed it before I left...

[cab12]

(Original post by misterxninja)
When TC moves on I will and the Lib Dems are open minded to political coalition rather than sabotaged from the inside to hate the right parties and slurp it up with the left parties, a centre party considers both options not rules one out before the offer was even made.

Or perhaps I'm right and was all along proved to be correct about something not right with Yvolt and right again about this... My track record is better than yours, you fought Yvolt was great and cosied up look a fool to the JPKC dupe.

The TSR Lib Dems let JPKC someone who targeted and tried for a long time to bring Morgsie down, because he wanted a more left-wing Lib Dems - you let him succeed in influencing the party away from its principles. You let Morgsie fall when Morgsie was right to challenge this dodgy shady Yvolt so was I, remove Yvolt you would never be in the mess your in. All the disunity was created by Yvolt to facilitate a reason to remove Morgsie as leader and place a lefty in the party leadership.

It ain't going away because something corrupt to the core has gone on here and you need to learn to trust me, because I was right all along. Morgsie was a good leader, JPKC made his daily ability to lead difficult problematic and then using Yvolt used it to facilitate a VoNC then a leadership election where the vote of Yvolt made the difference in the outcome and the actions of Yvolt, whom called for me to leave.

Birchington or Morgsie would still be your leader right now, if you had listened to me ousted Yvolt and Addzter you would still be a united centrist party. If you think your party is united your wrong, half of the members are still simmering away quietly going along with things. Soon as the opportunity presents itself those who got done over will reclaim the party they deserve from the corrupt dodgy dealings and bring it back to reputation honesty and good conducts, it will then be more open minded centrist again.

Your going to lose another seat next election, because your strategy is flawed, your success is tied to the real life Lib Dem success. So you best start singing real life Lib Dem successes if you ever want any success yourself. If you truly don't want to be tied to the Lib Dem party, then the obvious thing to do is change your name to the Social Liberals, then your fate is not tied to the Lib Dems and you will be judged on your own successes. If your not going to argue as Lib Dems an support Nick Clegg, then what is the point using the Lib Dem's name and slagging Clegg off...? It won't get you voters, because your fate is attached to Nick Clegg whether you like him or not and your electoral interest is to make him look good as it makes you look good, because you choose to tie yourself to him and the Lib Dem party. If you can make people see Nick Clegg isn't that bad and is nice after all and get people to respect him again, then you have a chance at gaining more votes. But since you don't agree with the Lib Dems and are clearly not Lib Dems and are something different, why do you continue to be tied down by Nick Cleggs unpopularity and add to his unpopularity by openly as a party slagging him off?

You really are not a very smart bunch of people are you, you defeat yourselves completely. You would get more votes detached from the Lib Dems since there so unpopular amongst students apparently.

The VoNC was not called or seconded it by Ysolt so he didn't influence that part of the events. And I don't once remember you questioning Ysolt's account.

[Morgsie]

(Original post by cab12)
The VoNC was not called or seconded it by Ysolt so he didn't influence that part of the events. And I don't once remember you questioning Ysolt's account.

No it was called by you, but you did not understand the reasons why I took time out and didn't implement your suggestion. Your bulldozed it through without talking to anyone. You and your chum who pretends he likes me when in fact he doesn't, ignored the fact I had to sort my head out. I did the right thing but you and others reckless actions caused my downfall.

I have a lot on at the moment, swamped in developing ideas etc. I will bounce back though which route I decide to go down is my choice. I am in my bubble pursuing my interests.

[Mazzini]

(Original post by misterxninja)
Yea perhaps you did, but you still cosied up and got sucked in by Yvolt I witnessed it before I left...

1) I was defending Morgsie during the VoNC period.

2) You never said anything against him/her.

[JPKC]

Err guys can we keep the drama down please -- we need to be civil ^_^