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Ask a TSR Liberal Democrat

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    (Original post by Morgsie)
    Hi and Welcome to the MHOC.

    Feel free to join a Party, go to Groups and click Usergroups and Join the one you want to join.

    The TSR Lib Dems are Simply the Best, I am biased.
    Are you serious?

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    I love how people tell him to join their party without finding out if he is socialist, capitalist or centrist.
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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    I love how people tell him to join their party without finding out if he is socialist, capitalist or centrist.
    Optimism is not exactly the worse trait a man can have.
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    (Original post by JPKC)
    Will you let the House know before the Division Lobby?
    We will try and bash out a response before it goes to lobby

    (Original post by chaza01)
    Conservatives:kinda scummy
    Liberal Democrats= scum
    Labour= real scum
    Conclusion: let's emigrate.
    Off you trott then.
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    (Original post by Morgsie)
    Your entitled to your view.

    This thread is where people can ask us questions which you have not, you just stated your view.
    Fair enough. To be frank, it's Huhne I can't stand.
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    (Original post by chaza01)
    Fair enough. To be frank, it's Huhne I can't stand.
    I have Chris Huhne as a friend of that social networking site, Facebook. And he is no longer in Government due to perverting the course of justice for speeding.
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    (Original post by Morgsie)
    I have Chris Huhne as a friend of that social networking site, Facebook. And he is no longer in Government due to perverting the course of justice for speeding.
    I am aware of that.
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    (Original post by Morgsie)
    I have Chris Huhne as a friend of that social networking site, Facebook. And he is no longer in Government due to perverting the course of justice for speeding.
    And I am bamboozled by the Lib Dem's stance on trident. For starters, there is no cheaper alternative, unless you want to look at cruise missiles, but even then we'd have to spend quite a bit adapting the astute class and fitting the new warheads; not to mention the much more limited range. The thing is, with the present situation in the middle east (esp. Iran, Pakistan and possibly Saudi Arabia/Turkey if Iran acquires nuclear capability), now is not the time to scrap our nation's safeguard.
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    (Original post by Morgsie)
    I have Chris Huhne as a friend of that social networking site, Facebook. And he is no longer in Government due to perverting the course of justice for speeding.
    Allegedly. Innocent until proven guilty, and all that.
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    (Original post by TheCrackInTime)
    Allegedly. Innocent until proven guilty, and all that.
    Thank you for the reminder, Trial is in October
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    (Original post by chaza01)
    And I am bamboozled by the Lib Dem's stance on trident. For starters, there is no cheaper alternative, unless you want to look at cruise missiles, but even then we'd have to spend quite a bit adapting the astute class and fitting the new warheads; not to mention the much more limited range. The thing is, with the present situation in the middle east (esp. Iran, Pakistan and possibly Saudi Arabia/Turkey if Iran acquires nuclear capability), now is not the time to scrap our nation's safeguard.
    That's the sort of attitude we had during the cold war and you know what happend? Um....we never used it.
    We could spend a life time saying "well we could need it one day because of danger and instability in <enter name of country or region>!!

    You could say that till you're blue in the face but the fact of the matter is that it's never been used or even needed and yet we are spending billions on it every year, even when financially speaking we are galloping up diarrhea drive with a saddle.
    We are making cuts to things that are actually important and that are actually being used like the NHS and the armed forces with great reductions on both. If we actually scrapped trident we would be able to save millions, perhaps billions every year and we would actually be able to still have and maintain our own aircraft carrier.
    We should at least scale it down for now but realisitically, scrapping it makes sense.

    It's just a waste of money.
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    (Original post by thunder_chunky)
    That's the sort of attitude we had during the cold war and you know what happend? Um....we never used it.
    We could spend a life time saying "well we could need it one day because of danger and instability in <enter name of country or region>!!

    You could say that till you're blue in the face but the fact of the matter is that it's never been used or even needed and yet we are spending billions on it every year, even when financially speaking we are galloping up diarrhea drive with a saddle.
    We are making cuts to things that are actually important and that are actually being used like the NHS and the armed forces with great reductions on both. If we actually scrapped trident we would be able to save millions, perhaps billions every year and we would actually be able to still have and maintain our own aircraft carrier.
    We should at least scale it down for now but realisitically, scrapping it makes sense.

    It's just a waste of money.
    The reason we haven't had to use it is because we have it, that's the principle of mutually assured destruction . . And scrapping it makes no sense 'for now' - having to rebuild it from scratch would cost billions more than upgrading it. And we have already scaled it down significantly, in 1998 we removed it from the RAF, we now only have submarine launch capability (which makes the most sense). Our Navy is getting smaller and smaller, and it is necessary to have at least 3 trident submarines when taking account of repairs etc (usually at least one is docked). So basically, we can either scrap it completely or keep it. There is no 'realistic' third option. And though in 50 years, scrapping it may be an option, now is not the time. And yes, Russia and the west didn't blow each other to bits, but believe me, they came VERY close. And that was between 2 superpowers who were sort of sensible enough to realize that nuking each other
    was a bad idea. You think the cold war was bad (the world was on the bring of Armageddon), imagine a nuclear middle east. Then add in the growing prospect of terrorist groups getting their hands on such weapons. Frankly, people are foolish to have the whole 'it will never happen the world is perfect, Armadinejad is a great bloke' mentality. The world is a nasty place with an increasingly uncertain future. Pre 2008, people would laugh at those who warned of an impending financial crisis - and guess what happened?
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    In the interests of disclosure, how would the Lib Dems have voted if the VoNC were allowed to have gone to the Division Lobby? Did you ever reach a decision?

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    (Original post by JPKC)
    In the interests of disclosure, how would the Lib Dems have voted if the VoNC were allowed to have gone to the Division Lobby? Did you ever reach a decision?

    We were coming to a decision when you guys dropped the bombshell by calling an Election as a get out clause, due to this act of cowardice we were unable to reach a decision.
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    (Original post by chaza01)
    And I am bamboozled by the Lib Dem's stance on trident. For starters, there is no cheaper alternative, unless you want to look at cruise missiles, but even then we'd have to spend quite a bit adapting the astute class and fitting the new warheads; not to mention the much more limited range. The thing is, with the present situation in the middle east (esp. Iran, Pakistan and possibly Saudi Arabia/Turkey if Iran acquires nuclear capability), now is not the time to scrap our nation's safeguard.
    Ever considered the fact that other countries feel threatened by the west's nuclear capability, and that they feel the need to arm themselves in the same way to face up to this threat?
    We should rely on diplomacy, not "My gun's bigger than yours".
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    (Original post by Morgsie)
    We were coming to a decision when you guys dropped the bombshell by calling an Election as a get out clause, due to this act of cowardice we were unable to reach a decision.
    It sounds like you're setting the Lib Dems up as a party very hostile to Labour, so I'm assuming it was going to be a 'yes' vote.

    As for the 'cowardice' charge, it was actually a non-partisan solution to the problem. The calling of the VoNC obviously indicated that some in the House had no confidence in the Labour minority government, calling an election was a compromise that every party should be happy with. VoNCs should not be utilised for party political reasons, obviously you disagree.
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    (Original post by JPKC)
    It sounds like you're setting the Lib Dems up as a party very hostile to Labour, so I'm assuming it was going to be a 'yes' vote.

    As for the 'cowardice' charge, it was actually a non-partisan solution to the problem. The calling of the VoNC obviously indicated that some in the House had no confidence in the Labour minority government, calling an election was a compromise that every party should be happy with. VoNCs should not be utilised for party political reasons, obviously you disagree.
    The Party was deciding what stance it should have taken. You should have stayed and defended your position but you ran away from your responsibilities by calling an election which is an act of stupidity or a masterstroke.

    2 of your MPs want to rebuild bridges but how can they when you and your Leadership destroys it by comments like this.
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    Are those two Mps calling for a coalition?
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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    Are those two Mps calling for a coalition?
    The only ones calling for a Coalition are you guys, the Conservatives. The Labour MPs in question want to improve relations but how can they when the Leadership and a certain MP makes hostile comments.

    It is up to us as a Party to decide and we have not decided anything
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    (Original post by JPKC)
    In the interests of disclosure, how would the Lib Dems have voted if the VoNC were allowed to have gone to the Division Lobby? Did you ever reach a decision?

    We were very close. I'm not sure a party line will be put out on this, no point now, but my personal vote was wavering towards a yes vote.
    The reason being the lack of activity certainly during my time in government. I saw little or no leadership from the very top which was labour run, posts could go days or weeks without a reply and there was no attempt to rally people to motivate them.
    The fact that a new leader and PM was appointed not long ago is still irrelevant, the party didn't move either because it couldn't or wouldn't.

    So had I voted, and had I voted yes, that's why.
Updated: March 11, 2013
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