[misterxninja]

(Original post by Matthew_Lowson)
And you make it much easier by making venemous and hate filled comments dont you

What you have just quoted neither contains hate nor venom, it is my alternative perception to the narrative being told for others to consider.

I would need to be a snake to have venom unfortunately I'm just a mere human being, I know nothing of venom perhaps you could enlighten me as its clearly something your familiar with.

[richiedalion]

Why didn't the Liberal Democrats actively oppose the health reform bill.

[CyclopsRock]

Why do we think it is that drama tends to occur far more frequently in the left wing of the house?

[thunder_chunky]

(Original post by CyclopsRock)
Why do we think it is that drama tends to occur far more frequently in the left wing of the house?

It's an illusion

[Morgsie]

(Original post by richiedalion)
Why didn't the Liberal Democrats actively oppose the health reform bill.

Shirley Williams and others actively tried to improve the Bill. This thread is for TSR Lib Dem's. Some of us are happy to answer questions about RL Lib Dem's

[richiedalion]

(Original post by Morgsie)
Shirley Williams and others actively tried to improve the Bill. This thread is for TSR Lib Dem's. Some of us are happy to answer questions about RL Lib Dem's

Well it's good to know that at least some people opposed it. I admire Shirley Williams.

[Moleman1996]

Could the Lib Dems reveal what they would seek to do about cutting top heavy management in the NHS?

[Birchington]

(Original post by Moleman1996)
Could the Lib Dems reveal what they would seek to do about cutting top heavy management in the NHS?

I believe it's essential that the structure of the NHS organisation is reformed from extremely top-heavy to a more localised, patient friendly 'bottom up' approach. I think it's important that the powers of budget setting are placed back in the hands of clinicians and GPs rather than the layer of costly, unaccountable bureaucracy that exists within the NHS.

I would also like to see a return to the 'matron' system in wards - essentially putting nurses back in charge of each ward instead of managers. This should hopefully return the focus of nurses away from meeting needless targets and back to focusing fully on providing excellent patient care.

I've got many more ideas on the NHS here, ideas which the TSR Lib Dems will hopefully seek to implement.

[tehFrance]

(Original post by Birchington)
I think it's important that the powers of budget setting are placed back in the hands of GPs

My mum whom has worked for the last 20 years in the NHS (before switching to private) would disagree with the budget being in the hands of GPs as they have self-interests (obviously) along with other crap I didn't bother listening to as it was 3am when she was ranting

[Moleman1996]

(Original post by Birchington)
I believe it's essential that the structure of the NHS organisation is reformed from extremely top-heavy to a more localised, patient friendly 'bottom up' approach. I think it's important that the powers of budget setting are placed back in the hands of clinicians and GPs rather than the layer of costly, unaccountable bureaucracy that exists within the NHS.

I would also like to see a return to the 'matron' system in wards - essentially putting nurses back in charge of each ward instead of managers. This should hopefully return the focus of nurses away from meeting needless targets and back to focusing fully on providing excellent patient care.

I've got many more ideas on the NHS here, ideas which the TSR Lib Dems will hopefully seek to implement.

I agree with you on the matron thing, I actually like quite a lot of your ideas having read that post

[Birchington]

(Original post by Moleman1996)
I agree with you on the matron thing, I actually like quite a lot of your ideas having read that post

Cheers! Hopefully we can collaborate at some point. The frustrating thing about the NHS is that whenever reforms are proposed that will actually make a difference, there's a group of violently anti-reform lobbyists who appear to think we still live in 1945. Reform does not equal privatisation.

[Moleman1996]

(Original post by Birchington)
Cheers! Hopefully we can collaborate at some point. The frustrating thing about the NHS is that whenever reforms are proposed that will actually make a difference, there's a group of violently anti-reform lobbyists who appear to think we still live in 1945. Reform does not equal privatisation.

yup, they complain about conservative party plans, whilst trying to conserve the NHS themselves as an out of date model themselves. Just don't get how they think its ever gonna work?

I can see collaboration working, and hopefully that'll be something that can happen this term

[MacDaddi]

(Original post by Birchington)
Cheers! Hopefully we can collaborate at some point. The frustrating thing about the NHS is that whenever reforms are proposed that will actually make a difference, there's a group of violently anti-reform lobbyists who appear to think we still live in 1945. Reform does not equal privatisation.

Reform = Privatisation.

[Birchington]

(Original post by tehFrance)
My mum whom has worked for the last 20 years in the NHS (before switching to private) would disagree with the budget being in the hands of GPs as they have self-interests (obviously) along with other crap I didn't bother listening to as it was 3am when she was ranting

My mum worked in the private sector for years before the NHS, so I've also heard some interesting stories/rants about it!

I do agree that placing budgets in the powers of GPs is risky because they can spend this on their own vested interests (even Nye Bevan realised this!). It will be a tough balancing act to work to devolve and localise management within the NHS, but also acting to prevent certain groups (GPs ) milking the system.

[Birchington]

(Original post by MacCuishy)
Reform = Privatisation.

Not necessarily. I would prefer to see the NHS modelled along the lines of the French model (ranked 1st globally), where there is a healthy mix of private and public. Private companies are allowed to compete to provide operations etc. but all bills are paid by the government.

My objection to full privatisation is the cost that will be passed on to patients. Healthcare must always remain free at the point of use for all British citizens.

[obi_adorno_kenobi]

(Original post by Birchington)
I believe it's essential that the structure of the NHS organisation is reformed from extremely top-heavy to a more localised, patient friendly 'bottom up' approach. I think it's important that the powers of budget setting are placed back in the hands of clinicians and GPs rather than the layer of costly, unaccountable bureaucracy that exists within the NHS.

I would also like to see a return to the 'matron' system in wards - essentially putting nurses back in charge of each ward instead of managers. This should hopefully return the focus of nurses away from meeting needless targets and back to focusing fully on providing excellent patient care.

I've got many more ideas on the NHS here, ideas which the TSR Lib Dems will hopefully seek to implement.

A couple of things present themselves as problematic. It's already very difficult to see a GP and that is under a system where dedicated bureaucrats deal with the financial and management structures of the NHS and thereby free up a GP's time to see patients. Getting rid of the management systems and placing the, still necessary, governance and financial structures into the hands of the GPs will destroy that. The NHS has evolved with a bureaucratic structure so that doctors and nurses can deal with patients and pen pushers deal with paperwork. The balance has collapsed in recent years because of constant pressure to push paperwork onto medical personnel in the name of "reform". The basic thing that people want from the NHS is the knowledge that they can see a doctor when they need one and that they will be treated when they are ill. Anything else is a luxury or a burden. All this managerial crap about top-down structures, bottom-up patient-orientated structures might sound fine in an economics textbook but it's a world away from the realities of what people want from the NHS. Reform should be about ensuring patients get treated and doctors and nurses aren't saddled with needless and distracting paperwork. Your "reforms" strike me as completely opposed to that outcome.

Saying all of that doesn't mean being stuck in 1945 (1948 is more apt, no?).

[Moleman1996]

(Original post by Birchington)
My mum worked in the private sector for years before the NHS, so I've also heard some interesting stories/rants about it!

I do agree that placing budgets in the powers of GPs is risky because they can spend this on their own vested interests (even Nye Bevan realised this! It will be tough working to devolve and localise management within the NHS, but also acting to prevent certain groups (GPs milking the system.

worst thing they did was double the wages and cut the hours for GPs. My aunt works in the NHS too, she joined when it was still a "work your way up" sort of system, so I;ve also heard a lot of rants/stories

[tehFrance]

(Original post by Birchington)
I would prefer to see the NHS modelled along the lines of the French model (ranked 1st globally), where there is a healthy mix of private and public.

You are talking about a Mixed Medical Economy and you will find that is not what France has.

I do advocate for an MME in the UK however your glorious leader and Labour are all too stupid to understand the system and see it as full privatisation despite it offering choice to those that want it.

[Birchington]

(Original post by obi_adorno_kenobi)
QFA

What do you think of my proposal to improve product procurement within the NHS - surely seeing more cash go to patients rather than expensive centralised suppliers is extremely beneficial (check out the example I talked about in the earlier thread).

My primary focus is patient care. Currently, too many patients are neglected - there have been many documented cases of elderly patients not receiving adequate care in wards. My proposal to reinstate the matron system would ensure that wards are once again run at ward-level, rather than overseen by some distant manager elsewhere in the trust/hospital.

I do agree with you that we should not completely scale back the NHS management, as sometimes a little bureaucracy is needed. However, this management must somehow be made more accountable to local needs, demands and budgets.

[CyclopsRock]

There's nothing to stop a GP maintaining the current system if that's what he or she thinks is best. They have power over the budget - that doesn't mean they are expected to do everything themselves and pocket it.