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Would you still go to university if fees were uncapped ?

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    Universities in the russel group have threatened that if fees are not increased, they would consider privitisation, such as in America. This means fees could be up to 20-30 000 a year (sterling, soz i am using an american computer). even with a possible loans system, youd be charged commerical interest, meaning that if you dont get a job you will be in mountains of debt.

    Would you still go despite this risk ? For arts students, this is an even more prevailing issue, as arts degrees do not lead straight into jobs for the most part.

    1. do you think uncapped fees is a good idea ?

    2. would you prefer the cap simply to be raised

    3. can uni presitge and quality be maintained only through uncapped fees, or is this simply an example of greed ?

    discuss.
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    No.

    1) Not a good idea. "oooh, I know what'll be good for the future economy, let's not invest in education..." fantastic

    2) No, there shouldn't be any tuition fees.

    3) "Prestige" shouldn't matter, rather that university is a place for the able, not merely for those who can afford it.
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    Personally, that would put me off going to a uni that charged so much. I think that its just an attempt by Uni's to get more money. If I was paying £20K per year, I'd expect much more for my money, in terms of facilities, contact hours ect. I would prefer that the cap be raised, only be removed if it was seriously justified by the Uni.


    If universities were allowed to charge whatever they liked, it would become a place for people with money. Only the rich would be able to afford to go to a top Uni. That should never be the case.

    What does everyone else think?
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    I would as long as loans are given
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    I'd still go to uni.
    I don't think they'd just uncap it straight away though. With fees being so high in America, people's parents save from the birth of their child for uni, and there are thousands of scholarships and stuff available. If they just removed the cap right away here, parents wouldn't have saved, and there would be very few scholarships.
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    (Original post by cherrion)
    If universities were allowed to charge whatever they liked, it would become a place for people with money. Only the rich would be able to afford to go to a top Uni. That should never be the case.
    The rich, and the top 2% of the poor (who will get scholarships)...

    And the other 98% of the poor will not be able to go at all.

    While the middle classes will saddle themselves with or increase their mortgages etc. to be able to send their children to university.
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    Unfortunately, I'd have to because the job I want (optometrist) requires a specific degree (unsurprisingly, optometry) and, without it, I can't be an optometrist - in this case, I think it would be worth it.

    Had I been going to get Degree X to enter Graduate Job Z, I would have almost certainly not have gone then. Just doesn't seem worth the cost to me.
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    I really disagree with this idea. Fair enough, people need to take some responsibility for their decision to go to uni, but education shouldn't just be a means to a high-paid job and removing fee caps would encourage people to view university purely as a financial investment - especially for the poorer students. Even then it's ridiculously regressive - some people (like me, probably) wouldn't be able to afford to go full stop - and we'd surely see universities like Oxbridge returning to the elitism of the past.
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    Yes.

    In fact, fees *should* be uncapped.

    In the US the fees are really high, why can't it be the same in the UK?

    I mean, I've read that some schools in America can charge up to $50,000 - per year.

    Uncap fees once and for all.
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    (Original post by im so academic)
    Yes.

    In fact, fees *should* be uncapped.

    In the US the fees are really high, why can't it be the same in the UK?

    I mean, I've read that some schools in America can charge up to $50,000 - per year.

    Uncap fees once and for all.
    Well in the US, some people can't afford to go at all; everybody should be able to earn the right to go to university on academic merit. Some unis like Harvard are able to give financial aid though, so if universities were able to emulate that here it would be great. Having said that, Harvard gets tonnes in donations and stuff so it wouldn't be sustainable for most universities.
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    (Original post by Ray_Han)
    Well in the US, some people can't afford to go at all; everybody should be able to earn the right to go to university on academic merit. Some unis like Harvard are able to give financial aid though, so if universities were able to emulate that here it would be great. Having said that, Harvard gets tonnes in donations and stuff so it wouldn't be sustainable for most universities.
    So be it.

    In fact, yes, everybody should be able to earn the righ to go to university on academic merit - but for subjects like Media and Film? What about courses that only need CDD or whatever? Is that academic merit?
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    (Original post by im so academic)
    So be it.

    In fact, yes, everybody should be able to earn the righ to go to university on academic merit - but for subjects like Media and Film? What about courses that only need CDD or whatever? Is that academic merit?
    It is still academic merit, at the end of the day they have got the grades that the universities have specified to study that course. Whether these courses should be offered at university level is another debate.
    If we reverse the argument, what about someone who has A*A*A* but can't go to Oxbridge/LSE/Imperial/UCL e.t.c (or anywhere) because they can't afford the fees? Not only is it unfair but it is a waste of talent that they cant go to university.

    EDIT: there is someone on this very thread who got into Oxford who wouldn't be able to go due to what you are proposing.
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    I wouldn't go I literally couldn't afford it like at all and would not be comfortable taking on sooo much debt if loans were available as my family have worked very hard to never get into debt. Though my household income is low enough that I would probably get a grant or bursary.

    I think i would do an apprenticship or something if fees were that high.
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    (Original post by im so academic)
    So be it.

    In fact, yes, everybody should be able to earn the righ to go to university on academic merit - but for subjects like Media and Film? What about courses that only need CDD or whatever? Is that academic merit?
    This is silly. Removal of the cap would have to apply to all courses and all people, so it doesn't take into account 'academic merit'.
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    (Original post by im so academic)
    Yes.

    In fact, fees *should* be uncapped.

    In the US the fees are really high, why can't it be the same in the UK?

    I mean, I've read that some schools in America can charge up to $50,000 - per year.

    Uncap fees once and for all.
    Lol, I am hoping this is sarcasm :o:
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    (Original post by bennh)
    Lol, I am hoping this is sarcasm :o:
    It's not sarcasm.
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    (Original post by Ray_Han)
    It is still academic merit, at the end of the day they have got the grades that the universities have specified to study that course. Whether these courses should be offered at university level is another debate.
    If we reverse the argument, what about someone who has A*A*A* but can't go to Oxbridge/LSE/Imperial/UCL e.t.c (or anywhere) because they can't afford the fees? Not only is it unfair but it is a waste of talent that they cant go to university.

    EDIT: there is someone on this very thread who got into Oxford who wouldn't be able to go due to what you are proposing.
    Financial aid from the university, but the candidate just can't say "I can't afford it", it has to be proved.

    If a university can not support students through financial aid, well, I would say that is a considerably poor uni (in more ways than one), to the extent it's not worth going to.

    What kind of university could not support students that were not financially able to pay for their fees?

    For the record A*A*A* =/= talent
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    (Original post by im so academic)
    Financial aid from the university, but the candidate just can't say "I can't afford it", it has to be proved.

    If a university can not support students through financial aid, well, I would say that is a considerably poor uni (in more ways than one), to the extent it's not worth going to.

    What kind of university could not support students that were not financially able to pay for their fees?

    For the record A*A*A* =/= talent
    A*A*A*= academic merit
    Well if they could give financial aid then that's fine. I doubt most could though without government subsidies.
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    Yes. University is the only way I'm going to get into my desired occupation..
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    Another perfect example of a policy targeting those on middle incomes. The super rich should be able to pay £30k without any difficulty and those on lower incomes will get non-repayable grants anyway, so won't be affected very much. All it will mean is that those on middle incomes who cannot afford to fork out £30k a year/pay back a collossal loan growing bigger every year with commercial interest rates will be priced out of the uni system. These are the same people who contribute most to the tax system itself (the super rich can afford to find ways to exploit loop holes in the tax system, hence pay practically nothing in tax). It seems rather ironic that those who pay the most tax and hence pay for the grants for poorer students cannot afford to send their own children to uni.

    I would argue that in actual fact it may result in the unis getting less money, if enough middle income students choose not to go to uni. Furthermore, I believe it would lead to a huge decline in the number of students applying for arts subjects which as has been said, may not lead directly on to a job. Anyway, if the fees are raised,it stands to reason that government funded grants will have to rise too, hence the government will have to either pay more, or reduce the number of grants given out.

    The only case where I can see an increase in fees would be beneficial is to discourage people going to uni for the sake of it to do a pointless degree in Eastenders Studies for example.

    When I look back at how good our parents had it, with not tuition fees whatsoever and compare it to the current situation...it makes me want to cry :sigh:

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Updated: June 1, 2012
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