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BBC documentary on gay footballers

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white_haired_wizard
Anyone think Tyson Gay Homosexual is gay homosexual?


I hope someone gets this otherwise im gonna look like a pillock
I really don't understand how some of you are saying India and Pakistan not making a world cup isn't a good example of why Indian/Pakistani footballers aren't being scouted/signed.

So what if cricket is there national game or that they are pool , it is totally irrelevant. You people seem to be under the impression that I'm saying they aren't good enough purely on race, this isn't the case. The fact is these countries aren't producing players good enough for the premier league and that is why they aren't signed up to premiership clubs.

As the old saying goes , if they are good enough, they will make it.

Obviously players from countries who don't make the world cup can be good enough for the premier league but India and Pakistan aren't that is my point, it is NOTHING TO DO WITH SKIN COLOUR.
Reply 42
Smack
Strength relative to other players, yes, but relative to other athletes of strength/power sports, then I'll have to see it to believe it.

Well relative to a weightlifter no, but relative to a long distance runner it is important.

As you said yourself, it's important realtive to other players. Which is who footballers play football against isn't it?
EskimoJo
How would they promote homosexuality? :s-smilie:


They wouldn't "promote" homosexuality as it were. It's all about raising awareness and bringing people round to a new way of thinking. The players shouldn't be taunted by fans for being gay, but it happens.

Think the "Let's kick racism out of football" campaign from a few years back, but for homosexuality.
Reply 44
EskimoJo
Well, you said it's sad that there are no gays or that there are and they fear coming out. Don't worry, I get you now. You just wrote your sentence badly.
Perhaps you simply failed to understand it? Reading it back, it makes perfect sense. :teehee:
Reply 45
Probably because the gays are too busy painting their toe-nails or something.
Reply 46
Prince Rhyus
Is the problem with individuals, the institutions or the culture - or all three?

RobbieC
It is rather astonishing and very sad that there are no top level gay footballers... or that they fear they cannot be open with the team and their fans.

Saying that, you can't blame them if they do choose to stay concealed. They'd be torn apart, however much most people have changed.

Remember Justin Fashanu...


What makes you think there is a problem? Maybe not everyone feels the need to flaunt their sexuality in other peoples faces? Perhaps they have the good sense to realise that what is important is the quality of their football and not their sexual preferences?

Hell I'm straight and if I was famous I certainly wouldn't want every member of the general public knowing what I get up to in the bedroom, so why would gays be any different?

I think the only problem here is that of a politically correct society that requires everyone to advertise their sexuality, and then when people choose to keep it private, blames it on institutional homophobia.
Blue Rose Bowl
I highly doubt that a scout wouldn't try and get a player to sign because of their skin colour, I imagine scouts get bonuses for signing players that make it to the first team.

The arguement that "they aren't good enough" is a good one to be honest, like I said before when was the last time India/ Pakistan made it to the world cup if they can produce players that are good enough for the world cup then they would produce players good enough for the premiership.

But you seem to be implying that there are loads of premiership players hidden away in these countries.I really doubt it.

Face facts, these countries just aren't producing premiership level footballers.


There are millions of turkish people in Germany and many are footballers, no surprise there, the Turkish National Team is pretty decent itself. Also turkish people face fair bit of discrimination in Germany yet there are loads of german turkish players...

So yeah I agree.
Reply 48
Kreuzuerk
Every-time you ask a question in real life do you contort your face into a kind of squiggle?


If I'm confused/unsure about something, yes.
Reply 49
RobbieC
Perhaps you simply failed to understand it? Reading it back, it makes perfect sense.


Nope. You messed up. :hmmm:
Guvnor
Unfortunately not always, being white then black is a advantage especially in this country.


Well, if you are black, chances are you will have pace, pace, pace. And little technical skill. There are a few who buck the trend but that's often the case with other things. From what I've seen of the Japanese league there could be potential play makers there.
I watched this documentary and thought it was very insightful. However, I was disappointed by the very pro-Fashanu theme that pervaded the programme when proper consideration was not given to the fact that Fashanu had been accused, perhaps wrongly, of a serious crime in the USA. The point seemed to be put forward that Justin Fashanu killed himself because he was gay but it is arguable that that was simply not the case. I also didn't like the way they seemed to hint that his talent had been discriminated against because of his sexuality. All Forest fans will tell you that he was simply rubbish and bought because of one wonder goal he scored. The reason why he had so many clubs is because he wasn't very good.

All the other stories were very interesting. Clarke Carlisle was very articulate as usual. I personally think the BBC presented a POV that was a little extreme regarding football fans' attitudes towards sexuality. No doubt a player who came out would hear some chants from a minority of opposition fans, but so long as that was stamped down upon immediately, the fairer majority would soon come to the light and it would just be like anything else.
It is incredibly sad that gay footballers can't be open. The amount of homophobia is astonishing; even the great Brian Clough was a stinking homophobe, and I heard Rio Ferdinand once refusing to play along to a gay joke.
Reply 53
Guvnor
Unfortunately not always, being white then black is a advantage especially in this country.


I think that the issue lies at grass-roots level rather than for scouts. If the problem exists anywhere, I think it's at getting Asian players onto 11-a-side pitches at an early age. I've played with quite a few good asian players who specialise at short sided football but very few playing competitive 11-a-side which is where, in all seriousness, footballers are discovered.

Maybe, by and large Asian players lack the attributes to make it in the English game. That is not to say that they are bad players, not by any means but it's no secret that scouts will shun technical ability for physical prowess in many cases. Maybe Asian players are a generation away from making it, as they become more anglicised. Who knows?
Saw the documentary today - not that great really, nothing new about the content of it. See they slipped in the Pique and Ibra picture right at the very end of the programme...

People are understandably frightened to come out because of how their family and friends will perceive things, how fellow players and their club may perceive things, how the home and away fans will perceive things. Such a coming out will change the dynamic to so many things, rightly or wrongly...tis a shame but I can understand why football players are not willing to come out. Can't fully empathise because I'm straight myself. Anyway, it's their private life and why should they come out, do they really need to anyway?! Do we need them to come out ffs?! We don't have football players coming out as heterosexual, so why the big fuss over footballers who happen to be homosexual?

As for John Amaechi, he's got to be one of the most miserable people you can come across. I've read his book and the guy is a depressive tbh and he presented in much the same way in the aforementioned documentary. **** me, cheer up love.
izaldo
I think that the issue lies at grass-roots level rather than for scouts. If the problem exists anywhere, I think it's at getting Asian players onto 11-a-side pitches at an early age. I've played with quite a few good asian players who specialise at short sided football but very few playing competitive 11-a-side which is where, in all seriousness, footballers are discovered.

Maybe, by and large Asian players lack the attributes to make it in the English game. That is not to say that they are bad players, not by any means but it's no secret that scouts will shun technical ability for physical prowess in many cases. Maybe Asian players are a generation away from making it, as they become more anglicised. Who knows?


I've always felt that physical prowess was overrated and overstated in its importance in the English league, despite supporting the most powerful side in Europe, arguably. You won't compete with a team of major softies but not everyone needs to be made out of steel otherwise the likes of Modric and Arshavin would have moved on by now etc.
lm_wfc
It is.

If you watch anything other than the champions league strength is massively important. Some players really entirely on it.


Looking at the winners of the CL I can't see a team really known for strength/power outright. The closest was Chelsea.
aeonflux
What makes you think there is a problem? Maybe not everyone feels the need to flaunt their sexuality in other peoples faces? Perhaps they have the good sense to realise that what is important is the quality of their football and not their sexual preferences?

Hell I'm straight and if I was famous I certainly wouldn't want every member of the general public knowing what I get up to in the bedroom, so why would gays be any different?

I think the only problem here is that of a politically correct society that requires everyone to advertise their sexuality, and then when people choose to keep it private, blames it on institutional homophobia.

It's highly probable that there are gay players in the PL and elsewhere, and the fact none of them feel that they can be open about their sexuality is a sad state of affairs. No-one's expecting them to flaunt their sexuality in anyone's faces, or stage a feature length coming out TV special.
white_haired_wizard
We don't have football players coming out as heterosexual, so why the big fuss over footballers who happen to be homosexual?

I think they are pretty different things in this case...
Reply 59
NDGAARONDI
Looking at the winners of the CL I can't see a team really known for strength/power outright. The closest was Chelsea.

Did you read my post or just see 4 words you had read before and start bashing your keyboard?

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