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Computer science...need some advice
Hey guys,
I've been looking and thinking about different courses for a while and a few have caught my eye...
One is computer science, mainly because it appears to be highly regarded and also because it relates to what I want to do in the future, and something i'm fascinated by now
I've heard CS can open lots of doors for jobs in almost anything to do with computers..is this true?
Also, if someone could explain what you actually do in the course (maybe a brief summary of some key modules...including the most boring ones :P ) that would help so much as it would give me an idea
Most of the stuff ive read looks a bit misleading...it would be good to get feedback from someone who's done it before
Thanks so much!
I've been looking and thinking about different courses for a while and a few have caught my eye...
One is computer science, mainly because it appears to be highly regarded and also because it relates to what I want to do in the future, and something i'm fascinated by now
I've heard CS can open lots of doors for jobs in almost anything to do with computers..is this true?
Also, if someone could explain what you actually do in the course (maybe a brief summary of some key modules...including the most boring ones :P ) that would help so much as it would give me an idea
Most of the stuff ive read looks a bit misleading...it would be good to get feedback from someone who's done it before Thanks so much!
Scroll to see replies
I'm to start CS in September, so I won't be as helpful as a lot of the other members here, but I'll have a bash. The fundamentals of CS consist of (discrete) mathematics and algorithms. As I understand, this is the core of CS, but it contains a hell of a lot more; databases, programming, AI, robotics - it's extremely broad. There is a lot of programming in CS, some people will say that CS is primarily programming, but it's a means to an end. I can't remember who said this, it was a member here, but anyway it was something like "programming is to CS as writing is to English" - something along those lines (someone correct me if you remember 
). Anywho, to reiterate, CS is extremely broad. Some of the modules you're likely to encounter at a lot of Universities are:
- Programming (many paradigms, many languages).
- Mathematical (Discrete mathematics, probability, set theory and logic).
- Databases
- Machine Architecture.
- Operating Systems.
- Artificial Intelligence.
- Robotics.
- Networking.
These are only a small handful of the available modules, but they tend to be in most Uni CS courses. Hopefully someone currently doing CS / with a CS degree behind them can explain more for you. Good luck.
). Anywho, to reiterate, CS is extremely broad. Some of the modules you're likely to encounter at a lot of Universities are:- Programming (many paradigms, many languages).
- Mathematical (Discrete mathematics, probability, set theory and logic).
- Databases
- Machine Architecture.
- Operating Systems.
- Artificial Intelligence.
- Robotics.
- Networking.
These are only a small handful of the available modules, but they tend to be in most Uni CS courses. Hopefully someone currently doing CS / with a CS degree behind them can explain more for you. Good luck.
Sly-.-
some people will say that CS is primarily programming
And those people would be wrong.
Problem solving is the core really. A definition of computer science is the study of the theoretical foundations of information and computation, and of practical techniques for their implementation and application in computer systems.
There are many sub fields of computer science which gives it a really broad nature.
As stated above computer science is theoretical, for explicit programming it is more advisable for software engineering, most universities however provide an overlap of modules between computer science and software engineering and more often than not there is a software engineering module you can take as part of the computer science course.
Computer science while broad does not necessarily make you a super programmer out the gates with your diploma's a lot of students tend to fail the programming tests that most if companies will require before giving you a job as a programmer.
More information on the background of computer science can be obtained through the wikipedia page here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_science
It really depends on the course you're on, particularly with the amount of maths. I was on one course, couldn't hack it and switched to a second one which I graduated from with the minimum of fuss. The original course had theorems and lemmas but no calculations, and the second one had the odd equation which we were told we didn't need to know but it was there to provide context.
Yup, this is all fairly standard. However, robotics and AI might be pushing it a bit; some courses do cover it, but many don't.
Often, the maths is used to reinforce the underpinnings of other stuff, for example set theory is occasionally used to explain relational databases.
And those people would be wrong.
Don't know about that; like I say, I started one CS degree then transferred to another one (I couldn't hack the first, it got far too hard for me in second year) and graduated. Both of them were very programming heavy, with programming used as the primary means to reinforce and consolidate the material covered in lectures.
As I say, it really depends on the course you're on. However, what I will say is that there are plenty of courses marked as "Computer Science" which quickly disintegrate into four years of programming.
That's all well and good when considered atomically and in isolation as one might assume that programming is a practical skill to be cultivated and perfected by those who carry it out; however, it produces the ugly side effect of Universities producing thousands of mediocre code monkeys each year instead of well-rounded, capable Computer Science graduates. I've actually helped out on interview panels and have seen it myself - you get somebody with a 2.1 and a whole litany of half-learned programming languages, yet they can't solve any trivial arbitrary problem you present them with and any code they do write, in the languages that they know, is often quite poor. That's not what employers want. I know countless people who have studied computing/Computer Science over the years and I can only think of four who had a first job that wasn't programming - you either went straight into software development or you stayed on for a postgraduate qualification, and the same still appears to hold true.
However, I'll get flamed for providing a true picture of how it presents itself in reality, so I'll knock it off at this point. The "tl;dr" version of this is that you'll likely die of programming overload but it won't necessarily do you any favours.
This is very true. However, so many undergraduate degrees are programmer assembly lines and most of the interesting and broad things are forgotten the moment you enter your inevitable programming job upon graduation. I always heard from my younger, more recently graduated colleagues about all this cool stuff they'd done at University, but it was all in vain as they ended up in generic programming jobs.
The sad thing I've discovered is that most people I've known have been so burned out and sick of University by the time they finish their undergraduate years that they don't even want to consider postgraduate study. Problem is, this is usually where most of the fun stuff is lurking.
Me? I may be considered biased because I got pig sick of programming, thus leading to me retraining in computer security and digital forensics come September.
(sorry, this has lurched violently off-topic - but I hope it serves as a warning from history, if you like)
Sly-.-
- Programming (many paradigms, many languages).
- Mathematical (Discrete mathematics, probability, set theory and logic).
- Databases
- Machine Architecture.
- Operating Systems.
- Artificial Intelligence.
- Robotics.
- Networking.
- Programming (many paradigms, many languages).
- Mathematical (Discrete mathematics, probability, set theory and logic).
- Databases
- Machine Architecture.
- Operating Systems.
- Artificial Intelligence.
- Robotics.
- Networking.
Yup, this is all fairly standard. However, robotics and AI might be pushing it a bit; some courses do cover it, but many don't.
Often, the maths is used to reinforce the underpinnings of other stuff, for example set theory is occasionally used to explain relational databases.
ExcessNeo
Don't know about that; like I say, I started one CS degree then transferred to another one (I couldn't hack the first, it got far too hard for me in second year) and graduated. Both of them were very programming heavy, with programming used as the primary means to reinforce and consolidate the material covered in lectures.
As I say, it really depends on the course you're on. However, what I will say is that there are plenty of courses marked as "Computer Science" which quickly disintegrate into four years of programming.
That's all well and good when considered atomically and in isolation as one might assume that programming is a practical skill to be cultivated and perfected by those who carry it out; however, it produces the ugly side effect of Universities producing thousands of mediocre code monkeys each year instead of well-rounded, capable Computer Science graduates. I've actually helped out on interview panels and have seen it myself - you get somebody with a 2.1 and a whole litany of half-learned programming languages, yet they can't solve any trivial arbitrary problem you present them with and any code they do write, in the languages that they know, is often quite poor. That's not what employers want. I know countless people who have studied computing/Computer Science over the years and I can only think of four who had a first job that wasn't programming - you either went straight into software development or you stayed on for a postgraduate qualification, and the same still appears to hold true.
However, I'll get flamed for providing a true picture of how it presents itself in reality, so I'll knock it off at this point. The "tl;dr" version of this is that you'll likely die of programming overload but it won't necessarily do you any favours.
ExcessNeo
There are many sub fields of computer science which gives it a really broad nature.
This is very true. However, so many undergraduate degrees are programmer assembly lines and most of the interesting and broad things are forgotten the moment you enter your inevitable programming job upon graduation. I always heard from my younger, more recently graduated colleagues about all this cool stuff they'd done at University, but it was all in vain as they ended up in generic programming jobs.
The sad thing I've discovered is that most people I've known have been so burned out and sick of University by the time they finish their undergraduate years that they don't even want to consider postgraduate study. Problem is, this is usually where most of the fun stuff is lurking.
Me? I may be considered biased because I got pig sick of programming, thus leading to me retraining in computer security and digital forensics come September.
(sorry, this has lurched violently off-topic - but I hope it serves as a warning from history, if you like)
ch0llima
As I say, it really depends on the course you're on. However, what I will say is that there are plenty of courses marked as "Computer Science" which quickly disintegrate into four years of programming.
Yea, it does really depend on the course itself, I believe at least compared to American computer science courses, English universities are lacking.
That's all well and good when considered atomically and in isolation as one might assume that programming is a practical skill to be cultivated and perfected by those who carry it out; however, it produces the ugly side effect of Universities producing thousands of mediocre code monkeys each year instead of well-rounded, capable Computer Science graduates. I've actually helped out on interview panels and have seen it myself - you get somebody with a 2.1 and a whole litany of half-learned programming languages, yet they can't solve any trivial arbitrary problem you present them with and any code they do write, in the languages that they know, is often quite poor. That's not what employers want. I know countless people who have studied computing/Computer Science over the years and I can only think of four who had a first job that wasn't programming - you either went straight into software development or you stayed on for a postgraduate qualification, and the same still appears to hold true.
I was actually hinting at that problem somewhat in my post although you worded it better
I guess it's a case of some courses produce jack of all trades: mediocre in all aspects.Personally after I finish the computer science undergraduate degree I'll be starting in September I intend to continue at least at the moment into post graduate studies.
most of computer science courses involve
-facts and knowldge
like engineers you will learn about this device (computer) it contents and how it works..computers are not only electrice machine..it consist also of software which is human program to tell this machine how to perform.
then also of facts about the systems that run the computers, facts about how computers communicate.
in summary there alot of interesting facts in computer science. you will not belive that you miss them.
-Programming
in most courses in computer science you will be asked to write a program, this is how you will under stand the course. you will find it diffcult in the beginning coz the computer language is new for you. but you learn it once then you will use it with all course.
-problem solving
This is what is you will benfit the most after studing computer science. is how to slove life problems using the computer facts you learned and the programming language you practis. you will learn alot of ideas and algorithms (plans) to make computers as power as it is today
hope this help u a little
-facts and knowldge
like engineers you will learn about this device (computer) it contents and how it works..computers are not only electrice machine..it consist also of software which is human program to tell this machine how to perform.
then also of facts about the systems that run the computers, facts about how computers communicate.
in summary there alot of interesting facts in computer science. you will not belive that you miss them.
-Programming
in most courses in computer science you will be asked to write a program, this is how you will under stand the course. you will find it diffcult in the beginning coz the computer language is new for you. but you learn it once then you will use it with all course.
-problem solving
This is what is you will benfit the most after studing computer science. is how to slove life problems using the computer facts you learned and the programming language you practis. you will learn alot of ideas and algorithms (plans) to make computers as power as it is today
hope this help u a little
ch0llima
This is very true. However, so many undergraduate degrees are programmer assembly lines and most of the interesting and broad things are forgotten the moment you enter your inevitable programming job upon graduation. I always heard from my younger, more recently graduated colleagues about all this cool stuff they'd done at University, but it was all in vain as they ended up in generic programming jobs.
The sad thing I've discovered is that most people I've known have been so burned out and sick of University by the time they finish their undergraduate years that they don't even want to consider postgraduate study. Problem is, this is usually where most of the fun stuff is lurking.
This is very true. However, so many undergraduate degrees are programmer assembly lines and most of the interesting and broad things are forgotten the moment you enter your inevitable programming job upon graduation. I always heard from my younger, more recently graduated colleagues about all this cool stuff they'd done at University, but it was all in vain as they ended up in generic programming jobs.
The sad thing I've discovered is that most people I've known have been so burned out and sick of University by the time they finish their undergraduate years that they don't even want to consider postgraduate study. Problem is, this is usually where most of the fun stuff is lurking.
This is all very true.
Ahh this is really depressing now that I've read through this post, im thinking of studying computer science this september at either Royal Holloway or City University. Im currently learning C/C++ coding online(i feel it might be useful??). There's been some really depressing experiences is there some silver lining to this course?????
Riyo91
Ahh this is really depressing now that I've read through this post, im thinking of studying computer science this september at either Royal Holloway or City University. Im currently learning C/C++ coding online(i feel it might be useful??). There's been some really depressing experiences is there some silver lining to this course?????
What exactly is depressing? Go to a decent University, get a decent grade and I'm sure you'll be in demand. You can go into other sectors besides programming, but that's down to you; nothing is going to be handed to you. People get what they deserve. If you spend your 3+ years dossing, receive a mediocre grade and show no effort outside of lectures, don't be surprised if you're not in demand. Put the effort in, learn as much as you can inside and out of lectures and I'm sure you'll be fine.
Riyo91
Ahh this is really depressing now that I've read through this post, im thinking of studying computer science this september at either Royal Holloway or City University. Im currently learning C/C++ coding online(i feel it might be useful??). There's been some really depressing experiences is there some silver lining to this course?????
There's no depressing situation here.. computer science is awsome & interesting, and the high paid jobs follow. Rollaway is good for CS!
Riyo91
Ahh this is really depressing now that I've read through this post, im thinking of studying computer science this september at either Royal Holloway or City University. Im currently learning C/C++ coding online(i feel it might be useful??). There's been some really depressing experiences is there some silver lining to this course?????
The course is fun and interesting and not depressing
work can be very depressing though so choose wisely!TheQueenOfComputerScience
The course is fun and interesting and not depressing work can be very depressing though so choose wisely!
work can be very depressing though so choose wisely!Care to digress? I have read a lot of things about computer science graduate jobs on here and it has all been quite negative. What would you suggest to someone who wants a computer science related career that has capabilities beyond £35k?
I'm not late enough in the day to be job hunting so my knowledge isn't great but it's quite depressing.
EDIT
Care to digress? I have read a lot of things about computer science graduate jobs on here and it has all been quite negative. What would you suggest to someone who wants a computer science related career that has capabilities beyond £35k?
I'm not late enough in the day to be job hunting so my knowledge isn't great but it's quite depressing.
I'm not late enough in the day to be job hunting so my knowledge isn't great but it's quite depressing.
People will always pay for health, security and finance so specialise in one of those early and stick with it. There are other fields to specialise in which also give a good salary but I think alot of these are technology dependent and can become obsolete which you want to avoid when specialising. No point being an expert in something no one is interested in any more!
The people who end up in dead end jobs are often the ones who didn't plan where there career was going and took a testing job after their degree thinking "well I can always go into development". However they never get any development experience and get stuck in testing for good.
To get the interesting good jobs after CS I think the easiest route without being some kind of **** hot genius is to do a PhD in one of the aformentioned fields and then head to a nice well paid industry job after
or at least thats my plan.I'm about to start an MSc in Ethical Hacking/Security/Data Forensics type stuff. It's a developing area which I think will open quite a few doors for me in the future, and it offers real and exciting prospects compared to just stumbling into a generic Java/C# programming job the week after you graduate. No degree will ever be 100% comprehensive and nothing is ever presented on a silver platter by a butler, you will have to show drive and enthusiasm and do your own background reading but you will ultimately be rewarded with the prize of doing something you genuinely want to, instead of being a sheep and following every other graduate.
I won't go into great detail here, but software engineering or testing is absolutely hopeless as a career path. If you go into it (like a depressing and, IMO, excessive number of graduates do) your education and hard earned degree will have been an absolute waste of time, money and effort as there are plenty of people working in this sector that have never even set foot in a University. If you want me to go into further detail, by all means ask and I'll type up a more comprehensive outlining of the whole thing
As TheQueenOfComputerScience said, it's best to get into a stable sector in the long term as you'll always have some kind of job. However, I'm not sure that you desperately need a PhD but if you do then I'm ******
Maybe you disagree with my thoughts r.e. software engineering, so by all means argue if you so desire
I won't go into great detail here, but software engineering or testing is absolutely hopeless as a career path. If you go into it (like a depressing and, IMO, excessive number of graduates do) your education and hard earned degree will have been an absolute waste of time, money and effort as there are plenty of people working in this sector that have never even set foot in a University. If you want me to go into further detail, by all means ask and I'll type up a more comprehensive outlining of the whole thing
As TheQueenOfComputerScience said, it's best to get into a stable sector in the long term as you'll always have some kind of job. However, I'm not sure that you desperately need a PhD but if you do then I'm ******
Maybe you disagree with my thoughts r.e. software engineering, so by all means argue if you so desire
ch0llima
I'm about to start an MSc in Ethical Hacking/Security/Data Forensics type stuff. It's a developing area which I think will open quite a few doors for me in the future, and it offers real and exciting prospects compared to just stumbling into a generic Java/C# programming job the week after you graduate. No degree will ever be 100% comprehensive and nothing is ever presented on a silver platter by a butler, you will have to show drive and enthusiasm and do your own background reading but you will ultimately be rewarded with the prize of doing something you genuinely want to, instead of being a sheep and following every other graduate.
I won't go into great detail here, but software engineering or testing is absolutely hopeless as a career path. If you go into it (like a depressing and, IMO, excessive number of graduates do) your education and hard earned degree will have been an absolute waste of time, money and effort as there are plenty of people working in this sector that have never even set foot in a University. If you want me to go into further detail, by all means ask and I'll type up a more comprehensive outlining of the whole thing
As TheQueenOfComputerScience said, it's best to get into a stable sector in the long term as you'll always have some kind of job. However, I'm not sure that you desperately need a PhD but if you do then I'm ******
Maybe you disagree with my thoughts r.e. software engineering, so by all means argue if you so desire
I won't go into great detail here, but software engineering or testing is absolutely hopeless as a career path. If you go into it (like a depressing and, IMO, excessive number of graduates do) your education and hard earned degree will have been an absolute waste of time, money and effort as there are plenty of people working in this sector that have never even set foot in a University. If you want me to go into further detail, by all means ask and I'll type up a more comprehensive outlining of the whole thing
As TheQueenOfComputerScience said, it's best to get into a stable sector in the long term as you'll always have some kind of job. However, I'm not sure that you desperately need a PhD but if you do then I'm ******
Maybe you disagree with my thoughts r.e. software engineering, so by all means argue if you so desire
What jobs would you say one should target after graduating with a BSc in CS then? Please, do elaborate.
EDIT
Care to digress? I have read a lot of things about computer science graduate jobs on here and it has all been quite negative. What would you suggest to someone who wants a computer science related career that has capabilities beyond £35k?
I'm not late enough in the day to be job hunting so my knowledge isn't great but it's quite depressing.
I'm not late enough in the day to be job hunting so my knowledge isn't great but it's quite depressing.
Banking.
dinprobss
What jobs would you say one should target after graduating with a BSc in CS then? Please, do elaborate.
The problem is that computer science degrees in the UK focus, in my opinion, far too much on programming and software engineering. It's not just the course I did, as I know loads of people who have been on loads of different CS courses and all say the same thing.
As all this comes from BSc level, you're pretty much restricted to these kinds of jobs if that's your only qualification. My advice would be to move on and do a Masters or PhD - if you can't afford to do it full time, or just don't want to, then get a software engineering job and study part-time. It'll keep the money flowing and give you at least something to put on your CV.
Graduate software engineers/programmers are ten thousand-a-penny these days, with poorly paid jobs in poorly managed environments with dire promotion prospects. I know people who are only slightly older than me, with better qualifications, whose careers have stagnated and they're stuck forever.
Key growth areas in computing:
•
Business intelligence
•
Systems Analysis
•
Computer/Network Security
•
Information Security
•
Data Forensics
•
Hardware R&D
•
New networking technologies
•
Virtualisation and Cloud Computing
•
Consultancy of most kinds
Generic Java/.Net code bludgery for a non-descript financial organisation is a mug's game. Any idiot can do it and there is no pride in the work. One avenue I'm looking at is consultancy or some kind of business-facing role - the pay is generally a lot higher and you can delegate the grunt work to others.
ch0llima
The problem is that computer science degrees in the UK focus, in my opinion, far too much on programming and software engineering. It's not just the course I did, as I know loads of people who have been on loads of different CS courses and all say the same thing.
As all this comes from BSc level, you're pretty much restricted to these kinds of jobs if that's your only qualification. My advice would be to move on and do a Masters or PhD - if you can't afford to do it full time, or just don't want to, then get a software engineering job and study part-time. It'll keep the money flowing and give you at least something to put on your CV.
Graduate software engineers/programmers are ten thousand-a-penny these days, with poorly paid jobs in poorly managed environments with dire promotion prospects. I know people who are only slightly older than me, with better qualifications, whose careers have stagnated and they're stuck forever.
Key growth areas in computing:
Generic Java/.Net code bludgery for a non-descript financial organisation is a mug's game. Any idiot can do it and there is no pride in the work. One avenue I'm looking at is consultancy or some kind of business-facing role - the pay is generally a lot higher and you can delegate the grunt work to others.
As all this comes from BSc level, you're pretty much restricted to these kinds of jobs if that's your only qualification. My advice would be to move on and do a Masters or PhD - if you can't afford to do it full time, or just don't want to, then get a software engineering job and study part-time. It'll keep the money flowing and give you at least something to put on your CV.
Graduate software engineers/programmers are ten thousand-a-penny these days, with poorly paid jobs in poorly managed environments with dire promotion prospects. I know people who are only slightly older than me, with better qualifications, whose careers have stagnated and they're stuck forever.
Key growth areas in computing:
•
Business intelligence
•
Systems Analysis
•
Computer/Network Security
•
Information Security
•
Data Forensics
•
Hardware R&D
•
New networking technologies
•
Virtualisation and Cloud Computing
•
Consultancy of most kinds
Generic Java/.Net code bludgery for a non-descript financial organisation is a mug's game. Any idiot can do it and there is no pride in the work. One avenue I'm looking at is consultancy or some kind of business-facing role - the pay is generally a lot higher and you can delegate the grunt work to others.
You can always go into Investment banking (if your good enough) and finance and you can be a pilot tbh your not just restricted to the technology industry..
ashton.alfred
You can always go into Investment banking (if your good enough) and finance and you can be a pilot tbh your not just restricted to the technology industry..
There is a big difference between working at an investment bank and actually being an investment banker.
A CompSci degree alone will not allow you to be an investment banker, and working in an investment bank in technology back office is not the same.
Slick 'n' Shady
There is a big difference between working at an investment bank and actually being an investment banker.
A CompSci degree alone will not allow you to be an investment banker, and working in an investment bank in technology back office is not the same.
A CompSci degree alone will not allow you to be an investment banker, and working in an investment bank in technology back office is not the same.
you can work as an INVESTMENT BANKER if you go to a target uni with a computer science degree-2.1 min, and im not talking about the back office technical roles.. a CS degree from UCL for example with releveant work exp and EC will definatrely get you interview at an IB as degree doesnt matter as long as its quantitative, i know somone with a history degree from York who is an investment bankers working in M and I
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