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Women only want equality when it suits them!

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I thought one of the major current feminist arguments was that it is hugely unfair that one gender gets paid more per hour. This is a perfect case for this. Comparing Nadal and Williams winnings, it is clear that Serena gets paid more than double what Rafa gets per hour. They are both effectively performing the same job - playing tennis. I would actually go as far as to say that Nadal has also had to work harder per hour, under more stressful working conditions.

Feminists cannot be allowed to cherry pick battlegrounds that are only in womens interests. I hope (but do not expect) thousands of feminists will be protesting for equal pay for male tennis players. Even though this is a maor part of their ideology. Equal pay for equal work. :holmes:
Reply 61
hypothetical situation:

scneario 1:woman yelling at a man on the street & slaps him, people gather around and most if not all side with the woman even though they dont know what actually happened.

scenario 2:man yelling at a woman on the street & slaps her, people gather around and many would attack the man/verbally assault him despite of not knowing what actually happened.

i dont see women ever complaining of the sheer inequality there and favor towards women!!!!
Reply 62
Equality doesn't ******* exist anyway
Same with the retirement age
You have to admire Emile Heskey. After being kicked out of the world cup he gained the courage to put on a wig and a dress and go and win the Women's singles at Wimbledon.
Instead of using the feminist movement as a scapegoat. Why not realise there were a lot of women tennis players and tennis fans, who were calling for women to play the same amount of sets as the men. Maybe Wimbledon should be blamed for not making women and men play equal amount of sets. Instead you attack an entire movement of people who have no real active power to directly change these rules? Smart. Its like ethnic minorities wanting to be given equal consideration when being considered a job. Then the government introduces positive discrimination and then you go and create a thread attacking supporters of ethnic rights. But then fail to point the finger at the legislators who passed the law in the first place. As if those disadvantaged in life haven't got it tough already, you get people like you complaining about equal right movements legitimate desire for equality.

Once again, this is Wimbledon's doing. They set the rules, not the millions (maybe billions?) of pro women rights activists around the world. As if they all got together in some global conference and got Wimbledon to decide on how to pay women and men... right.
saalih
hypothetical situation:

scneario 1:woman yelling at a man on the street & slaps him, people gather around and most if not all side with the woman even though they dont know what actually happened.

scenario 2:man yelling at a woman on the street & slaps her, people gather around and many would attack the man/verbally assault him despite of not knowing what actually happened.

i dont see women ever complaining of the sheer inequality there and favor towards women!!!!
and? how does that in anyway devalue the case for equality between men and women? if anything you've highlighted the inequality in both men and women. In your hypothetical scenario the women are being treated unequal to the men too. They are being treated as weak damsel in distress and in need of protection. While the men are seen to be capable, strong and macho.

Besides I know women who will see a lady hit a man and not side with the lady. In fact a lot of women I know are very aggressive and defend men and women from other women all the time.

Yes its not the norm, but then surely its for society to construct and shape this expectation from men and women? that it is wrong to hit anyone, man or woman, unless its self defence.
Reply 67
Reformed2010
They are being treated as weak damsel in distress and in need of protection. While the men are seen to be capable, strong and macho.



wrong, women are treated royally and everyone is there to protect her, while men are usually on the wrong side and treated as criminals (talking about the hypothetical situation i posted earlier)

and this confirms the OP, women want equality when it suits them, they do not demand equality in situations where they get the better treatment...!!
Reply 68
Reformed2010
Instead of using the feminist movement as a scapegoat. Why not realise there were a lot of women tennis players and tennis fans, who were calling for women to play the same amount of sets as the men.


You think the women would still be playing 3 if they wanted to play 5? All they have to do is kick up a fuss, as they did about equal pay, and they'd be playing 5 sets in time for the US Open.
I think one of the main problems with feminism is that they seem to view the inequalities between men and women as a social construct as opposed to an evolutionary construct.
saalih
women want equality when it suits them, they do not demand equality in situations where they get the better treatment...!!

Holy ****.
You and I agree on something.
I never thought I'd see the day :biggrin:
Ape Gone Insane
Tennis is one of those sports where equal pay is not fair. Males play more sets, the pay should reflect their work.


Completely agree. A true feminist, who believes in total equality between the sexes, would see this as wrong, as the men should obviously get paid more.
Louis1991
Because I am a man and therefore not worth speaking to?

Bye then :sexface:


No, because you were trollin' and I was going to bed.

For what it's worth, I agree with you. I don't think women should get paid the same as men at Wimbledon because they don't play as much and aren't watched as much.
You clearly think that feminism = female sexism, so I'll just say that I believe in equal rights for women. Equal. I absolutely do not believe in making things artificially easy for women, and I abhor positive discrimination more than pretty much anything else in our society. Pay should be decided on merit.

If you had been willing to have a proper discussion instead of trollin' your ass off we would not have had such a futile exchange when we bloody agree with each other. :rolleyes:
Reply 73
Louis1991
No, no you did not make the tennis rules up. That is an important job, and therefore a man did it.

So you have a big rant at me, I respond, and i'm pissed off :rofl:

Far from it love.

The prize money was decided in full knowledge that the men would work harder, and in full knowledge that men bring more money into tennis than women. It was also decided in the knowledge that the women play less sets, which allows them to play doubles, and earn more than the men. Serena got paid more than Nadal this year. :facepalm2:

Wow, you really need to come up with an original comment, like mine was :colonhash:


It's exactly attitudes like yours that makes debates about this almost impossible :facepalm:

Your tone sounded pissed off, I offer my deepest apologies if I misinterpreted :rolleyes:

I think that you're not taking into account "effort". The men play more sets, but this doesn't necessarily mean they expend much more effort.

Let me explain. Men, by and large, are physically superior to women, hence why tennis is seprated by gender in the first place. If a man and a woman were to do exactly the same training programme and were then to compete against one another, the man would win (except in exceptional circumstances to do with gene disposition etc) - say they did a sprint. The woman working at full pelt would run slower than the man working at full pelt. Yet they would still be expending the same effort, and would feel pretty much the same whilst they were printing and in the aftermath. But if the woman wanted to produce as much output as the man, she would have to work that much harder. Similarly, if williams were to spend as much time playing as nadal, she would have to work much harder than he would have done to play for that time.
Therefore, if women had to do the same amount of sets to the men, the women would be wronged because they'd have to work harder for the same amount of money.
As usual with desert rewards, it's not necessarily fair, as what it essentially rewards is the natural lottery - the fact you were born a man rather than a woman, and hence can do more sets.

The current merit system they've set up of course also has it's flaws - the men in this instance are being screwed over.

The problem with things like this is that you can never really ever have a perfect way of sorting this out as whatever you do will be unfair in one way or another.

sighhhh I came up with the most stereotypical response to show how idiotic you were being.
Reply 74
~Kat~
Women make up over 50% of the population. Of course it would have been greater.
In standardised jobs men get paid more than women. This isn't equal.
These feminists obviosly have bad taste in porn :wink: for this, surely we should pity them?
They also call women who are comfortable with their sexuality wh*res and sl*ts and such. Hence we're back to the elitist fems. of which there are few and far between yet everyone knows of.
Most women I know have felt this way at least once. Little instances that add up to quite a lot in the long run. Very mundane things such as men being taken more seriously for the same claims, and don't even get me started on presentations.
I think it's fair to say I have no problems with self-esteem.

Is there actually any evidence that is true? I don't doubt that it happens on occasion, but does it really happen that much? I've never seen any evidence that still happens today.

What about jobs where pay is negotiable? In that situation it may well be that women are generally paid less for the same job, because they didn't negotiate as well.

Of course I agree that men and women should be paid equally for the same job. I'm just sceptical that women being paid less due to sexism is really that widespread.

As for the tennis thing, either way you spin it, it seems obvious to me that men should be paid more. The games are longer, and you could argue their job is to play well to attract more viewers, in which case the men are generally better at it anyway. Just like how female pornstars are paid more than male ones.
Reply 75
Psyk
Is there actually any evidence that is true? I don't doubt that it happens on occasion, but does it really happen that much? I've never seen any evidence that still happens today.

What about jobs where pay is negotiable? In that situation it may well be that women are generally paid less for the same job, because they didn't negotiate as well.

Of course I agree that men and women should be paid equally for the same job. I'm just sceptical that women being paid less due to sexism is really that widespread.

As for the tennis thing, either way you spin it, it seems obvious to me that men should be paid more. The games are longer, and you could argue their job is to play well to attract more viewers, in which case the men are generally better at it anyway. Just like how female porn stars are paid more than male ones.


I can't give you evidence but I have experience. You wouldn't notice it, it's not an isuue for the men as it is for the women so men who aren't interested in feminism don't generally look into it.
Jobs where pay is nogotiable is a completely different kettle of fish. It's not really relevant to this discussion.
Lets face it: tennis stars and all other atheletes are payed for their name. Take this world cup, Rooney played terrible, but he gets people tuning in because, well, he's Wayne Rooney. And you can bet he got a hefty sum for that.
And so they should be. They're terrific actresses :wink:
~Kat~
I can't give you evidence but I have experience. You wouldn't notice it, it's not an isuue for the men as it is for the women so men who aren't interested in feminism don't generally look into it.
Jobs where pay is nogotiable is a completely different kettle of fish. It's not really relevant to this discussion.
Lets face it: tennis stars and all other atheletes are payed for their name. Take this world cup, Rooney played terrible, but he gets people tuning in because, well, he's Wayne Rooney. And you can bet he got a hefty sum for that.
And so they should be. They're terrific actresses :wink:


Yup, and it all goes to charity. Just like all the England international pay they get.

And what you've said there doesn't say anything about the injustice that the women get paid the same as the men at Wimbledon? Illogical argument you've made there and I'm struggling to see the link between what was asked and what you've said.
Tbf, I don't care.

I doubt even male tennis players care that much.

So what?

P.S. Its not even that they are payed the same. Its just that prize money for both women and men in wimbledon are the same. Well, and a few other big tournaments.
Mm_Minty
It's exactly attitudes like yours that makes debates about this almost impossible :facepalm:

Your tone sounded pissed off, I offer my deepest apologies if I misinterpreted :rolleyes:


I think that you're not taking into account "effort". The men play more sets, but this doesn't necessarily mean they expend much more effort.

Let me explain. Men, by and large, are physically superior to women, hence why tennis is seprated by gender in the first place. If a man and a woman were to do exactly the same training programme and were then to compete against one another, the man would win (except in exceptional circumstances to do with gene disposition etc) - say they did a sprint. The woman working at full pelt would run slower than the man working at full pelt. Yet they would still be expending the same effort, and would feel pretty much the same whilst they were printing and in the aftermath. But if the woman wanted to produce as much output as the man, she would have to work that much harder. Similarly, if williams were to spend as much time playing as nadal, she would have to work much harder than he would have done to play for that time.
Therefore, if women had to do the same amount of sets to the men, the women would be wronged because they'd have to work harder for the same amount of money.
As usual with desert rewards, it's not necessarily fair, as what it essentially rewards is the natural lottery - the fact you were born a man rather than a woman, and hence can do more sets.

The current merit system they've set up of course also has it's flaws - the men in this instance are being screwed over.

The problem with things like this is that you can never really ever have a perfect way of sorting this out as whatever you do will be unfair in one way or another.

sighhhh I came up with the most stereotypical response to show how idiotic you were being.


We tend to keep emotions out the way of logic, so forget that one.

But as for the rest, well, what can I say about the rest?

I'll tell you what I can say about the rest, what I can say about the rest is that you've convinced yourself that it's right that the women get the same as the men simply because they were born women (annoyingly for them) and that's not their fault.

Applying the same (ill)logic, a footballer shouldn't earn more than some everyman because he's only in his current position due to the 'natural lottery', which he seems to have won.

You can't use some hair-brained argument in one instance then BAM, it no longer applies just because it doesn't suit you.
Reply 79
WithFlyingColours
Yup, and it all goes to charity. Just like all the England international pay they get.

And what you've said there doesn't say anything about the injustice that the women get paid the same as the men at Wimbledon? Illogical argument you've made there and I'm struggling to see the link between what was asked and what you've said.


What's done with their earnings is irrelevant though. It's all about the price of people.

It's already been addressed earlier on in this thread that Wimbledon is a bad example. It's the Fame Game, same as football, it hardly counts. What I said in the post that you've quoted was to tell the other person that the figures from the OPs post were invalid. You need to look at more standardised jobs to get the real picture.

If you care so much about what I have to say I already have quite a few posts on this thread that make it clear where I stand.

And to be honest I'm struggling to see the link between this topic and your post.

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