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God did NOT create the universe

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Charzhino

Merely an opinion. It exists, because it is spontanoues due to gravity? Doesnt make sense.

Why not? That's the theory, and under the physical laws we know and the theories we've found to be true so far (e.g. Einsteinian relativity), exactly that can happen. The person who wrote the article probably doesn't understand the ideas going on there, and might not explain it in a way that most people will understand it, or even understand it correctly (these are 40 years+ PhDs in physics, no wonder).

Reply 41

v-zero

The greater question of how existence came to be, not just how our Universe came to be, is insoluble. It is ridiculous to chase such nonsense, just as ridiculous as it is to invent a God to make sense of things.

Anybody intelligent can see that no God, nor any process within our understanding of our own Universe, can negate the fact that we percieve through causality as we know it, and as such we cannot invent any theory that we can also understand which negates the requirement for further theories. There is no solution that we can possibly hope to grasp, let alone discover.

Reply 42

Aphotic Cosmos

Dusk Shard

Sciance can no longer Anser the big question. What do you prefer? The idea that your whole existance is but an accident and that you have no purpose? Or that some one who loves you created you to do some good in a world that is full of hollow values and sadness. Were it not for religon there would be no Christian aid. There would be no married couples most children today grow up fatherless because marriage is no longer valued. I admit religonus leaders abuse their power but the every day people are good and caring

I much prefer the idea that my life is random, accidental. It makes me value both my life and the life of other people and organisms more than I ever did when I was an admittedly half-hearted theist. The knowledge of just how infinitesimal the odds were in all the events occurring that lead to my existence is reassuring in some way, affirming of my existence.

Purpose, if it is even necessary for a meaningful existence, is derived from life experiences that shape our views of the world and the actions that we believe we need to take. It has nothing to do with the existence or non-existence of god. Lack of belief in god does not lead to a purposeless, loveless life without meaning. On the contrary, I now know exactly what I want to do with my life (become a research scientist), I know exactly what my life and other life is worth, I know that my time on this earth is finite and there's nothing coming after it, and as such I should make the most of it, I know what my life means. I never knew any of that as a theist.

Reply 43

Clubber Lang

Aphotic Cosmos

Promotes love and peace? That's good craic!

Religion does not bring happiness, only delusions and wasted energy.

knowing a lot of religious people... disagree massivley

Reply 44

WhatAboutYe

Aphotic Cosmos

Honestly couldn't have said it any better! :yep:

Reply 45

tazarooni89

abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz

not really no

that's just a very convenient way for a theist to get out of a sticky situation.

I'm willing to bet that people once believed that god created the universe however when science discovered more they just said

"lols, the bibles wasn't actually serious, it was all a metaphor derpa derp :awesome:

" (yes they also made that face)

Maybe they did. But in this particular case, Hawking's comments would not have even caused a sticky situation for many theists, because it only addresses one particular type of "creation", which is not the type that these theists believed in to begin with.

According to this believe (which has been common long before Hawking said any of this stuff by the way, especially amonst Dharmic religions), God does not just create the universe, in the same way that I create a sandwich or something. Rather, God creates a sequence of events that occur in time frames from which he is independent - maybe somewhat analogous to what a person does when they imagine a story, or have a dream etc.
There are plenty of theists who therefore not only describe God as the creator of the universe, but also as the sustainer of the universe.

Reply 46

The ELECTRO-LEOPARD

Is it me or is the article an oversimplification? It looks to me that what he's saying is, God did not necessarily create the universe, which is different from outright claiming that he didn't.

Reply 47

Dirac Delta Function

Stephen Hawking

Spontaneous creation is the reason there is something rather than nothing, why the universe exists, why we exist.

I wasn't hoping for anything earth-shattering, but a little better than this.

With respect to Prof Hawking, this is not a new idea, I'm sure the Greek and Muslim philosophers entertained this notion quite seriously. So I will put this down to crap journalism and look forward to reading his book. :woo:

Reply 48

Bilco

digistar_100

Just because he says it doesnt make it true. He actually hasnt said anything new, I was expecting some sort of new discovery...

If anyone is going to have a shot at explaining this question with a logical answer its Hawking.

I know I have spoke to you before. I assume from your sig you are a Muslim. Take the first line of your post and apply it to every religious book, article and speech you have seen :wink:

Reply 49

Bilco

The ELECTRO-LEOPARD

Is it me or is the article an oversimplification? It looks to me that what he's saying is, God did not necessarily create the universe, which is different from outright claiming that he didn't.

Although I have not read much of his work I can't see Hawking being stupid enough to outright say god does not exist since it is a possibility for the universe just like aliens are.

Reply 50

Idiot-Finder

Clubber Lang

knowing a lot of religious people... disagree massivley

Most of the wars in the world are thanks to religion.

Reply 51

Clubber Lang

Idiot-Finder

Most of the wars in the world are thanks to religion.

irrelevant to my point

Reply 52

jasbirsingh

"Because there is a law such as gravity, the universe can and will create itself from nothing"

Reply 53

Ben77mc

Why does the url say: Stephen-Hawking-God-did-create-Universe.html

Reply 54

Dirac Delta Function

jasbirsingh

"Because there is a law such as gravity, the universe can and will create itself from nothing"

Perhaphs you could explain to me, what did gravity act upon for the creation to take place?

Reply 55

Srxjer

To some of the posts in this thread: "Talk sense to a fool and he calls you foolish" - Euripides.

Reply 56

jasbirsingh

Dirac Delta Function

....

The point of that big nothing was that I always find it hard to accept that "Nothing is not nothing" or universe started out from nothing

Reply 57

Aphotic Cosmos

Ben77mc

Why does the url say: Stephen-Hawking-God-did-create-Universe.html

Eets thuh Ihloominahtee fillin our buh-rayns wid sub-conshus messijin tellin us about the thu-eyist conspiraycee.

Reply 58

TinFish

Do I see a hole in his throat in the picture? Maybe that's where the second universe is hiding.

Reply 59

Lewk

however much i agree with him that god is just a fairy tale, i think he's a bit crazy with thinking we'l die out in the next 200 years if we don't make gigantic space ships