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TomU
Well i'm back from a rather... interesting... day at college.

Some news on the maths issue today, but firstly there's also a lot of talk about it at our college amongst many students on the maths issue, and the crux of the matter seems to be - if you're planning on doing a maths intensive degree, you need to do at least maths equivalence on your access course, possibly even level 3 (A Level) equivelant, depending on the uni.

However, now for the interesting news (for me anyway): Initially, when we started the course, we were told that maths was a compulsory module if you'd done your GCSE maths more than 3 years ago. Now, a lot of people that got their maths GCSE C grade more than 3 years ago (myself included) have been complaining because of the difficulty level of the maths work we've been doing (it's insanely easy, an example question from today is 18 + 10 = ??) - and we all feel like our time would be better spent working towards distinctions in other subjects. The fact that there are also more than 50 people attending the class in a room that will only comfortably fit around 30 is also an issue.

Well, basically our course manager told us today that the maths equivelancy is actually not compulsory if you've already got the C grade at GCSE, irrespective of when you got the certificate, but to be safe we'd better check with the uni's we want to apply to.

I've had email responses from Cambridge, Southampton and Birmingham (all on my top 5 list) that have explicitly said that since I have a GCSE grade C in maths, I do not need to do the maths equivelancy. Fantastic news for me, because (assuming Warwick also say the same) i'll be able to drop maths and save those 3 hours for working on something far more productive than 18 + 10. Result!

In other news, i've finally been given the Henley College UCAS buzzword today, so i'm getting on with my UCAS application - i've managed to get my personal statement down to a point where it fits nicely into the allowed space and i've just got to go through filling out my previous academic qualifications etc. I'll also need to chase my tutor up for an academic reference.

In other news today, i've completed the finishing touches on my first IT assignment on word processing (worth 3 credits at level 3) - IT must be the easiest 18 credits at level 3 in the world!

We've been given our second Comms assignment, which isn't due until December (Thinking excercises) - but we also now know that after we've completed our first 6 credits in Comms (at level 2 or 3) we don't need to do any more comms for the entire year, if we don't want to.

So it looks like my credit make-up for the year will (hopefully) be:

Comms - (at least) 6 credits @ level 3
ICT - max 18 credits @ level 3
Psychology - 18 credits @ level 3
Law - 18 credits @ level 3
Study skills - unknown amount, but can be gained at level 2 or 3.

Total - 60 credits @ level 3

Hopefully this combination is allowed, but i've got another interview with my tutor on Monday where i'm going to hopefully iron everything out once and for all!


by the way Tom if you dont mind me asking how you finding the psychology and study skills part of your Access course? if i can be of help/advice with regards to psychology let me know Tom.:yep:

Looking at your access course sounds fascinating subjectwise.I think i need to look at doing one that has a substantial biology element next year along with some other modules.I know what i seen on some college websites the general theme is IT,Studyskills alongside what level 3 modules you take.
I already have a ECDL in IT so probably cope with The IT part of the access next year with no problems.
Also i am glad you managed to sort out what you need to sort out and i dont think if like you said you have a GCSE In Mathematics at a C grade and above you shouldnt need to take the GCSE Maths equivalent part of the course.I will have to lookinto that myself next year thats if i pass my maths in 2011
Reply 41
TomU


Comms - (at least) 6 credits @ level 3
ICT - max 18 credits @ level 3
Psychology - 18 credits @ level 3
Law - 18 credits @ level 3
Study skills - unknown amount, but can be gained at level 2 or 3.

Total - 60 credits @ level 3


I like the breakdown of your course, it looks a bit better balanced than mine. You will also have a good starting point in Law when you get to Uni with those 18 credits.

My course is along the lines of 39 @ level3 in ICT/Computing, 5 @ level 3 'computer maths' and 10 @ level 3 Study / IPC Skills.

Please be aware that when it comes to UCAS you have to enter each credit / module & level individually which is really time consuming and it is easy to make a mistake.



accesstohe
Basically all respectable Universities require at least a grade C in GCSE Maths


What do you class as respectable?
Reply 42
I think that by respectable he probably means top 20-30 by league ranking, or uni's that are not ex-poly.
Reply 43
Hi Tom out of curiosity, which college at Cambridge have you been liaising with? I recently attended an open day for mature students & a tutor from one college was very discouraging of access students, so much so that at the end of the talks no one opted for tour of his college.
Reply 44
looking through this thread it seems that every access course is different!

My course consists of
Psychology/Biology
Literary Studies (plus additional GCSE equivalence in English if required/wanted)
Sociology/Health Studies
Maths (plus additional GCSE equivalence if required/wanted)
IT
Study Skills

The course seems to be primarily aimed at students wishing to go on into Nursing or Midwifery, a precedent that has developed over the years.

The college is split across two campuses (in different towns) and the access course at each campus is different!

I have to agree with you on the maths, its been pretty basic so far, spending the first three weeks on looking at adding, subtracting, multiplying and dividing. Hopefully it will get a bit more involved at some point! The strange thing is that the students were required to carry out an assessment as part of the admission process and it was far more advanced that the maths we are being taught now.
Reply 45
Orianne
Hi Tom out of curiosity, which college at Cambridge have you been liaising with? I recently attended an open day for mature students & a tutor from one college was very discouraging of access students, so much so that at the end of the talks no one opted for tour of his college.


I've been talking to Hughes Hall, they seem to be encouraging and welcoming of Access students. Not sure about the others, but from what I've read, if you don't meet the conditions for one college then they may automatically consider you for another anyway.

In other news, all of my other uni choices have come back to me today and confirmed that there's no need for me to continue with the maths GCSE equivelance, so i'm going to drop that and spend those 3 hours on a Tuesday morning doing productive work in the LRC instead :smile:

Loving it :smile:
Reply 46
Martin199
looking through this thread it seems that every access course is different!


Yes, that is certainly the case. The official title of my qualification will be:Access to Higher Education Diploma (Combined Studies).

Henley also offer other defined pathways to things like social work etc, where your subjects/credit pathways are sorted for you prior to starting the course, but the combined studies option effectively allowed me to pick and choose what options I did and how many credits I wanted to do in each subject to make up the total of 60 credits.
BigV
I like the breakdown of your course, it looks a bit better balanced than mine. You will also have a good starting point in Law when you get to Uni with those 18 credits.

My course is along the lines of 39 @ level3 in ICT/Computing, 5 @ level 3 'computer maths' and 10 @ level 3 Study / IPC Skills.

Please be aware that when it comes to UCAS you have to enter each credit / module & level individually which is really time consuming and it is easy to make a mistake.





What do you class as respectable?


Basically a University that ranks OK in the league tables and has a high grad employment rate. Ex-polys and lesser Universities sometimes do have high grad job rates, but if you look on unistats, i.e the jobs economics grads from warwick end up with after graduation is something like 30% business analysts 30% financial analysts and other highly paid grad jobs, where as economics grads from somewhere like hull that has quite a high grad employment rate, have jobs that don't pay so much. But even Hull require at least a C in GCSE Maths and English.

Universities like London Met, Middlesex etc that may allow entry to those without a GCSE grade have terrible statistics on the sort of jobs the very low percentage of grads actually end up with.
The admissions tutor at Cambridge (Wolfson) has been wonderful. She asked me to send her in details of my access course (modules subects etc) to her by post in order for her to assess whether or not I would be eligible to apply for the Land Economy degree. Got an email from her the other day saying that providing I do get 45 credits at Distinction, then my application will be considered. Not sure if I will definitely apply but I am seriously considering it!
TomU
I think that by respectable he probably means top 20-30 by league ranking, or uni's that are not ex-poly.


Basically this, although I will be applying to Essex as one of my choices because they have a great reputation for Economics, it isn't my first choice though. Loughborough is something like number 9 in the league tables, but an Economics graduate from Essex is probably at an advantage over an Economics grad at Loughborough.

I wouldn't go to a University that people/employers look down upon, would rather not go to University atall tbh - or wait an extra year to partake in something that will boost my chances of getting into a respectable one.
(edited 13 years ago)
Reply 50
accesstohe
Basically a University that ranks OK in the league tables and has a high grad employment rate. Ex-polys and lesser Universities sometimes do have high grad job rates, but if you look on unistats, i.e the jobs economics grads from warwick end up with after graduation is something like 30% business analysts 30% financial analysts and other highly paid grad jobs, where as economics grads from somewhere like hull that has quite a high grad employment rate, have jobs that don't pay so much. But even Hull require at least a C in GCSE Maths and English.

Universities like London Met, Middlesex etc that may allow entry to those without a GCSE grade have terrible statistics on the sort of jobs the very low percentage of grads actually end up with.


Ok, I'm not baiting here, but just out of interest would you even consider Unis like De Montfort, Coventry, Aston... etc?

I'm feeling a bit stressed and confused today. I'm doing Access to Computing, a course I was lead to believe would (obviously?) lead me to University study of Computing or Computer Science related subjects.....

Only now I have started doing my Ucas and digging a bit deeper, it seems like this route is not widely accepted. They want A-level maths or GCSE maths B+ equivalents, neither of which my course provides.

Plus I am actually finding that the Ex-polys are running some interesting looking courses. - Now obviously I want to get a job after studying so it is important that the degree is worth something, but at the same time I have no desire to reinvent thewheel..............

There is so much snobbery around this issue that I cannot decide whether or not I would just be burning 20k and 4 years of my life by studying at DMU or other Ex-poly.

People talk about graduate jobs... banking, project managment or whatever, but I've been unemployed for the last X number of years, I just want to make myself employable again and get myself in a situation where I can maybe get on the housing ladder one day, I'm not sure if a degree from Oxbridge is necessary for that?


ps... sorry for the thread hijack!
(edited 13 years ago)
BigV
Ok, I'm not baiting here, but just out of interest would you even consider Unis like De Montfort, Coventry, Aston... etc?

I'm feeling a bit stressed and confused today. I'm doing Access to Computing, a course I was lead to believe would (obviously?) lead me to University study of Computing or Computer Science related subjects.....

Only now I have started doing my Ucas and digging a bit deeper, it seems like this route is not widely accepted. They want A-level maths or GCSE maths B+ equivalents, neither of which my course provides.

Plus I am actually finding that the Ex-polys are running some interesting looking courses. - Now obviously I want to get a job after studying so it is important that the degree is worth something, but at the same time I have no desire to reinvent thewheel..............

There is so much snobbery around this issue that I cannot decide whether or not I would just be burning 20k and 4 years of my life by studying at DMU or other Ex-poly.

People talk about graduate jobs... banking, project managment or whatever, but I've been unemployed for the last X number of years, I just want to make myself employable again and get myself in a situation where I can maybe get on the housing ladder one day, I'm not sure if a degree from Oxbridge is necessary for that?


ps... sorry for the thread hijack!


I would definitely do a degree at Aston but not at DMU or Coventry. Why don't you book yourself in as a private candidate with edexcel and self study GCSE Maths, you don't have to take the exam until June!

The majority of people who attend ex-polys probably do so because they were not clever enough to meet other Universities requirements. It would be a shame for someone to go to a less respected University just because they didn't meet a GCSE requirement but did well on their Access course, would be like wasted potential.

If you are interested in registering as an external candidate with edexcel let me know, I can provide you with an email adress which you can email and then they will reply with a list of centres nearest to you where you can take the exam...for some reason they don't give the info over the phone :dontknow:

What do you mean by the housing ladder?
BigV
Ok, I'm not baiting here, but just out of interest would you even consider Unis like De Montfort, Coventry, Aston... etc?

I'm feeling a bit stressed and confused today. I'm doing Access to Computing, a course I was lead to believe would (obviously?) lead me to University study of Computing or Computer Science related subjects.....

Only now I have started doing my Ucas and digging a bit deeper, it seems like this route is not widely accepted. They want A-level maths or GCSE maths B+ equivalents, neither of which my course provides.

Plus I am actually finding that the Ex-polys are running some interesting looking courses. - Now obviously I want to get a job after studying so it is important that the degree is worth something, but at the same time I have no desire to reinvent thewheel..............

There is so much snobbery around this issue that I cannot decide whether or not I would just be burning 20k and 4 years of my life by studying at DMU or other Ex-poly.

People talk about graduate jobs... banking, project managment or whatever, but I've been unemployed for the last X number of years, I just want to make myself employable again and get myself in a situation where I can maybe get on the housing ladder one day, I'm not sure if a degree from Oxbridge is necessary for that?


ps... sorry for the thread hijack!


I'd say just sit an an external candidate for GCSE Maths, it's only that one small thing you need to do then you're sorted. Loads of respected Universities would only require a C to do computer science related subjects I think, but their are probably alot that want a B.

It can easily be done plus edexcel have free past papers on their website oor you can order them from Amazon, all you need is a C or above in GCSE Maths then your options are so much wider and you'll probably get a better job having gone to a better uni.
Reply 53
accesstohe
I would definitely do a degree at Aston but not at DMU or Coventry. Why don't you book yourself in as a private candidate with edexcel and self study GCSE Maths, you don't have to take the exam until June!

The majority of people who attend ex-polys probably do so because they were not clever enough to meet other Universities requirements. It would be a shame for someone to go to a less respected University just because they didn't meet a GCSE requirement but did well on their Access course, would be like wasted potential.

If you are interested in registering as an external candidate with edexcel let me know, I can provide you with an email adress which you can email and then they will reply with a list of centres nearest to you where you can take the exam...for some reason they don't give the info over the phone :dontknow:

What do you mean by the housing ladder?


Hi, I mean I have a long term goal of being able to buy a flat rather than living with family or renting forever.

Secondly (again not baiting), I think your comment about ex-poly students being too dim to attend better is a bit short sighted to be honest.
I mean do you include all nursing/radiographers/physio/ other allied healthcare professionals in that statement? Because many (all?) of those people will have been educated at an ex-poly.


Also for example, Aston is higher ranked over all than DMU, but it is lower ranked for my subject choice (76 vs 59), and Aston recently went DOWN where as DMU has been going UP.

So can you see why I am confused? :eek3: :eek3:

ps: yes I would like that email please. I am now thinking it may be worth taking the GCSE so that I can apply to Loughborough.
(edited 13 years ago)
BigV
Hi, I mean I have a long term goal of being able to buy a flat rather than living with family or renting forever.

Secondly (again not baiting), I think your comment about ex-poly students being too dim to attend better is a bit short sighted to be honest.
I mean do you include all nursing/radiographers/physio/ other allied healthcare professionals in that statement? Because many (all?) of those people will have been educated at an ex-poly.


Also for example, Aston is higher ranked over all than DMU, but it is lower ranked for my subject choice (76 vs 59), and Aston recently went DOWN where as DMU has been going UP.

So can you see why I am confused? :eek3: :eek3:

ps: yes I would like that email please. I am now thinking it may be worth taking the GCSE so that I can apply to Loughborough.


[email protected] - you'll need to say what exam you are interested in taking out of A Level, IGCSE, GCSE etc e.g. GCSE Maths, then where you live and how far you're willing to travel, when you are interested in taking the examination (June is the only month available for Maths GCSE) and then end the email with something like "Please can you get back to me informing me of all the test centres that I can get in touch with to register"...they should get back within a week, I got a response within 2 days.

I noticed alot of future Healthcare professionals are at ex polys as well, not sure why it is tbh, I only know about the reputation of Business/Economics courses from an ex poly. The only ex poly I would attend is Surrey!
accesstohe
I would definitely do a degree at Aston but not at DMU or Coventry. Why don't you book yourself in as a private candidate with edexcel and self study GCSE Maths, you don't have to take the exam until June!

The majority of people who attend ex-polys probably do so because they were not clever enough to meet other Universities requirements. It would be a shame for someone to go to a less respected University just because they didn't meet a GCSE requirement but did well on their Access course, would be like wasted potential.

If you are interested in registering as an external candidate with edexcel let me know, I can provide you with an email adress which you can email and then they will reply with a list of centres nearest to you where you can take the exam...for some reason they don't give the info over the phone :dontknow:

What do you mean by the housing ladder?


I totally disagree with your ex-polys statement access to he i am afraid.I went to ex-poly because it did the degree i wanted to do and i liked what i saw.I also got offers from the more established and reputable universities who werent ex-polys.I dont think you should class students who apply to ex-poly for some reason or the other as not intelligent enough to get into the likes of more established universities like Cambridge,Durham and others i can mention.:yep:
wizardtop
I totally disagree with your ex-polys statement access to he i am afraid.I went to ex-poly because it did the degree i wanted to do and i liked what i saw.I also got offers from the more established and reputable universities who werent ex-polys.I dont think you should class students who apply to ex-poly for some reason or the other as not intelligent enough to get into the likes of more established universities like Cambridge,Durham and others i can mention.:yep:


I didn't mean all ex-poly students aren't intelligent enough...but for the majority it's obviously the reason. I highly doubt soomebody with their head screwed on would refuse offers from Universities such as Cambridge and Durham to attend an ex-poly!
Reply 57
BigV

Only now I have started doing my Ucas and digging a bit deeper, it seems like this route is not widely accepted. They want A-level maths or GCSE maths B+ equivalents, neither of which my course provides.


The University of Warwick website states for their G400 access course:

"Access Courses: Access to HE Diploma (QAA-recognised) including appropriate subjects with distinction grades in level 3 units, and grade B in A level Mathematics or equivalent."

Well I know for a fact that my access course has an option of advanced mathematics which is the equivelant of an A level... Does your access course not have that option? Surely if you could do that then that'd be acceptable to some unis?
(edited 13 years ago)
Reply 58
TomU
re maths?


i have my maths and english GCSEs and at my college regardless of when you took them if you provide a photocopy they are doing accreditation of prior learning so we get the new equivalent in with our access course anyway.

Is it just me who is finding my access is really starting easy we are in 3 days a week doing 3 sciences and only have 1.5hrs in each and as i have maths/english i dont have to go to those lessons anymore and also had a simple IT portfolio in for december but it took me like 2 hours so have already handed it in and been evicted from those lessons too...

Am getting a bit bored and finding that all this time i am meant to be spending in the library i dont really have anything to do..not helped by the fact that the college settings on the internet will not let me access anything to do with my chosen profession as it thinks i am accessing banned material as it is radiotheRAPIST and cancer treatments and DRUGS which have now formulated an email sent to my tutor where disciplinary action may be taken hahahaha
Reply 59
janesies
i have my maths and english GCSEs and at my college regardless of when you took them if you provide a photocopy they are doing accreditation of prior learning so we get the new equivalent in with our access course anyway.

Is it just me who is finding my access is really starting easy we are in 3 days a week doing 3 sciences and only have 1.5hrs in each and as i have maths/english i dont have to go to those lessons anymore and also had a simple IT portfolio in for december but it took me like 2 hours so have already handed it in and been evicted from those lessons too...

Am getting a bit bored and finding that all this time i am meant to be spending in the library i dont really have anything to do..not helped by the fact that the college settings on the internet will not let me access anything to do with my chosen profession as it thinks i am accessing banned material as it is radiotheRAPIST and cancer treatments and DRUGS which have now formulated an email sent to my tutor where disciplinary action may be taken hahahaha


Wow, that is crazy. I have seen people on facebook, ebay and other questionable sites at our college - I can't believe yours has such strict filtering that you cannot even access info about radiotherapy!

On the maths: Two of us on the course asked about additional maths lessons yesterday and the response was a blank stare & promise that it would be looked in to further... so I'm not feeling positive about that.

My tutor also checked over my UCAS and seemed surprised to discover I had no other qualifications apart from the Access course "what, nothing else at all?" - I don't know if that is a bad sign or not..!!

I'm also a bit fed up as I feel I am actually struggling to understand what is required of me on the latest assignment. The assignment brief is badly worded (IMO) and I know I'm not the only one a bit confused, but I had it explained 3 times and I'm still not 100%.

Plus, I feel a bit perplexed about the course content. I assumed it would include more programming, computational mathematics & scientific-y type moduels, but a lot of it is airy-fairy fluff.

For example,a module called ''IT in the work place'' involved watching a DVD about different types of organisations (public,private,charitable, PLC, sole trader etc etc), and then splitting into groups to create a presentation explaining the need for these organisations to exist and provide examples of different types/sizes etc..... or basically regurgitating in info on the DVD. Completely ******* pointless and of no interest to a group of students who want to study things like Computer Science, Games Programming or Artificial Intelligence & Robotics at Uni.



I'm determinded to stick this course out, but I wouldn't be surprised if I find myself back at college next year doing an A-level (or equivalent) in order to actually get into a Uni of my choice.

I'm glad you guys are getting on well with your courses, but I think people need to be aware that the content does vary a lot. I guess I should have asked more questions and done more research on entry standard at Uni before enrolling.

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