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B304 - Nationalisation of Buses Bill 2010 (Third Reading)

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    Nationalisation of Buses Bill 2010 - TSR Liberal Democrat/TSR Socialist
    A bill taking some of the remaining parts of the Public Transport system into public ownership for the benefit of the people.

    BE IT ENACTED by The Queen's most Excellent Majesty, by and with the advice and consent of the Commons in this present Parliament assembled, in accordance with the provisions of the Parliament Acts 1911 and 1949, and by the authority of the same, as follows:-

    1. Public Ownership of Passenger Services
    (a) The various companies that run bus services and all their assets (buses, etc.) shall be bought out using treasury funds over the course of five years after this bill comes into effect.
    (i) The price paid for the companies and their assets will be 90p per share, this would cost an estimated £9 billion for the largest three transport operators (First, Arriva and Stagecoach).
    (ii) For Local Authority owned Bus Companies ie Ipswich Buses they will continue as per normal unless the Local Authority wishes to sell the Company and its routes and assets to the government.
    (b) The companies, once bought, shall still handle the passenger infrastructure for their assigned region and shall be given control by the various Public Transport Regional Offices.
    (c) The British Rail Regional Offices are to be merged into Public Transport Regional Offices.

    2. PTAO
    (a) During the five years in which the Passenger Services are brought into Public Ownership, a “Public Transport Administrative Office” (PTAO) shall be created.
    (i) The British Rail Administrative Office will be merged with PTAO.
    (b) The PTAO shall act as follows:
    * deal with the auditing of Regional Offices finances.
    * set ticket prices on the basis of economic conditions and within the limits of previous bills.
    * deal with the administration of ticket price concessions for those who qualify for them.
    * deal with the sanctions for those travelling without a valid ticket.
    * make all routes operated run by Low Floor Vehicles - these must have space for 1 larger size wheelchairs.
    * consider routes frequency and whether that should be increased/decreased.
    * ensure all routes operated have at least 2 buses per hour during peak times of the day.
    * ensure all complaints are handled accurately by the Regional Offices.

    3. Miscellaneous
    (a) B132 is to be amended as follows:
    * in Section 1, paragraph a; replace "5 years" with "4 years".
    * in Section 4, paragraph a; replace "5 years" with "4 years"
    * in Section 7, paragraph b; replace "April 2012" with "1st December 2011".
    (b) After nationalisation is complete the transportation services shall hereby be split into their constituent elements and controlled, maintained and operated independently by state owned companies operating by Royal Charter, clearly establishing the aims and objects of the businesses in the desires of good public service and self sustainability in terms of income verse expenditure.
    (c) PTAO's are to be set up individually for England, Wales and Scotland, and they shall have control over buses - with each Devolved Entity's Department for Transport looking after the PTAO's and ensuring there aims are met.

    4. Commencement, Short Title and Extent
    (a) This act may be cited as the Nationalisation of Buses Act 2010.
    (b) The provisions of this act shall begin from the 1st December 2011.
    (c) This Act extends to England, however shall be passed onto the devolved assemblies of Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland upon receiving royal assent for their approval.

    Notes:
    It is impossible to know the true cost of all the bus companies in the UK due to lack of knowledge of how many companies there are in the UK as well as how many shares they have.
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    No, same reasons.
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    Nope.
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    Absolutely, without a doubt, one of the worst things that could possibly be done right now.


    You want to pay 90p per share? These are the 12-month highs of the major bus operators:

    First: 448p
    Go-Ahead: 1,577p
    National Express: 489p
    Stagecoach: 204p

    You are destroying a whole sector of the economy, totally demolishing it. What about people's pensions who are invested in these companies? This is utter insanity, I expected it from the Socialists but not so much from the Lib Dems.
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    Right, so none of my suggestions were taken on board at all?
    This is brilliant... I propose a nationalised system that could actually work... because it does in other countries such as Germany, and you completely ignore it and keep this rubbish?

    Hahaha, NO!
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    No, just no.
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    Absolutely not, my reasons have already been mentioned.
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    Aye, still sounds good to me
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    It's a no from me.
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    (Original post by SciFiBoy)
    Aye, still sounds good to me
    Any kind of justification?

    Where's the money coming from? What's going to happen to those people who's pensions and investments will be wiped out?
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    Was anything changed from the Second Reading?

    Will any of the proponents bother turning up this time to defend it or do they still have such little regard for the House that they'll just not bother?
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    Devolved Entity? Of all the patronising language you could use. They are parliamentary institutions not entities. Glad to see that the language of the Raj has not yet fallen out of use from the Lib Dems and Socialists.

    Moreover, this is again unconstitutional: the Scots have a parliament not an Assembly. You'd think one day, after all my protests, you'd get it right.
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    (Original post by paddy__power)
    No, same reasons.
    I can only echo my Rt. Hon. friend's remarks.
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    I like the idea of nationalisation obviously but I'm just not sure this achieves it in the right way.
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    (Original post by Teaddict)
    Right, so none of my suggestions were taken on board at all?
    This is brilliant... I propose a nationalised system that could actually work... because it does in other countries such as Germany, and you completely ignore it and keep this rubbish?

    Hahaha, NO!

    Actually they were. Have a look at the Miscellaneous section.
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    (Original post by Adorno)
    Devolved Entity? Of all the patronising language you could use. They are parliamentary institutions not entities. Glad to see that the language of the Raj has not yet fallen out of use from the Lib Dems and Socialists.

    Moreover, this is again unconstitutional: the Scots have a parliament not an Assembly. You'd think one day, after all my protests, you'd get it right.
    Sorry Adorno,

    I personally fail on devolution. Could you PM me to explain how it should be written in that aspect?
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    (Original post by Norfolkadam)
    Absolutely, without a doubt, one of the worst things that could possibly be done right now.

    You want to pay 90p per share? These are the 12-month highs of the major bus operators:

    First: 448p
    Go-Ahead: 1,577p
    National Express: 489p
    Stagecoach: 204p

    You are destroying a whole sector of the economy, totally demolishing it. What about people's pensions who are invested in these companies? This is utter insanity, I expected it from the Socialists but not so much from the Lib Dems.
    How is it? It was already part destroyed anyway.
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    (Original post by Norfolkadam)
    Any kind of justification?

    Where's the money coming from? What's going to happen to those people who's pensions and investments will be wiped out?
    Buses are a natural monopoly and as such should be nationalised.

    What will happen is that although the fares will most likely decrease - any profits that still come will be used to pay for the Nationalisation. After that is payed for, fares would be reduced to break even levels.

    I'm really unsure what you mean about the pensions and investments.
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    (Original post by UniOfLife)
    Was anything changed from the Second Reading?

    Will any of the proponents bother turning up this time to defend it or do they still have such little regard for the House that they'll just not bother?
    Yes it was.

    And Hi!
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    (Original post by Afcwimbledon2)
    Yes it was.

    And Hi!
    Considering how little you and the other proponents of this Bill engaged in the debate in the last reading there really is no justification for your smugness.

    Now, let's have some answers. You haven't explained how it is justified to pay just 90p for a share that costs 1,577p. You're estimate is that this will cost at least £9bn, where's the money coming from? How many other bus operators are there? How much do you think it would cost to buy them out?

    You've also claimed that busses are a natural monopoly. I'd like to see any kind of justification for this seemingly outrageous claim. The roads are open for all to use, so why can't I buy a mini-bus, plan a route and start advertising and picking up paying customers? It is the least monopolistic of all forms of public transport (except maybe for taxis/minicabs).

    Moreover, isn't it true that at the moment all bus routes etc are run by public franchise? So, wouldn't the services improve by removing those franchises and destroying the State created monopoly rather than pretending that it is a natural one?

    Some food for thought. I'm not hopeful of any decent level of response and discussion though.
Updated: September 22, 2010
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