[cambio wechsel]

(Original post by bigfishlittlefish9)
X

Rather than taking a year out and reapplying with no guarantee of success, I'd suggest you do 3 years of physics for a BSc elsewhere and try to bolt this on the end of it: http://www.philosophy.ox.ac.uk/admis...phy_of_physics

A benefit attaching to this is that it would allow you to do the philosophy courses that I suppose are the ones you want to, those related to Physics, but without your doing the first year Utilitarianism and the rest of it. Another benefit is that you next year begin a degree, whether it will carry you to Oxford or not. The MPhysPhil is a 4 year course anyway, do you want to be graduating at 23?

I fairly strongly suppose that competition for the MSt is less fierce than for undergraduate admission. Get a first and apply for funding.

Incidentally, the lass to whom you're addressing your questions hasn't posted for 6 months. And you'd anyway want to quote her to have any hope of drawing her to the thread.

[bigfishlittlefish9]

Thanks for the advice You can probably tell I'm no good at this :P

I love the sound of the MSt, only problem being that I've already applied for Physics and Philosophy or similar courses at other unis this year, so I would have to take a gap year and reapply in order to end up doing a Physics BSc.

(Original post by cambio wechsel)
The MPhysPhil is a 4 year course anyway, do you want to be graduating at 23?

Not sure if that will have quoted properly, but because of various school moves, I could take a year out, and when I applied I would still be 18, so I'm not too worried about the age thing, although I suppose I might not feel that way after a gap year! Plus the length of the course doesn't bother me too much if I think I'll really love it, I haven't chosen it with a career in mind, so I figure I don't have anything to rush out of uni for. But again, I see your point because I might not feel this way forever.

(Original post by cambio wechsel)
Incidentally, the lass to whom you're addressing your questions hasn't posted for 6 months. And you'd anyway want to quote her to have any hope of drawing her to the thread.

Thanks Yeah I'll give that a try!

[bigfishlittlefish9]

(Original post by alystarrzan)
I promise to keep you posted!

Hi I realise that you posted this a while ago, but (as you'll see from my posts above) I'm in a really similar situation to the one you were in last year, so wondering if you could tell me what you did in the end?

(Original post by cambio wechsel)
Incidentally, the lass to whom you're addressing your questions hasn't posted for 6 months. And you'd anyway want to quote her to have any hope of drawing her to the thread.

I'm really useless at this, so its been kindly pointed out that I'd have to quote you for you to even notice that I'd posted on this thread :P

So thanks if you can help

[astro67]

(Original post by bigfishlittlefish9)

I love the sound of the MSt, only problem being that I've already applied for Physics and Philosophy or similar courses at other unis this year, so I would have to take a gap year and reapply in order to end up doing a Physics BSc.

Th MSt path might well contain the right academic content (that's a personal decision) but it's important to be aware that financing it would be rather different. You can't get a loan from the student loans company (SLC) for postgraduate courses (e.g. the MSt) so you would have to find the £9832 (this year's fee including college fee - it will have gone up by the time you apply for it) plus estimated £12900 living costs (that's the official estimate - you can probably live cheaper but they will ask you to show that you can access this amount before you can start the course) up front and the repayment terms will be much harsher than those that apply for SLC loans. If you have the money this might not be a problem but it's important not to be caught by surprise. You can get SLC loans for all four years of an integrated undergraduate masters programme such as an MPhysPhil at Oxford or equivalent elsewhere.

[bigfishlittlefish9]

(Original post by astro67)
Th MSt path might well contain the right academic content (that's a personal decision) but it's important to be aware that financing it would be rather different.

Yeah, I'm beginning to think that applying for this course would have been good if I'd planned on it a year ago, but if I'm taking a year out and reapplying for pure physics I'd probably be as well just reapplying for Physics and Philosophy and seeing how it goes?

With regards to finance I think that is important because at the moment I'm in Scotland, and so I can get free tuition, but I decided that it would definately be worth the fees if I could get into Oxford or Durham, but those fees wouldn't be payed upfront, and I think the student loans are very reasonable with regards to how you pay them back, but paying that amount of fees upfront does seem like a big decision.

At the moment I think I'll either go to one of my other choices if I can get in, or reapply. Although I'm just really worried that I could end up in this same position in a year, and it all would have been a waste of time.

I know if I reapply Oxford will expect to see that I've changed in a year, and I feel like having completed my education I could possibly do better at the PAT, and a lot of what came up at interview I have since covered at school, but I suspect they would ask me harder questions because I had finished school. I'm also not sure if they would consider my age as a reason to reapply, because I was only 16 when I was interviewed, and I'm not sure if being a year older would give me a more mature approach to the whole situation.

Thanks for any help/advice

[Maxffm]

Hi everyone, till recently I was completely set on applying to NatSci Cambridge but then just a few days ago I stumbled across the Physics & Philosphy Course offered by Oxford. I was wondering whether anyone has any personal experience with the course and how different it would be to studying just straight Physics. Also from what I understand it isn't necessary to do Philosophy A level, am I correct?

Cheers TSR

p.s. I was going to post this in the courses sub-forum but it didn't seem to work...
Already seen a similar thread but I was looking for something slightly different.

[cambio wechsel]

Doing philosophy A-level will likely harm rather than help your chances of admission. You will NEED Physics and Maths, Further Maths will help if offered at your school but will count as a 4th A-level. For the third one, you'd be best in choosing either Chemistry or a traditional humanities subject * which reveals you as able to write essays (say History or RE).


*By this is meant one of the subjects traditionally taught at A-level, rather than one of those that has appeared as an A-level choice much more recently (and Philosophy falls into this second group).

[Maxffm]

(Original post by cambio wechsel)
Doing philosophy A-level will likely harm rather than help your chances of admission. You will NEED Physics and Maths, Further Maths will help if offered at your school but will count as a 4th A-level. For the third one, you'd be best in choosing either Chemistry or a traditional humanities subject * which reveals you as able to write essays (say History or RE).


*By this is meant one of the subjects traditionally taught at A-level, rather than one of those that has appeared as an A-level choice much more recently (and Philosophy falls into this second group).

Thanks for that, I was however just asking whether it's needed to know whether to apply, I already do IB HL maths physics chem.

[TurboCretin]

(Original post by Maxffm)
Thanks for that, I was however just asking whether it's needed to know whether to apply, I already do IB HL maths physics chem.

You don't need A-level Philosophy to study Philosophy at university. At best it will do nothing to increase your chances by comparison to Maths or History.

[Kalliope]

(Original post by cambio wechsel)
Doing philosophy A-level will likely harm rather than help your chances of admission. You will NEED Physics and Maths, Further Maths will help if offered at your school but will count as a 4th A-level. For the third one, you'd be best in choosing either Chemistry or a traditional humanities subject * which reveals you as able to write essays (say History or RE).


*By this is meant one of the subjects traditionally taught at A-level, rather than one of those that has appeared as an A-level choice much more recently (and Philosophy falls into this second group).

Just to say, while it won't help you per. se. to do Philosophy and you really do not need it saying that it will harm your application is definitely an overstatement. It is not in the second group respectability-wise - Trinity College Cambridge's list puts it at 'Generally Arts A levels' for example (http://www.trin.cam.ac.uk/index.php?pageid=604), for example.

[dbmag9]

(Original post by Maxffm)
Hi everyone, till recently I was completely set on applying to NatSci Cambridge but then just a few days ago I stumbled across the Physics & Philosphy Course offered by Oxford. I was wondering whether anyone has any personal experience with the course and how different it would be to studying just straight Physics. Also from what I understand it isn't necessary to do Philosophy A level, am I correct?

Cheers TSR

p.s. I was going to post this in the courses sub-forum but it didn't seem to work...
Already seen a similar thread but I was looking for something slightly different.

It's pretty different to straight Physics; you do much (much, much) less practical work/labtime, and obviously you'll have essays and stuff as well. You don't need to have done philosophy at sixth-form, but you should definitely look into it (there's a selection of useful reads on the TSR wiki somewhere) and see if it interests you; as a PhysPhil you'd be a doing a lot of logic and hardcore analytic philosophy, which definitely isn't for the faint-hearted.

(Original post by cambio wechsel)
Doing philosophy A-level will likely harm rather than help your chances of admission. You will NEED Physics and Maths, Further Maths will help if offered at your school but will count as a 4th A-level. For the third one, you'd be best in choosing either Chemistry or a traditional humanities subject * which reveals you as able to write essays (say History or RE).

*By this is meant one of the subjects traditionally taught at A-level, rather than one of those that has appeared as an A-level choice much more recently (and Philosophy falls into this second group).

*******s. Philosophy A-level involves plenty of philosophy and plenty of essays; don't go saying nonsense that'll scare people who stumble across here and don't have anyone better to consult.

[cambio wechsel]

(Original post by dbmag9)
*******s. Philosophy A-level involves plenty of philosophy and plenty of essays; don't go saying nonsense that'll scare people who stumble across here and don't have anyone better to consult.

I was making no comment on the content or quality or the philosophy A-level. My point was that, far from it being required as the questioner might have imagined, it will at best have no effect on how his candidacy is evaluated.

[dbmag9]

(Original post by cambio wechsel)
I was making no comment on the content or quality or the philosophy A-level. My point was that, far from it being required as the questioner might have imagined, it will at best have no effect on how his candidacy is evaluated.

No, it might at best be a fascinating course that a candidate would enjoy and excel at, improving their critical thinking and essay-writing in a broad sense and educating them about a variety of interesting areas of philosophy, so that that they do better as a whole in their other sixth-form courses, impress at interview and find that a lot of the first-year material they cover is already broadly familiar.

[cambio wechsel]

(Original post by dbmag9)
No, it might at best be a fascinating course that a candidate would enjoy and excel at, improving their critical thinking and essay-writing in a broad sense and educating them about a variety of interesting areas of philosophy, so that that they do better as a whole in their other sixth-form courses, impress at interview and find that a lot of the first-year material they cover is already broadly familiar.

Look at the lad's circumstance. He is at the application stage. "Will I be hurt by my not having Philosophy A-level, such that I should stick with the initial plan of natsci at Cambridge?" "No you will not be. Go for it".

Will having/not having philosophy A-level bear on anyone's chances of being admitted to an "...and Philosophy" course at Oxford? At best it will make no difference.

If you know better, know that students applying with philosophy A-level are more usually admitted than those applying without, let's have it.

[dbmag9]

(Original post by cambio wechsel)
Look at the lad's circumstance. He is at the application stage. "Will I be hurt by my not having Philosophy A-level, such that I should stick with the initial plan of natsci at Cambridge?" "No you will not be. Go for it".

Will having/not having philosophy A-level bear on anyone's chances of being admitted to an "...and Philosophy" course at Oxford? At best it will make no difference.

If you know better, know that students applying with philosophy A-level are more usually admitted than those applying without, let's have it.

You suggested doing philosophy would harm rather than help an applicant; that's just not the case. Why? Well, there are two ways a subject could harm an application: it could be such a 'lightweight' subject that the university doesn't consider it as a worthy qualification, no matter how well the applicant does in it, or it could be a subject that the student is bad at, so that their performance at it makes the overall application look worse. Philosophy at sixth-form isn't the former, as another poster said above, and if someone is considering doing philosophy at uni they're probably not in the situation that would make the latter apply (and indeed studying philosophy is going to give them a clearer idea of what the degree subject involves, and will probably help them at interview). I think your argument is based on imagining the application as a list of subjects studied (if it were so, obviously it would make sense to find out the subjects universities 'like' the most and do those), but there's a lot more to it than that.

Applicants: by all means apply for philosophy courses without having studied philosophy at sixth-form; you can still make a strong application, and if you're interested in the subject it's a great one to study. But don't let misleading posts like the one above turn you off studying it at sixth-form.

[tuesday91]

I honestly don't think they'll care what your fourth subject is, as long as you have physics and as much maths as you can do. Writing essays is gonna be a bonus but I think at worst they just won't take any notice of it. Do whatever you think you'll enjoy!

[tahseen1995]

Hi guys,

I want to apply for MPhysPhil at Oxford and I will hopefully be leaving 6th form with A Levels in Maths, Further Maths, Physics, French and an AS in Chemistry.

What kinda questions will I be asked at the Philosophy interview? Because I have absolutely no idea, will I be questioned on classical philosophical ideas and philosophers etc. and different ideas of different philosophers etc.?

[Blutooth]

You'd most likely get some logical puzzle/ thought experiment to analyse at interview.

Not sure you can't specifically prepare for these questions. Join a philosophy club and take a look at courses you'd be studying in the first year like Logic, general philosophy some philosophy of physics and read up on them.

[tadzingoo]

Hey guys! I'm about to start my A levels and oxford physics and philosophy is the uni course I'm aiming for. Would it be better for me to pick Maths, Further Maths, Physics, and Chemistry, or Maths, Further Maths, Physics, and English Lit?
Bearing in mind that I would prefer the latter but I need chemistry A level for my chosen courses (Natural Sciences/geophysics) if I don't get into oxford.
CHEERS

[dbmag9]

(Original post by tadzingoo)
Bearing in mind that I would prefer the latter but I need chemistry A level for my chosen courses (Natural Sciences/geophysics) if I don't get into oxford.
CHEERS

Why do you want to study a course combining physics and philosophy if you get into Oxford, and courses involving neither if you don't?