[midpikyrozziy]

(Original post by Tefhel)
Whether you refuse to believe it or not doesn't make it true or not true. Is being a 'lad' a personality trait or is it put on? I think it's a personality trait, some people are just like that. Same for being camp.

Yes, I know what you are saying. Let me put it this way:
"A fair few people (including myself) dislike anal sex with another man. We associate homosexuality with anal sex with another man. In this way, we begin to dislike homosexuality. I know this is over-simplified - I've met gay people who don't like anal sex with other men, and I've got no problems with homosexuality. But a lot of people, for whatever reason, don't see this side of homosexuality, and many think that homosexuality = anal sex with men."

Loads of gay people are camp. Loads. You can't say that being camp is hindering acceptance, any more than liking anal sex with men is hindering acceptance. Because both are prevalent in the gay community. Whether you like it or not, whether you are the type or not, lots of gay people are camp. Acceptance includes accepting all gay people, not just 'the ones who act exactly like straight people', any more than you could just accept gay white people but not gay black people.

Well personally I think the 'lad' image is also put on. I agree that their are hormonal differences that do change personalities somewhat, but they are not the sole aspect that determine personalities.

I can see the link you're trying to make, but I don't think it's valid. People generally tend to assume that gay people like anal sex with other men, and if they don't, we'd most likely be surprised. However, we know that gay people can be camp, or not camp, and there are a large enough number of both that neither are a surprise. Therefore, I don't think the comparison works. Just ask a lot of homophobes what there problem is with homosexuality, and campness will often be the cause. Hell, just look at the comments section for any Daily Mail article about a gay pride march, and my point is proven.

[kerily]

Not everyone who's gay is camp, not everyone who's camp is gay, and it's possible to be highly camp without relating that to your sexuality.

How does it hurt you, anyway? Yeah, it irritates me when someone defines themselves solely through their sexuality, but that's not what being camp is. Being camp is a form of self-expression, and as it doesn't hurt anyone, it's a valid form of self-expression.

[midpikyrozziy]

(Original post by kerily)
Not everyone who's gay is camp, not everyone who's camp is gay, and it's possible to be highly camp without relating that to your sexuality.

How does it hurt you, anyway? Yeah, it irritates me when someone defines themselves solely through their sexuality, but that's not what being camp is. Being camp is a form of self-expression, and as it doesn't hurt anyone, it's a valid form of self-expression.

Asking how it hurts me doesn't answer the question. Truthfully, it doesn't hurt me at all. But it does annoy me, just as some people in this thread have said that the 'overly-macho lad stereotype' annoys them, but that doesn't hurt them either. And I also think it may be harming the homosexual movement itself, as I reckon it makes people less likely to accept homosexuality as a valid alternative lifestyle. Furthermore, I'm simply curious as to why people choose to act this way.

So all in all, I think it's still a valid question.

[Barden]

What about the flip-side... why are some camp people so gay?

['Shadowplay']

(Original post by midpikyrozziy)
(I do know you can be camp but not gay, but just ignore this for now.)

Just like you can be gay and not be camp (i know you put 'some' in your title but still, to clears things up).

I'm gay and I can't stand camp people either but meh, that's who they are. Like someone else said they're not doing any harm and you can find straight camp people as well. I've never really understood if it was their 'natural' way of being or just a facade to hide insecurity. Either way just ignore them?

[moneyballs2]

You may well find that there are more 'straight acting' gay men than there are camp gay men. It's not like you're going to actually think somebody is gay if they act like everybody else.

It's only going to be the overly camp ones you notice if you're out in public or with friends. And as for in the media, well, it's the same thing, you only think "He's gay" if they are camp. Perfect example would be Derren Brown

[DorianGrayism]

(Original post by midpikyrozziy)
I've got no problem at all with homosexuality, where other people c..................ople have a negative response to this in-your-face approach to expression.

Any thoughts?

Your question is like asking why do some straight guys have to act so "ard", act misonogistically and attempt to get in fights all the time.

[magnum.opus]

(Original post by The.Prophet)
You can spot the camp gay people in this thread a mile off.

Is this because you're a prophet or what?....

[dioscuri]

Personally, I recon a certain personality trait gay guy will have hung around and formed friendships nearly exclusively with women from the age of 11+, thus taking on their mannerisms, style sense, and admiring and trying to emulate them as they both want the same thing 'a man to have sex with/be in love with'. I think gay guys either tend to be secure people (so happy to let their personnality etc get them into a relationship), wannabe women gays (they emulate attractive women as they think this will be them most desirable for a partner), or wannabe the man I want to **** gays (the really butch manly ones who are basically straight guys who have sex with men.

[George5210]

(Original post by midpikyrozziy)
Well personally I think the 'lad' image is also put on. I agree that their are hormonal differences that do change personalities somewhat, but they are not the sole aspect that determine personalities.

I can see the link you're trying to make, but I don't think it's valid. People generally tend to assume that gay people like anal sex with other men, and if they don't, we'd most likely be surprised. However, we know that gay people can be camp, or not camp, and there are a large enough number of both that neither are a surprise. Therefore, I don't think the comparison works. Just ask a lot of homophobes what there problem is with homosexuality, and campness will often be the cause. Hell, just look at the comments section for any Daily Mail article about a gay pride march, and my point is proven.

I'm sorry, you can NEVER use the Daily Mail comments section as a justification or evidence for anything. It just like Godwin's Law, but worse.

Some gay people are 'so camp' for the same reason as any body has a personality trait. A combination of genetics, environmental factors, upbringing, traumas, experiences etc. At the end of the day it doesn't really matter, if you don't like it they don't associate with camp people, but don't tar all gay people with the same brush. You can't make generalisations about a group of people in society because of one trait some of the group possess. It shouldn't stop you associating with gay people.

[SchadenfreudeDude]

I don't mind it when they're camp, it's quite annoying when they feel the need to act like prissy, little girls, though.

[emiliee21]

overly camp people do my head in, its clearly an act to be like 'i'm gay and proud'
I have many gay friends and they arent camp at all, they also get very very annoyed with camp people.

[emiliee21]

plus i know alot of very camp people who arent gay

[midpikyrozziy]

(Original post by George5210)
I'm sorry, you can NEVER use the Daily Mail comments section as a justification or evidence for anything. It just like Godwin's Law, but worse.

Some gay people are 'so camp' for the same reason as any body has a personality trait. A combination of genetics, environmental factors, upbringing, traumas, experiences etc. At the end of the day it doesn't really matter, if you don't like it they don't associate with camp people, but don't tar all gay people with the same brush. You can't make generalisations about a group of people in society because of one trait some of the group possess. It shouldn't stop you associating with gay people.

Actually, if we're looking at finding out what the views of homophobes are, then surely the Daily Mail comments section is an ideal place to look? Re-read my comment.

And I never said that I would stop associating with gay people. I'd just rather not associate with camp people, because they annoy me. Non-camp gays are fine by me.

[paddyman4]

(Original post by midpikyrozziy)
I do know you can be camp but not gay, but just ignore this for now.

Why are all black people criminals?

(I do know that some black people aren't criminals, but just ignore this for now.)

[Lotatot]

It might just be thats the way that they are, flamboyant and girly.
Or they could (like a lot of straight people faking personalities) be putting it on and trying to get attention?
It depends a lot on the PERSON, so I would wait untill I knew a camp person to see whether they are genuine or putting it on a bit.

[tieyourmotherdown]

I don't know. I guess it's partially because society expects gay men to be camp and gay women to be butch. Heck, when I told my friends they didn't believe I was gay because I'm not camp in the slightest, and they're all pretty liberal people which shows just how deep the stereotype runs.

That said, does it really matter?

[midpikyrozziy]

(Original post by paddyman4)
Why are all black people criminals?

(I do know that some black people aren't criminals, but just ignore this for now.)

This would be a valid criticism if I were asking 'Why are all gay people camp?'. However, if you carefully read the title, I am actually asking 'Why are some gay people camp?' because I am interested in discovering why those in the gay community who act camp do so. This is because I believe that homosexuality and campness are linked, and I therefore have no interest in discussing why a minority of the straight community also act camp.

So all in all, your contribution to the thread was about as useful as the Pope's testicles.

[midpikyrozziy]

(Original post by tieyourmotherdown)
I don't know. I guess it's partially because society expects gay men to be camp and gay women to be butch. Heck, when I told my friends they didn't believe I was gay because I'm not camp in the slightest, and they're all pretty liberal people which shows just how deep the stereotype runs.

That said, does it really matter?

I think it does matter. You said yourself that society expects gay men to be camp, and that your liberal friends were surprised that you were gay, but not camp. Being camp doesn't harm me, but it annoys me because I believe it's often very attention-seeking, and deliberately designed to make some people feel uncomfortable. Judging by my own experiences (and the fact that the OP is getting more pos rep than neg), it looks like other people agree, or have their own reasons for disliking camp people.

So would it not be reasonable to suggest that camp people are detrimental to the acceptance of homosexuality?

[Dude Where's My Username]

To fit into a clique/scene/stereotype. They see how the "stereotypical" gay acts and they feel they have to let their character go the same way in order to embrace their gayness.

If that what makes them happy then fine. But camp people are annoying, not gonna lie.