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    (Original post by SaintSoldier)
    1. You didn’t mind finding one video, find another? Why should I search you are accusing, you find the proof

    2. the 11th master doesn’t define slander using the oxford dicitionary in my opinion. Nindia is the word I would use, I think nindia is what you are doing of Sant Ji

    3. What you on about mate. The Mata Sahib Kaur issue I fully agree bibiaan should do the great role that the great mata ji did. On the other stuff, I don’t agree. Old rehatnaame specifically state that “take the amrit from 5 Singhs” etc.

    4. You didn’t reply to my anand karaj question, lets change that. Allow the bibi to walk infront of the man for equality purposes. Lets alter another of the sidhaants of the masters’ times.

    5. I don’t agree that the govt is solely left to panj piaare, I would like to seek clarification from Khalsa Raaj to see how it was run back in the day. My thoughts were that Khalsaland runs similar to how Panjab political system works with a CM and cabinet. I would like to give the Akaal Takht 999.9999% more power so jathedars like the awe-insipring Akali Baba Phoola Singh can sort out any sikh who does wrong!!

    6. Asking a particular Guru for help is wrong because it comprises our concept of Waheguru? What? I thought you had more stronger questions of Sant Ji then something like this. This is just tit for tat mate in my opinion. Whats your interpretation of the following lines then?

    pritham bhagaathee simar kai gur naanak lee dhiaae |
    First of all, having remembered the Lord (Universal Destroyer) I meditate upon Guru Nanak Dev.

    fir angadh gur thae amaradhaas raamadhaasai hoee sehaae |
    And then I concentrate on Guru Angad Dev, Guru Amar Das and Guru Ram Dass, may they ever protect me.

    arajan harigobindh no simara sree hariraae |
    (I, then, contemplate on) Guru Arjan Dev, Guru Hargobind and Guru Har Rai.


    sree har kishan dhiaaeeai jis ddithae sabh dhukh jaae |
    (And then I reflect on) the most Venerable Guru Har Krishan, seeing whom all the sufferings melt away.

    thaeg behaadhar simariai ghar no nidh aavai dhaae |
    I invoke Guru Tegh Bahadur, by whose grace the nine treasures come rushing to my house.

    sabh thaaee hoe sehaae | 1|
    O, my Venerable Masters, may' you protect me everywhere.(1)
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    (Original post by dogra)
    dogra ji simple question. I bare no offence to Hindu religion, mandairs and practices. But, if a "sikh" of Chitiaan Bajawala The Great 10th Master Sri Guru Gobind Singh Sahib engages in havan, murti pooja and other practices forbidden by panth parvanat Rehat Maryada, how can you call that person a good sikh?
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    is vegetarianism compulsory in Sikh religion?

    if so, why did some guru ji go hunting?

    thanks.
  4. Offline

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    is vegetarianism compulsory in Sikh religion?

    if so, why did some guru ji go hunting?

    thanks.
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    (Original post by okapobcfc08)
    what 5hit you chatting?

    1. Did I say no hindus came out to protect? What I said was you are most likely dissing the people (khalistanis) that were out in force protecing mandirs and mosques. Dont turn this point into a hindu v sikh argument. Please READ the post.

    2. Would I live in Khalistan? No I would not, but what kind of argument is that. I ask for change for Sikhs in India in the form of Khalistan or whatever, not for any personal gain but for a better life for indian sikhs.

    3. Again, jump in with two feet. If you bothered looking, I agree that people there will decide, hence let the UN in and hold the referendum, simple job?

    4. Mate, please do not give sikhs of Sahib-e-Alaam Dasam Pita Sri Guru Gobind Singh a lecture about protecting and what not. Of course I would come out to protect a mandair if it was under seige, my religion tells me too

    5. I dont think going to mandir or gurdwara has any relevance to this argument.

    6. Please do not think that 8 or 10 words of panjabi will make you look tough. See if you can understand this:

    Befkoofa hun gal sun laa, mai tenu pehla kiha si ke koee karaan mainu das ke kate ni khalistan ban sak da. Aaemi kuthe waang paunki janda chungi tara das ke tere nal ki gusa, khalistan kate ni ban sakda? Fansi asi diteean, tuhade bhena dee izaat asi rakhi. Jhaaj da jawab de moorkhaa
    You just love to argue. Also jeh tenu jare vi akhal hundi tenu patha hona si ki mein kuri ahn ya phir tenu punjabi nai bolni andhi teh tu kuri nu bandah banahdita lol case closed
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    (Original post by bbkk15)
    You just love to argue. Also jeh tenu jare vi akhal hundi tenu patha hona si ki mein kuri ahn ya phir tenu punjabi nai bolni andhi teh tu kuri nu bandah banahdita lol case closed
    how was i supposed 2 know your gender? case kehri closed toon ta koee jawab ni dita. Daka dora aunda ni aaemi bootha chak ke boli jandi aan, asi khalistani lokaan ko bahut akal haigi aa. Asi ta panjab ley ik samajik, arthik ate rajneetak hal ta labhia khalistan vich. Ik mauka hor main tinu dindaan, dimaag varte ke das khalistan da ke dar hai tainu?
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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1SPWE8y95I

    Khalistan Zindabad!!
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    (Original post by ugk4life)
    is vegetarianism compulsory in Sikh religion?
    Yes.

    if so, why did some guru ji go hunting?
    The Gurus went hunting for two reasons only:
    1) To neutralise threats to villagers from dangerous, man eating animals.
    2) To release settle overdue accounts with animals, and release those who were deserving from reincarnation.

    It was not done for pleasure.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Living in a country like this, we are used to hunting being about small animals like foxes, rabbits etc. The Gurus hunted large animals like lions, bears and elephants, who were terrorising local villagers by destroying their homes and crops. The Gurus were helping the villagers.

    To explain the part about accounts, we'll look at this Sakhi;
    Guru Gobind Singh who sent out his falcon to hunt an animal, once caught he watched as the baaj (falcon) tore into the animals flesh. Asked by one of his Sikhs what was the reasoning behind this. Guru Gobind Singh stated that in a previous life the animal had borrowed some money from the baaj and swore on Akaal Purkh's name that he would pay it back, he never did, now it was pay back time. There are many instances like this which illustrate that the Gurus were not hunting for meat but to save these souls from the continuous cycle of birth and death.

    However, the Gurus restrained from killing animals whenever they could. For example, Guru Har Rai never killed an animal in his life. Instead, he used to rescue old and sick animals, and take them to an animal sanctuary that he had set up. This was the first of its kind in India, as most people didn't appreciate animals (with the exception of cows for Hindus, but no other animals were given such preference or devotion as them). All animals were nurtured there by the Sikhs. This topic is discussed extensively in Mahima Prakash Vol 2.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    There are only two Sakhis in which Guru Hargobind is seen hunting, and only seven of Guru Gobind Singh. Clearly, this is not the typical lifestyle of a hunter as they would have done a lot more if they were just in it for the sport. They had a purpose in doing it, that is why they did it so rarely.
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    (Original post by SaintSoldier)
    Yes.



    The Gurus went hunting for two reasons only:
    1) To neutralise threats to villagers from dangerous, man eating animals.
    2) To release settle overdue accounts with animals, and release those who were deserving from reincarnation.

    It was not done for pleasure.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	300px-LionKIllhargobindsinghmachkund.jpg 
Views:	47 
Size:	43.5 KB 
ID:	140611

    Living in a country like this, we are used to hunting being about small animals like foxes, rabbits etc. The Gurus hunted large animals like lions, bears and elephants, who were terrorising local villagers by destroying their homes and crops. The Gurus were helping the villagers.

    To explain he part about accounts, we'll look at this Sakhi;
    Guru Gobind Singh who sent out his falcon to hunt an animal, once caught he watched as the baaj (falcon) tore into the animals flesh. Asked by one of his Sikhs what was the reasoning behind this. Guru Gobind Singh stated that in a previous life the animal had borrowed some money from the baaj and swore on Akaal Purkhs name that he would pay it back, he never did, now it was pay back time. There are many instances like this which illustrate that the Gurus were not hunting for meat but to save these souls from the continuous cycle of birth and death.

    However, the Gurus restrained from killing animals whenever they could. For example, Guru Gar Rai never killed an animal in his life. Instead, he used to rescue old and sick animals, and take them to an animal sanctuary that he had set up. This was the first of its kind in India, as most people didn't appreciate animals (with the exception of cows for Hindus, but no other animals were given such preference or devotion as them). All animals were nurtured there by the Sikhs. This topic is discussed extensively in Mahima Prakash Vol 2.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	harraicourt1.jpg 
Views:	63 
Size:	38.7 KB 
ID:	140619

    There are only two Sakhis in which Guru Hargobind is seen hunting, and only seven of Guru Gobind Singh. Clearly, this is not the typical lifestyle of a hunter as they would have done a lot more if they were just in it for the sport. They had a purpose in doing it, that is why they did it so rarely.
    thanks for clearing this up.
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    Sasrikaal brothers and sisters.

    I was wondering whether anybody could tell me why Sikhs in the following video regularly kill this animal (once a day apparently).

    CRUESOME VIDEO- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mtsQYz23UNE
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    (Original post by pinda.college)
    Sasrikaal brothers and sisters.

    I was wondering whether anybody could tell me why Sikhs in the following video regularly kill this animal (once a day apparently).

    CRUESOME VIDEO- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mtsQYz23UNE
    "Once a day", I'm sure you made this up.


    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_...ice_in_Sikhism
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    (Original post by pinda.college)
    Sasrikaal brothers and sisters.

    I was wondering whether anybody could tell me why Sikhs in the following video regularly kill this animal (once a day apparently).

    CRUESOME VIDEO- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mtsQYz23UNE
    Because they don't know what their religion teaches them
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    (Original post by okapobcfc08)
    You didn’t mind finding one video, find another? Why should I search you are accusing, you find the proof
    Fast forward to 6:51 in this.


    the 11th master doesn’t define slander using the oxford dicitionary in my opinion. Nindia is the word I would use, I think nindia is what you are doing of Sant Ji
    That's why I quoted the Guru Granth Sahib to define it as well?

    Old rehatnaame specifically state that “take the amrit from 5 Singhs” etc.
    That doesn't mean five "men" though. When we refer to armies, we usually use the term "men," but that doesn't mean that there are only men present in that army. Women can sign up to. It's just the way that the language has developed. The same is true when we say "mankind" - it's just the language.

    For example, suppose we have a group of 1000 people. In the German language, even if 1 person out of 1000 is male, you gramatically have to use the masculine plural (even if most people in the group are female.

    The same is true for Punjabi. When refering to a group of people, it is just custom to refer to them as male. They don't actually all have to be men.

    You didn’t reply to my anand karaj question, lets change that. Allow the bibi to walk infront of the man for equality purposes. Lets alter another of the sidhaants of the masters’ times.
    I don't know enough about the history of Anand Karaj to be able to comment on this issue, so I shall reserve my judgement for now.

    I don’t agree that the govt is solely left to panj piaare, I would like to seek clarification from Khalsa Raaj to see how it was run back in the day. My thoughts were that Khalsaland runs similar to how Panjab political system works with a CM and cabinet. I would like to give the Akaal Takht 999.9999% more power so jathedars like the awe-insipring Akali Baba Phoola Singh can sort out any sikh who does wrong!!
    Clearly, the Akal Takht cannot handle every single small issue of every village in Punjab, in the same way hat Westminster cannot handle all of the issues in every suburb of the UK. That's why we have local governments.

    The Panj Piare are a democratic institute, hence government must be based around them.

    pritham bhagaathee simar kai gur naanak lee dhiaae |
    First of all, having remembered the Lord (Universal Destroyer) I meditate upon Guru Nanak Dev.

    fir angadh gur thae amaradhaas raamadhaasai hoee sehaae |
    And then I concentrate on Guru Angad Dev, Guru Amar Das and Guru Ram Dass, may they ever protect me.

    arajan harigobindh no simara sree hariraae |
    (I, then, contemplate on) Guru Arjan Dev, Guru Hargobind and Guru Har Rai.


    sree har kishan dhiaaeeai jis ddithae sabh dhukh jaae |
    (And then I reflect on) the most Venerable Guru Har Krishan, seeing whom all the sufferings melt away.

    thaeg behaadhar simariai ghar no nidh aavai dhaae |
    I invoke Guru Tegh Bahadur, by whose grace the nine treasures come rushing to my house.

    sabh thaaee hoe sehaae | 1|
    O, my Venerable Masters, may' you protect me everywhere.(1)
    Well that's the Ardas which isn't in the Guru Granth Sahib or Dasam Granth or any reliable Sakhis. All Sikh scholars agree that the Ardas has evolved and changed over time to encompass the various achievements of the Khalsa (eg. Bhai Mani Singh's Shaheedi etc). The Ardas that must Gurdware recite now is not the one recited in Guru Gobind Singh's time. So what is? The Ardas is found in the fifth chapter of Bachitter Natak, "The Description of the Spiritual Kings." It does not contain the invocations to the Gurus of your Ardas.
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    After just looking at the animal killing video posted earlier, I Googled something along the lines of "Sikh animal killings" and found this http://www.lepak.tv/watch/1beb71f268...nside-Gurdwara

    Can someone explain to me why this happened? Why was it allowed to happen inside a Gurdwara? Thanks
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    (Original post by Lakhvir.Singh)
    After just looking at the animal killing video posted earlier, I Googled something along the lines of "Sikh animal killings" and found this http://www.lepak.tv/watch/1beb71f268...nside-Gurdwara

    Can someone explain to me why this happened? Why was it allowed to happen inside a Gurdwara? Thanks
    Here you go paji, interesting article I found.

    http://www.khalsanews.org/articles/B...t%20Nanded.pdf
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    (Original post by okapobcfc08)
    how was i supposed 2 know your gender? case kehri closed toon ta koee jawab ni dita. Daka dora aunda ni aaemi bootha chak ke boli jandi aan, asi khalistani lokaan ko bahut akal haigi aa. Asi ta panjab ley ik samajik, arthik ate rajneetak hal ta labhia khalistan vich. Ik mauka hor main tinu dindaan, dimaag varte ke das khalistan da ke dar hai tainu?
    take your verbal diahorrea elsewhere mate and thats why you should think b4 u bhoonk like a kutha, not afraid of the word khalistan but HINDUSTAN ZINDABAD get your land off the pakistanis mate coz thats where most of punjab use 2 be
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    (Original post by bbkk15)
    take your verbal diahorrea elsewhere mate and thats why you should think b4 u bhoonk like a kutha, not afraid of the word khalistan but HINDUSTAN ZINDABAD get your land off the pakistanis mate coz thats where most of punjab use 2 be
    lol what verbal abuse? wasn't it you who started this and called khalistani's pagal? All i asked you was give me a political (rajneetak), social (smaajik) and economical (arthik) counter argument to a land for Sikhs? We have put many good arguments for independance, yet why do anti-khalistani's like yourself just shout hot air. Give me some stats, some proof, come on, give me something credible as to why Khalistan isn't the right way to go. I'll give you one last chance.
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    (Original post by SaintSoldier)


    1. What does that prove? A man gives Sant Ji’s some rupees as you do to a parchaarak out of respect. Then you rely on the testimony of one Sonia Deol? Did she back up what she said with any sources of information? Mate what a failure, when that documentary came out 99% of Sikhs I knew saw it as a defation of Sant Ji’s character.

    2. Perhaps it me being a fool, but I’m not going to be sorry for having deep respect and long-lasting admiration for a true saint-solider who took 40 odd bullets for Sikhi.

    3. The rehatnama (Bhai Desa Singh) says “panj singhaan”. Bhai Sahib could easily have put singhaanian also.

    4. WHAT YOU ON ABOUT MATE? The pangti I quoted is written by the lion of lions, the great 10th master in the opening to Chandi Di Vaar listed in Sri Dasam Granth. That pangti I quoted is Gurbani. Surprised you didn’t know that mate.

    5. When all is said and done, big respect for not disowning Sri Dasam Granth like other Sikhs.
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    (Original post by Lakhvir.Singh)
    After just looking at the animal killing video posted earlier, I Googled something along the lines of "Sikh animal killings" and found this http://www.lepak.tv/watch/1beb71f268...nside-Gurdwara

    Can someone explain to me why this happened? Why was it allowed to happen inside a Gurdwara? Thanks
    mahasatra was and probably still is a predominantly hindu area. Hindu practices, since being the majority, have creeped into Deccan Gurdwaras (i.e. Sri Hazoor Sahib). Sikhs just let these practices come in centuries ago and just didnt bother to current the wrongs, instead preaching that it was customary tradition. Please watch out for nakali nihangs like the wikipedia page posted early, where a group led by a singh called "niddar" or something have been putting brahminwaadi type methodolgy into sikhism, e.g. animal sacrifice.
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    (Original post by SinghSTAR)
    Sat Sri Akaal!

    Hey everyone- I'm a Sikh too! :bhangra:

    My fantastic Punjabi and Kirtan teacher, Bakshinder Aunty, got me into Sikhi. I was learning shabads with her for a while and she was absolutely fantastic! That's what got me interested in Sikhi.
    This thread is so fresh it must have been written while stepping off the boat. lol jk. I like Sikhs, your beards and turbans are cool I had a friend who was of a sikh background We had loads in common. Shoulda went out with her

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