Why does Scotland get everything for free?

Scroll to see replies

Why would Scotland of all places want to charge in dollars?

Because Alex Salmond is an American Double Agent. I was just thinking of Austin Powers for a ridiculous number, that's all. :pierre:

Reply 41

AlexInWonderland

Original post by Fusilero

Yes. In Germany alone the Scots have to pay tuition in Baden-Württemberg, Bavaria, Hamburg, Lower Saxony, North Rhine-Westphalia, Saarland. They don't have to pay tuition in Berlin, Brandenburg, Bremen, Hesse, Mecklenburg-Western Pomerania, Thuringia but a small registration charge. They'd also pay tuition fees if they wish to study a subject taught in English at a Czech University. They'd pay a small fee in France of less than 300EU at public universities. They pay a 1500EU~ fee in the Netherlands, a bit less than that in Portugal and a small, 10EU or so, fee per credit given in a Spanish University. [source]

Britain really does have the most expensive public university tuition, even before the Conservative-Liberal Democrat Coalition Hikes, in Europe.

Hmm, perhaps I am wrong, in that it appears in Europe the fees are significantly less, so the fairness aspect plays a lesser role.

I must say, regardless of your stance on the tuition fees situation, it is totally scandalous that Scottish Lib Dems voted in favour of the increase, whilst their counterparts in the Scottish Parliament seek to retain no fees for Scottish students.

Even as a Tory, I hope they are punished for this blatant betrayal of their voters.

Reply 42

Arianto

Original post by benzene

No tuition fees, no prescription charges, no dentistry charges, free care for the elderly, free hospital parking, frozen council tax... the list goes on.

Can somebody please tell me where they're getting all the money from?

We don't get free hospital parking. Not all of us anyway.

Reply 43

ultimate mashup

Original post by Fusilero

It's not related to EU law. It's related to Scottish Law and the British 'Constitution', higher education is a devolved power so they set the tuition fees for Scottish Student and non-Scottish Students. The sooner we properly federalise the nation, rather than this devolution bull**** whereby different parts have different powers, the better. The only bit where the EU comes involved is the fact that EU students wishing to study in Scotland pay the same as Scottish Students. If they decided to charge Scottish Students one hundred million dollars then EU students will have to pay one hundred million dollars.

We'll unfortunatly the UK is in the EU isn't it? So that rule should apply to english people. English people should be protected by this EU law that states you should be charged the same for higher education as the the native people? Devolution is a joke - it just creates more unfairness! Don't even get me started on the West Lothian Question!

Reply 44

adoringcarmine

i was wondering this too and im scottish!

Reply 45

Fusilero

Original post by ultimate mashup

Yes, the UK is part of the EU. England isn't. It's a purely internal affair, the Germans 'suffer' the same thing due to their federal status.

Reply 46

salty_candy

Original post by AlexInWonderland

Why should they have sole access to resources owned by the UK?
As for borrowing, we have seen the mess the nation as a whole gets in when it borrows more that it can afford. Surely that is the start of a slippery slope.

Unfortunately this is primarily down to EU rules. Absolute disgrace. Of course, Scotland could open its universities for free to English students as well, but chooses not to.

No they shouldn't, everyone would just want go to uni in Scotland rather than stay here and pay the 9 grand, which clearly wouldn't work

Reply 47

Tefhel

If they didn't give away tonnes of things for free then no one would choose to live there.

Reply 48

Fusilero

Original post by AlexInWonderland

Yes, as I said fees are significantly lower in Europe. British Politics, even Labour, is slanted to the right compared to mainland Europe.

Reply 49

ultimate mashup

Original post by Fusilero

Yes, the UK is part of the EU. England isn't. It's a purely internal affair, the Germans 'suffer' the same thing due to their federal status.

Oh right well it seems like as always it boils down to law and politics. You would think, however that out of a point of principle they would offer price parity for higher education to all students of the UK.

You mentioned on your previous post that you would prefer a federal system for the UK rather than devolution? Wouldn't that just be the same thing in reality? Surely the best thing do would be to return running the whole UK form Westminister? That would cut down on bureaucracy and red tape surely and the Scots would not be able to claim that they're being run by the English as they would be able to elect MP's to the Westminister government therefore possessing their fair share on involvement in policy making?

Reply 50

Fusilero

Original post by ultimate mashup

Because a Federal System allows local grievances to be tackled at a more local level. It wouldn't be the same as devolution because devolution varies, all the different home nations have different powers to each other - hell, London has more power than the rest of England! A federal system would balance all that out, I could even imagine Greater London being it's own state on par with Berlin in Germany. There wouldn't be much more bureaucracy and red tape because the departments running things in the nations wouldn't exist at all in Westminster - for example, if the department of work and pension's powers were given to the nations then that would no longer exist in Westminster but have a smaller, sleeker, efficient and more responsive one in each nation. As it stands now not only do the devolved nations have to run each section of government (different sections in different nations) but so does the central London government, doubling up the matter and creating extra bureaucracy.

(edited 12 years ago)

Reply 51

L i b

Original post by salty_candy

No they shouldn't, everyone would just want go to uni in Scotland rather than stay here and pay the 9 grand, which clearly wouldn't work

Good. Well, better than using the English, Welsh and Northern Irish as cash-cows. In the real world, university tuition has to be paid for.

Anyway, I think the current funding proposals are incredibly damaging to the fabric of our society. As Scotland become an increasing insular place, the taxpayer is effectively funding huge bribes to have people from Scotland say and study in Scotland. I've always been of the impression that moving around for university is a good thing, particularly when we're talking in terms of enhancing the cultural identity of a group of people.

Academically, it is also worrying to: that some Scottish students may, for example, be actively discouraged in this way from attending Oxford and Cambridge.

Reply 52

Prime500

Original post by benzene

Where'd you get that one from?

Reply 53

ahpadt

Original post by benzene

...and still I have no desire to live there.

Reply 54

Prime500

Original post by benzene

Also, Scotland gets allocated a set amount of money and then spends it as it wishes, as it is free to do so. Just because the Scottish Executive chooses to spend it in areas that England doesn't does not necessarily make it unfair. Money spent the areas you've mentioned gets taken away from other areas where the money would be spent in England.

Reply 55

welshmun

Wales is on the same track as Scotland, can just feel it.

Reply 56

L i b

Original post by Prime500

Yeah, but public expenditure in Scotland is higher than almost every region of England. The original formula for determining funding for devolved (previously administratively devolved, ie Scottish Office) services is disproportionate to Scotland's population share.

It's not that they're cutting other areas, it is just that the Scottish Executive has more money to play with.

Reply 57

Shadowplay

Original post by Fusilero

Because, by EU law, you pay the same as the native students. The native English pay tuition fees so any EU students coming over have to pay them. The same situation applies in Germany where tuition for other EU student varies by state (Lander) as that is something the german federal parliament has devolved to the state governments. I won't go into detail because I've mentioned it quite often throughout this thread.

You seem to know quite a lot about European universities. Is there somewhere a comprehensive list of universities/cities/countries where foreign students do not pay tuitions because of the EU law? Are there any free M.A.'s? Cheers. :smile:

Reply 58

username402722

The Barnett formula for allocating public money to Scotland, which dates back to the 1970s Labour government. Scotland's population has not risen as much as the UK as a whole, so per head the amount is more than in the UK.

Given the SNP vote is significant, no politician will mess about with it, probably.