TSR Bowed Strings Society

bohemian

I'm actually studying a different cadenza - don't ask which, I don't know myself - but I prefer the Franko, because it plays to my strengths. Can you get it serparately, or do I need to borrow/photocopy it for now? I'm using an Urtext so I was slightly suprised to see a different cadenza, since Franko is standard.

I have no idea if you can get it separately, but Fuller Music might be able to advise.

The Franko is the only cadenza with the Schirmer edition, and I was told to get Urtext and Schirmer together if I were to perform it properly in order to use the Urtext as a reference but play the Franko cadenza. If you like you can borrow my part, but either wait until after the 21st of April, or tell me and I'll photocopy the cadenza right now and give it to you next time I see you :smile:

bohemian

Jonny, when is our chamber orchestra concert, and when are the rehearsals for it? :confused:

Had a lesson with my teacher-to-be (2 hours long!) and I'm definitely doing my Dip in December. Unfortunately, apparently I should be doing 2 hours technical work every day in the meantime :eek:

Kill me now!

The concert's on Saturday the 22nd of April in St Paul's Church (4 days before my 18th, btw :wink:

) and, as far as I know, the only rehearsals we have left are the night before - on the 21st - and on the day itself for a few hours. Does that sound about right?

Ooh, who's your teacher-to-be?

Reply 122

That's a bit annoying, I get back from holiday at about 6am on the 21st, so I'll end up needing to sleep all day if we're rehearsing then! For some reason I was thinking the concert was the 23rd. Oops! Good thing some people are organized...I just realised we've got county orch too...I haven't actually looked at the parts they sent out yet, because I'm scared of more than 2 flats. F minor is such a rubbish key, I hate it.

I asked at Tema music and they didn't actually know that Mozart 3 had a cadenza (they also didn't know who Stephane Grappelli was so I have lost all faith in them), so they couldn't tell me whether you can buy it seperately. I'll phone Chappells tomorrow and check, but if not, would it be possible to have a photocopy of yours? :smile:

(Is it legal?) Unless the Schirmer edition has anything else which I should look at, which the Urtext doesn't? (Is it just me or do all Urtext editions seem to assume everyone has huge hands, I can't reach half the shifts they suggest, like stepping back from 3rd to 1st position from 2nd to 1st finger...slurred...or do I need to grow?)

Ooh, who's your teacher-to-be?
Teacher to be is Christopher White, who learnt from Gruenberg, who learnt from Auer, who taught Milstein and Heifetz! Pretty neat :smile:

He has scary bowing technique, I have none, it's a good match :smile:

Reply 123

I haven't really ever had good experiences with Tema - they used Vincent Manze who almost destroyed my violin and bow and valued it at a tenth of its value, lied about the flute that they lent me, have sent me lots of wrong music, and didn't replace my disintegrating case (clearly poor design) because it was one week out of warranty.

I'll photocopy mine now :smile:

it's probably not legal, but it is only a cadenza, and it's enough to learn from for now even if you do need an original part in the future. I'm not keen on the Schirmer edition for the pure reason that they've written out all the appoggiaturas and turns, not generally in the way I play them!

He taught Milstein and Heifetz? :eek:

*bows down*

(Is it just me or do all Urtext editions seem to assume everyone has huge hands, I can't reach half the shifts they suggest, like stepping back from 3rd to 1st position from 2nd to 1st finger...slurred...or do I need to grow?)

You need to-... nah, you don't need to grow :p:

if you can do a real (thumb) shift, it shouldn't be a problem, except you'll need to be swift to get it sounding clean... if it's an extension: that's ridiculous, stretching a fourth between second and first fingers :eek:

Please could you give us the bar number? :biggrin:

Reply 124

Is Vince Manze not a great luthier? I've never had him do anything major, but he managed to restore my violin which was found completely flattened, and made it into something which sounds decent. I've got to go to Tema on Tuesday to pick up a book of Mozart Sonatas. Hope they managed to get the right one, they didn't realise that there was such a thing as different editions of the same work :rolleyes:

Where do you go now, or do you just order online?

I'll photocopy mine now :smile:

Thanks very much for photocopying :smile:

I'll buy my own one day, it probably is a bit illegal.
Speaking of ornaments, you know in the first solo phrase, do you play CDCBC where it says to play a trill, or can you get another trill in there?

He taught Milstein and Heifetz? :eek:

*bows down*

But most people can find their way around the violin family tree to someone famous, if you go back far enough, everyone ends up at one of two people - either some Russian bloke (that's my line) or an Italian. Except Paganini, he only taught 1 person and was largely self-taught, so it's nearly impossible to be musically realted to him. Personally I reckon that's really cool :smile:

Well I do sort of need to grow (my hands are small for my height, and my height is...minimal), but for the moment I'm downsizing my violin :biggrin:

I've been form 1/32 size up to 4/4, and now back down to 7/8 (the same type that Jan K uses, probably) because I can't play some repertoire because of my rubbish tiny hands. Stupid genetics. Shifting is the bane of my life. I'll look up the bar number if I can find it when I practice (later, involves walking up stairs which is challenging). I don't think it's an extension, just a shift, a bit like when you play 3rd finger 3rds pos, 2nd finger 2nd pos, 1st finger 1st pos near the top of the 3rd page in the Urtext (?), but without the middle step.

Reply 125

bohemian

Is Vince Manze not a great luthier? I've never had him do anything major, but he managed to restore my violin which was found completely flattened, and made it into something which sounds decent.

Well, he crammed so much hair into my bow the tip and frog almost exploded, apparently, and then he glued the slide on with superglue. :eek:

He also advised me to grip my pegs with blackboard chalk, which eats into the pegbox and pegs and slowly destroys the instrument. I now go to Evans-Pughe for EVERYTHING - they're so professional and know so much and there's so much skill there, and they're quite reasonable for what they do.

bohemian

I've got to go to Tema on Tuesday to pick up a book of Mozart Sonatas. Hope they managed to get the right one, they didn't realise that there was such a thing as different editions of the same work :rolleyes:

Where do you go now, or do you just order online?

I use Fuller Music, either online or over the phone - they seem to have most editions of most pieces and they know what they're talking about.

bohemian

Speaking of ornaments, you know in the first solo phrase, do you play CDCBC where it says to play a trill, or can you get another trill in there?

I don't know what the Urtext says, but I play B...DCBCDE GF#F#. I don't know if that's an acceptable interpretation or not, but no-one's pulled me up on it yet!

I did think, hang on, your teacher would have to be at least 100 for that to work :p:

I see what you mean now - yes, Martin's line is from Vivaldi, so I am a pupil of Vivaldi :biggrin:

and now back down to 7/8 (the same type that Jan K uses, probably)

Ooh, didn't know that! Come to think of it, it does look quite small. His (new) Tomás Pilar is that?

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My teacher keeps on saying that his teacher was the pupil of someone famous; can'T remember the name now :p:

Reply 127

Hmm... at the end of the second solo phrase, when you play E G...BAG, do you play the E as a crotchet or a quaver? Schirmer says crotchet, I play quaver.

Reply 128

Quaver, definitely. Urtext says crochet too, but I ignored it. Will try crochet later just in case I'm being stupid, but I think most people play quaver :smile:

I looked at the bar numbers earlier and now I've forgotten them...now that's annoying. Well, you'll know the bit...about half way down page 2 (first solo page) in Urtext, when it goes A A A G# A G#, the next phrase has a jump which has to be played extremely legato, and just isn't natural for small hands. It's because it all has to be played on the E string I suppose. I also hate the way that when you play a perfect 5th across strings, and you have to use different fingers for each note, sometimes it seems to be completely unnecessary as well (so I don't do it :smile:

)

Evans-Pughe does have a good reputation, and they are ridiculously cheap - my friend bought a violin from there for £800, had £300 of work done on it, and it's now valued at £5000. Another alternative to buying a small violin is getting mine changed so it has a thinner neck, and possible shorter stop length, so I might give EP a call and see if they can do anything like that. I don't know who made Jan's, but it's definitely Czech, and for a new fiddle sounds quite open and not too mellow. His is a 4/4 apparently, but I don't reckon it's full length - a lot of E. European violins are a bit under 4/4 size, but not small enough to be considered 7/8, and also their shape favours smaller players much more than Italian/Chinese styles.

Vivaldi - now that is cool!

I looked at the Mahler. It's not that bad. If that's the hardest page, I can live with it.

Reply 129

I've got a Viennese violin which is about 200 years old :proud:

Ever heard of Sebastian Dallinger? I absolutely love my violin, always has a really rich sound and just sounds beautiful :biggrin:

Reply 130

4Ed

hmm I'm currently saving up to buy myself a new violin for my 21st (in December). By then I'll have about £1600 (unless my parents actually match a proportion of the money I save like they've mentioned they might).

Where would you people recommend getting a violin from? I'm a bit wary of getting stuff from London because the prices might be hiked up a bit, although I'm not sure which other places do violins at a good price.

Reply 131

I'm afraid I really can't help you with places. I got mine in my hometown in Germany from some really great violin builder (does this word exist? :confused:

lol) so yeah...

Reply 132

4Ed

oh, and I've had Mozart's 3rd for about 3 years now... and it really is an amazing piece to play!

I'm not sure what edition of the cadenza I've got, however I do know that the photocopied 1st movement cadenza is the one that Yehudi Menuhin played in his recordings of the Mozart violin concertos, as I borrowed the set from a friend, and they're the ones I have!
My copy of the the Mozart is a Peter's edition I think... and that's a different cadenza altogehter

Reply 133

hey all of you guys! I'm gonna be off TSR for about 1 or 2 weeks (trying to get a ban from the mods... :redface:

). good luck every one with exams (be it music or academic)! :flybye:

Reply 134

Aww... good luck with whatever you're doing in those weeks, and come STRAIGHT back here! :wavey:

some really great violin builder (does this word exist? lol)

Luthier or violinmaker usually, but violin builder will do perfectly well :biggrin:

Reply 135

Hello everyone :smile:

Guess where I practiced yesterday?
Out on deck on a ferry on the English Channel!
Ended up giving a (very short) impromptu concert to 20 Brittany Ferries engineers and a couple of passengers.

Started practicing Mozart 3 without the music later on, then realised I don't actually know it yet. Whoops! Ooh, the cadenza is really fun (thanks Jonny!) except the bits you said would be very hard...I think I'll follow your lead and cut them :smile:

Oooooh exciting things...I'm going to Cremona in the Summer (probably) :smile:

and then getting a new violin from the Czech Republic hopefully also this summer :smile:

Reply 136

lol, that must have been wicked bohemian :p:

anyhow, back again! After a week of intense revision...

Reply 137

4Ed

What concertos/pieces have you guys studied after Mozart 3? I had it about 3 years ago, and haven't actually purchased much solo music since then. Assuming that was my level back then, I'd like something along the same difficulty but a bit more challenging.

I've got a copy of Franck's Sonata, but I'd prefer to learn concertos as they seem quite fun!

Reply 138

I dunno... What I've played so far was for instance the Bruch g minor concerto, but that was only "revised" since I'd played it pretty much 2 years ago in a competition. Also, I've played the Nigun by Ernst Bloch (Baal Shem or something, Nigun is the 2nd piece of it) and am kinda in the middle of studying the mendelssohn e minor concerto. What else have I done... I think Bach pieces are generally great - I can play almost the entire partita in e major, and I still have fun with it :biggrin:

I think the Franck's sonata sposed to be really good, I might have a go at that soon then :p:

Reply 139