Man stoned to death in US because the bible says to stone gays

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Reply 80

nmudz_009

Original post by miser

We shouldn't hate full stop.

That is absolutely right.

Reply 81

Srxjer

Original post by Protoman2050

Well, I'm haven't, and God never has, advocated genocide. Those who think God advocates genocide need to read more carefully.

Just read this and will explain why the Israelites annihilating the Amalekites was not genocide: http://christianthinktank.com/rbutcher1.html

I don't know why you're so bothered about the semantics of it, the men, women, children and animals were all still slaughtered. I'm still going to go with genocide.

How would you word it, organized mass murder?

Original post by Protoman2050

The Bible never claimed a geocentric universe. It makes no claim whatsoever advocating geocentrism, nor heliocentrism. Why is it impossible for an omnipotent God to stop the rotation of the Earth and correct for all of the adverse effects that would have? The Catholic Church didn't understand what a miracle was, and how Galileo et al.'s claims didn't contradict anything in the Bible.

wat

Reply 82

karateworm

Original post by Protoman2050

The guy was likely mentally unstable. Also, does anyone realize that Christians were not given the command to uphold the Law of Moses? Christianity was founded in the New Testament, not the Old.

And before you say, "then why are gays still considered sinners by Christians?", please realize this: anything in the Old Testament that was repeated in the New Testament is still a sin, anything that wasn't and that you cannot infer is not.

Nowhere in the New Testament did it say to blaspheme by taking God's executive power on yourself.

The "Christians" who physically attack those who sin have a special place in Hell reserved for themselves, and their punishment will be far worse.

What I really hate seeing is those who call themselves Christians accosting gays, because of what the gays do in response to their idiocy (interesting is how all they preach is hellfire, and not that Jesus came to save you from that). No-one is forcing them to listen. They can just walk away. Just ignore those people.

Although, we could easily get out of this. How? Stop caring about sex so much, all of you; there's more to life, like a career, making money, having power, good food, good friends, and fast cars. Sexuality is not the most defining characteristic of people, so everyone should stop complaining when their feelings get hurt because someone doesn't like it. It's your life, do what you want, stop letting other people's opinions hurt you.

If you hold the supposed quotations of Jesus as an authority, then you'd probably want to have a look at these:

Spoiler

But generally, I agree with what you're saying.

Reply 83

karateworm

Original post by Protoman2050

Will you stop equating God with Pol Pot?

And, as for God being a 'genocidal deity', the biblical events described do not seem to match what we think of by that term today. Even in the little section on the Amalekites, the description of the situation doesn't even come close to what we consider 'genocide' today. Most (but not all) things considered genocide today involve groups internal to the country in question, and they were either killed outright by their own government (sometimes slowly through torture and abuse) or deported to a place of sure-to-kill-them environment.

Academic definitions of genocide exclude combat deaths and noncombatants that die as a by-product of military action. It generally denotes the deliberate killing of someone solely because of their indelible group membership (indelible is the term used for race, ethnicity, nationality etc.--that characteristics that are 'indelible').

They are NOT an internal group

They are NOT a minority group

Amalekites are NOT targeted because of their Amalekite-ness (since they were welcome as immigrants in Israel)

They are never under the government control of Israel.

They are not pursed and hunted in other countries for extermination

The Amalekites were targeted because of what they did, not what they are.

Out of interest, what do you make of:

From there Elisha went up to Bethel. While he was on his way, some small boys came out of the city and jeered at him. "Go up baldhead," they shouted, "go up baldhead!" The prophet turned and saw them, and he cursed them in the name of the Lord. Then two shebears came out of the woods and tore forty two of the children to pieces. (2 Kings 2:23-24)

?

Reply 84

KimKallstrom

The difference is that this caused outrage in America because it's such an out-there case. But it goes on all the time in other countries and nobody cares because it's their right to have bigoted and savage policies.........as law!

Reply 85

Protoman2050

Original post by karateworm

Well, the King James Version has done us a disservice by translated the term as “children.” The Hebrew word can refer to “children,” but rather more specifically means "young men." The NIV uses the word “youths.” Second, the fact that the bears mauled 42 of the youths indicates that there were more than 42 youths involved. This was not a small group of children making fun of a bald man. Rather, it was a large demonstration of young men who assembled for the purpose of mocking a prophet of God. Third, the mocking of “go on up you baldhead,” is more than making fun of baldness. The baldness of Elisha referred to here may be: 1) natural loss of hair; 2) a shaved head denoting his separation to the prophetic office; or more likely, 3) an epithet of scorn and contempt, Elijah not being literally bald. The phrase “go up” likely was a reference to Elijah, Elisha’s mentor, being taken up to Heaven earlier in 2 Kings chapter 2:11-12. These youths were sarcastically taunting and insulting the Lord’s prophet by telling him to repeat Elijah’s translation.

Essentially, them taunting Elijah, God's prophet, was equivalent to taunting God Himself. Do heads of state tolerate it when their ambassadors are attacked?

Reply 86

Protoman2050

Original post by Srxjer

War, and providing a quick death to the women and children who would otherwise starve to death in the desert.

Semantics are extremely important, you know. Nuances of words have caused wars and revolts.

Read the link, and it will explain everything.

It's awful

Original post by karateworm

If you hold the supposed quotations of Jesus as an authority, then you'd probably want to have a look at these:

“For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” (Matthew 5:18-19)

"It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid." (Luke 16:17)

"Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. Amen, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest part or the smallest part of a letter will pass from the law, until all things have taken place." (Matthew 5:17)

"All scripture is inspired by God and is useful for teaching, for refutation, for correction, and for training in righteousness..." (2 Timothy 3:16)

Know this first of all, that there is no prophecy of scripture that is a matter of personal interpretation, for no prophecy ever came through human will; but rather human beings moved by the holy Spirit spoke under the influence of God." (2 Peter 20-21)

QUOTE]

Yes, that means it is still sin. But Christians were not given the command to enforce the societal law. The law he was referring to was the moral law those laws were based upon.

Jesus fufilled the Mosaic law, and terminated it's secular enforcement.

Reply 89

Srxjer

Original post by Protoman2050

War, and providing a quick death to the women and children who would otherwise starve to death in the desert.

Read the link, and it will explain everything.

Unbelievable. I'm sure the perpetrators of the Rwandan Genocide had similar condolences.

The link doesn't explain anything, I actually find it disgusting how the writer tries to justify the killings by basically writing: "look it wasn't as bad as you might think, the killings were needed!"

Semantics are extremely important, you know. Nuances of words have caused wars and revolts.

The irony.

Reply 90

James10000

Original post by noorkhanuk85

http://thenewcivilrightsmovement.com/70-year-old-stoned-to-death-because-the-bible-says-to-stone-gays/news/2011/03/18/18138

Your thoughts?

You think thats scary....you should read my thread on the Religious Right in america

http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?t=1742149

Reply 91

L i b

Original post by Reformed2010

Of course I don't want dive into the history of the Judeo-Christian faith. Not on a forum at this sleepy time of night. But if you want, I will. But you seriously suggesting historically the Catholic church has not taken a literal approach to the Bible? to the Book of Genesis for example?

The Roman Catholic Church has never taught that the Bible is to be interpreted literally. That is not to say, at times, it assumed a level of literalism in parts which are not accepted as being literally true today. Ultimately, Catholics accept that the Bible teaches certain truths.

Let's face it Lib. You really don't have any authority to be able to argue with anyone on here, with such clarity and certainty. If the bible is suppose to be taken literally or not. It's just your opinion.

Just my opinion? There is nothing greater on this earth than a man's reasoned opinion.

Reply 92

Protoman2050

Original post by Srxjer

What would you have done if you were faced leading a fledgling nation that was being attacked and raided over centuries by another nation? The Amalekites were not targeted by their race, as many served in the Israelite army without issue. The ones who didn't integrate, and remained behind in their barbarous ways were targeted to end the violence.

I'd hate to see you leading Israel back then, because you apparently can't make tough decisions. You couldn't bring yourself to say "We have to utterly destroy these people, or they're going to continue their attacks in some form or another."

Answer me this: what would you have done in the face of this real threat, not an imagined one like the perpetrators of the Rwandan genocide?

Reply 93

Stratos

Original post by Reformed2010

As books go, I'd rather give my child Harry Potter than the Bible for getting their morals.

1. Do not cast sectum sempra upon the innocent, unless they're a dirty malfoy
2. Do not touch Dumbledore's robe, he's too fly for you
3. Do not touch the robe

Reply 94

Reformed2010

Original post by Stratos

1. Do not cast sectum sempra upon the innocent, unless they're a dirty malfoy
2. Do not touch Dumbledore's robe, he's too fly for you
3. Do not touch the robe

You've completely lost me. I think you need some sleep.

Reply 95

Manitude

Leviticus 20:13 is the verse used to 'justify' this murder.

Somewhat disturbingly, I just checked that verse in the Bible I was given when I left primary school age 11 and it is in there, encouraging readers to murder homosexuals.

(edited 12 years ago)

Reply 96

Protoman2050

Original post by Manitude

Does anyone pay attention the fact the gay guy made his murderer his sole heir to his will, as reported in the article? Isn't that a much more likely reason he murdered him?

Reply 97

saguaro123

that guy was 70 years old :eek:

you must be crazy to inflict that sort of pain to the elderly :frown:

Reply 98

A Mysterious Lord

A grown man of 28 copying actions from a storybook :rolleyes:

Reply 99

sorafdfs

As Jesus said:

If your right eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. And if your right hand causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell.