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Training Contracts 2014

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    Does anyone know how long firms take between you submitting your application and them deciding to interview? I'm intending apply as soon as my results are out (i.e. end June/early July) and wondering how long I should plan to hang around london! Been trawling through last years threads but its difficult to make head or tail of the actual chronology involved.
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    (Original post by desideratalison)
    Does anyone know how long firms take between you submitting your application and them deciding to interview? I'm intending apply as soon as my results are out (i.e. end June/early July) and wondering how long I should plan to hang around london! Been trawling through last years threads but its difficult to make head or tail of the actual chronology involved.
    Assuming you mean applications for 2014, I don't think that's particularly smart. Most of the firms will close their applications around that time (most on 31st July, but some sooner). There are career timetables on LCN and in the Chambers Guide and the Training Contract Handbook.
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    (Original post by desideratalison)
    Does anyone know how long firms take between you submitting your application and them deciding to interview? I'm intending apply as soon as my results are out (i.e. end June/early July) and wondering how long I should plan to hang around london! Been trawling through last years threads but its difficult to make head or tail of the actual chronology involved.
    If you're a second year law student, then the time you plan on applying (end June/ early July) is the right time and that is when everyone else will be applying. This is because most firms specify that they want to see your second year results on your application. Of course, this does not apply to students like Oxford Law penultimate years who don't have any exams at the end of second year. So basically, if you're a penultimate year Law student who doesn't go to Oxford, then ignore Clip's comment above. (@Clip, haha, for real I might have to smack you over the internet next time you make such semi-wrong, one-side-of-the-story statements )

    However, if you're actually a final year non-law student, then yeah, you should have started applying late last year as some applications have even closed. Nonetheless, some will still be open till the end of July. It is just safer to apply earlier.

    Having said that, in answer to your question, some firms may get back to you before the deadline on 31st July, but a lot of them start getting back to candidates on the 1st August. Most interviews take place throughout August, so staying around London for a substantial part of August might be necessary (depending on how many firms you apply to and get interviews with).
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    (Original post by maghreblover)
    If you're a second year law student, then the time you plan on applying (end June/ early July) is the right time and that is when everyone else will be applying. This is because most firms specify that they want to see your second year results on your application. Of course, this does not apply to students like Oxford Law penultimate years who don't have any exams at the end of second year. So basically, if you're a penultimate year Law student who doesn't go to Oxford, then ignore Clip's comment above. (@Clip, haha, for real I might have to smack you over the internet next time you make such semi-wrong, one-side-of-the-story statements )

    However, if you're actually a final year non-law student, then yeah, you should have started applying late last year as some applications have even closed. Nonetheless, some will still be open till the end of July. It is just safer to apply earlier.

    Having said that, in answer to your question, some firms may get back to you before the deadline on 31st July, but a lot of them start getting back to candidates on the 1st August. Most interviews take place throughout August, so staying around London for a substantial part of August might be necessary (depending on how many firms you apply to and get interviews with).
    Ok. I'm happy to be contradicted, but not one single firm that I have applied to has asked to see 2nd year exam results, and I'm not aware of a single firm that does. Sure, some offer the facility to add them when you get them, but I've not seen any requirement to do so.
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    (Original post by hmaus)
    I agree with maghreblover on this.

    I remember seeing various firms' FAQs saying second years should wait to get their results before they apply. Some firms (e.g. Clifford Chance) have two application rounds to reflect the different timetables for law and non-law candidates. CC recruited all its non-law trainees by Jan/Feb but didn't even open applications to second year lawyers until July.

    Most firms probably don't explicitly state that you need your second year results to apply because it just seems like common sense. It's difficult for a firm to fairly judge a candidate based only on A levels and first year results when they have at least 2 years of results for the non-law final year students and 3 or 4 years of results for graduates.
    I don't doubt your explanation - but what I'm saying is that I have made 10 or more applications, and at no time ever seen anything in any grad recruitment site or brochure or application form that states anything at all about 2nd year results, or even suggesting that 2nd year LLBers should wait until June/July.

    I also don't see why it should be common sense. Application for trainees is pretty much completely unregulated, so the firms do whatever they like. Some are on CV + Letter for crying out loud - so I don't see why candidates should assume that because one firm wants to see two sets of results, another firm would, too. On top of that, lots of firms recruit straight from VS, and there's been some debate on whether it's actually harder to get on VS than TC. 2nd year LLBers will all be applying to VS with only a single set of results.

    Every firm that I have spoken to, either at a fair or open day or presentation - has never brought it up. Is it not possible that you're basing this on the practices of a few firms that do detail this?
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    Has anybody heard from Norton Rose? If so, how was the assessment day?
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    (Original post by hmaus)
    I agree with maghreblover on this.

    I remember seeing various firms' FAQs saying second years should wait to get their results before they apply. Some firms (e.g. Clifford Chance) have two application rounds to reflect the different timetables for law and non-law candidates. CC recruited all its non-law trainees by Jan/Feb but didn't even open applications to second year lawyers until July.

    Most firms probably don't explicitly state that you need your second year results to apply because it just seems like common sense. It's difficult for a firm to fairly judge a candidate based only on A levels and first year results when they have at least 2 years of results for the non-law final year students and 3 or 4 years of results for graduates.
    It's better for a 2nd year LLB student to wait till results but you can apply earlier. Some firms, if you apply for their VS, require you to also apply for their TC so for some firms, you technically apply for the TC with 1st year results only. They will keep the TC app in if you don't make the VS one (I had to turn down a VS offer with DAC last year and they said they'd keep the app for the TC part)
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    (Original post by gethsemane342)
    It's better for a 2nd year LLB student to wait till results but you can apply earlier. Some firms, if you apply for their VS, require you to also apply for their TC so for some firms, you technically apply for the TC with 1st year results only. They will keep the TC app in if you don't make the VS one (I had to turn down a VS offer with DAC last year and they said they'd keep the app for the TC part)
    The whole point is not that you can't, it is that a lot of firms- at least most I've spoken to (say majority of the top 20 firms and many of the top American firms)- advise penultimate years to wait for second year results before applying straight for TCs. Granted there will be firms that have app systems that deviate from this, but the norm is that most students apply in that June/ July period before the 31st July deadline, having received their second results.

    Going down the VS route is different, of course, as you can have TC interviews right at the end of it (and I did so for two easter schemes as a penultimate year student last year)- so yes, in such cases you do get TCs based on just your first year results. And for those who do apply earlier than that June/July period, they may get TCs on the basis of just their first year results. But the norm, and what most top firms I've spoken to advise, is that they would prefer to see your second year results.

    Anyway, the whole point of this is that Clip was telling the poster above that she was getting late for TC applications when, in fact, (if a penultimate year student) she is not.
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    (Original post by maghreblover)
    The whole point is not that you can't, it is that a lot of firms- at least most I've spoken to (say majority of the top 20 firms and many of the top American firms)- advise penultimate years to wait for second year results before applying straight for TCs. Granted there will be firms that have app systems that deviate from this, but the norm is that most students apply in that June/ July period before the 31st July deadline, having received their second results.

    Going down the VS route is different, of course, as you can have TC interviews right at the end of it (and I did so for two easter schemes as a penultimate year student last year)- so yes, in such cases you do get TCs based on just your first year results. And for those who do apply earlier than that June/July period, they may get TCs on the basis of just their first year results. But the norm, and what most top firms I've spoken to advise, is that they would prefer to see your second year results.

    Anyway, the whole point of this is that Clip was telling the poster above that she was getting late for TC applications when, in fact, (if a penultimate year student) she is not.
    As I said, you would be stupid to apply before getting your 2nd year results. My point was that hmaus said you couldn't apply before then and you can. It's not the same as saying you should do it - for example I know (from recent experience) that I can fall down a flight of stairs without breaking a single bone. It doesn't mean I should topple down the stairs if I'm in a rush (apart from anything else, it *really* hurts)
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    (Original post by maghreblover)
    The whole point is not that you can't, it is that a lot of firms- at least most I've spoken to (say majority of the top 20 firms and many of the top American firms)- advise penultimate years to wait for second year results before applying straight for TCs. Granted there will be firms that have app systems that deviate from this, but the norm is that most students apply in that June/ July period before the 31st July deadline, having received their second results.

    Anyway, the whole point of this is that Clip was telling the poster above that she was getting late for TC applications when, in fact, (if a penultimate year student) she is not.
    Once more for the road.

    How is this "the norm" or some kind of common practice if it is not written, recommended or even suggested anywhere I have seen across dozens and dozens of firms?

    Not one firm I have looked into or applied to has even hinted at it, and almost all of them have the facility to add exam results (to completed applications) as they come in.

    On top of that, last year I didn't receive my 1st year results until July 15th.
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    (Original post by Clip)
    Once more for the road.

    How is this "the norm" or some kind of common practice if it is not written, recommended or even suggested anywhere I have seen across dozens and dozens of firms?

    Not one firm I have looked into or applied to has even hinted at it, and almost all of them have the facility to add exam results (to completed applications) as they come in.

    On top of that, last year I didn't receive my 1st year results until July 15th.
    I don't know what firms you've applied to, and as hmaus said, not all firms expressly say it on their website. However, a brief conversation with an HR representative of most of the top 20 firms will show you that this is, in fact, common practice. Firms like Clifford Chance, Allen and Overy, Simmons and Simmons, and others, do not even open their TC apps for penultimate years till June. A lot of these top firms don't start interviewing law students till August.

    And yes, July 15th may seem late to you- it doesn't change the fact that this is when most people apply and a lot of firms recommend. Law results in my uni came out a little earlier than at your uni, but they still came out in July and that's when most people I know started their non-vac scheme TC applications.

    For a more general view, see this quote from LawCareers.Net on 'When to apply':

    Many law firms look to fill their training contract places two years in advance. For law undergraduates this means applying in June/July of the summer vacation between your second and third year (and before you start the GDL if you are a non-law graduate).
    On Lawyer2B's solicitor timeline, it points to the same June/ July TC application period (specifying summer)

    http://l2b.thelawyer.com/useful-reso...tors-timeline/

    Quote from the websites of a random selection of top firms:

    Slaughter and May: If you are a law student, you should submit your application in the summer before you enter your final year of study, after you have received your examination results. We accept applications from law students in June and July.

    http://www.slaughterandmay.com/caree...-to-apply.aspx

    Freshfields: When to apply for a training contract

    You can apply any time between 1 November 2011 and 31 July 2012 for a training contract to begin in 2014. If you are a law undergraduate, the earliest you can apply is once you have your penultimate-year exam results.

    http://careers.freshfields.com/globa...ly-online.aspx

    Hogan Lovells:

    Start applying for training contracts as early in the summer as possible, but wait until you have your penultimate year exam results first.

    http://graduates.hoganlovells.com/yo...ning_timeline/

    Herbert Smith:

    Penultimate year students should include details of second year results.

    http://graduates.hoganlovells.com/yo...ning_timeline/

    Norton Rose:

    If you are a penultimate year law student, please wait until you know the results of your second-year exams.

    http://www.nortonrosegraduates.com/e...cation-process

    etc, etc, etc

    Also, you can read an old thread where the same thing is emphasised:

    http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?t=729919

    So yes, across the top firms it IS common practice.
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    I haven't applied to any of those firms.

    I have applied to four firms that have asked silly questions about which character you would be in a book or suchlike. Does that mean that asking about one's congruence with fictional characters is common practice?

    Three firms ask for letter + CV. Is that common practice? I know it isn't, but it's three more than asked for second year results.

    There are, by definition, a near infinite number of things that are not expressly stated on recruiting sites. I don't see the mileage in second guessing what some of them might be.
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    (Original post by Clip)
    I haven't applied to any of those firms.

    I have applied to four firms that have asked silly questions about which character you would be in a book or suchlike. Does that mean that asking about one's congruence with fictional characters is common practice?

    Three firms ask for letter + CV. Is that common practice? I know it isn't, but it's three more than asked for second year results.

    There are, by definition, a near infinite number of things that are not expressly stated on recruiting sites. I don't see the mileage in second guessing what some of them might be.
    Generalisation is illogical- yes, I'm aware of that. Which is why I first gave quotes from websites which cover a wide range of training contracts available across the UK (LawCareers.Net and Lawyer2B) to show the general view on when to apply. Both stated the 'June/July' and 'summer before July 31st', respectively. If the general view isn't common practice, then I don't know what else is.

    I gave those quotes from specific firms only to show specific examples- to emphasise why exactly firms preferred applications to be put in late, and to corroborate the view that it is definitely not getting late to apply for training contracts if you're a penultimate year law student, as you erroneously stated earlier to a poster. And as I said, most firms don't even put it on their website, but from going to my uni law fair and speaking to recruiters, I have found second year results to be a common preference on the firms' part. I'm not second-guessing, I'm repeating what I've been told by recruiters.

    As I have mentioned earlier, all of this is based on my experience with most of the top 20 UK firms and some American firms.

    To add a further general view, advice from a writer on The Law Society website states 'If you're not planning on taking a gap year, apply for training contracts after receiving your penultimate year exam results.' If websites like Lawyer2B, The Law Society and LawCareers.Net identify the same June/July as the generally accepted periods to make applications, who am I to argue with websites that are experts on such matters?
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    Hey guys, it's the weekend, relax!
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    Possibly best advice offered all week haha.
    (Original post by Wildcard)
    Hey guys, it's the weekend, relax!
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    Got this message from Taylor Wessing:

    We are currently still reviewing the applications and we will be in touch in due course.

    We are looking at running our assessment centres in July and August. If your situation changes before this date, I would be grateful if you could email graduate@taylorwessing.com to let me know.


    I interpret this to be I am on the reserve list for interviews, they are waiting to see what the calibre of candidates they will have by July is. I have already had an interview with Travers Smith who I applied to at the same time as Taylor Wessing so I feel if I was through to interview they would have offered it by now.

    Anyone else agree with this take?
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    Offer of a first interview with SNR Denton in a couple of weeks' time. Quite pleased as if nothing else, it will be good to have the practise...
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    (Original post by JustWonderingWhy)
    Offer of a first interview with SNR Denton in a couple of weeks' time. Quite pleased as if nothing else, it will be good to have the practise...
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    (Original post by Clip)
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    Cheers, mate. Very early days yet but we'll be having a few drinks in London before you know it...
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    I sent in a training contract 2014 application for Mayer Brown about two months ago. Have not heard from them yet.

    Anybody in the same boat? Should I treat this as a silent PFO?

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