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Christians - right vs wrong OR 'dont judge'!!!!!

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    The nature of christianity is that some things are right and good, some things are wrong and sinful. those who do wrong (sin) will be judged and will go to hell. the existance of hell shows that not everyone will go to heaven, and therefore, in the words of St Paul "everything is permissible but not everything is beneficial".

    now most christians seem to think that their beliefs entail 'love thy neighbour' and 'dont judge'. and thats it. so if i ask questions to other christians like:

    - why does your church allow remarriage when this goes against the bible?
    - how comes is your priest a woman?
    - how can you be fundamental christian and openly homosexual?
    - how can you reconcile living together unmarried and fornication with 1 Thessalonians 5:5 - 12
    - certain actions for catholics are mortal and venial sins, how can you be catholic but not believe in the idea that some things are sinful?
    - why do you recive catholic communion when you are openly in mortal sin, have no intention to go confession and do not even believe in God?

    then instantly, they reply with 'DONT JUDGE!!!!CHRISTIANS SHOULD LOVE ONE ANOTHER AND NOT JUDGE!!!' even if i am simply asking 'why do you do this XXX when the bible says this, how can you reconcile the two? why does your church teach X when actually the bible says Y?' the other response they use is 'EVERYONE SINS, LET HE WHO IS WITHOUT SIN CAST THE FIRST STONE' but they have no intwention to stop sinning, nor to explain why they are doing somehing which is not compatible with the bible or worse still, why their CHURCH is doing somenthing incompatible with the Bbible.

    I have found this response mainly from protestants.

    also i have heard many people say that christians are discriminatory and judgemental when they tell other chrisitans that something is a sin. but the bible says that we have a duty to inform other christians of their sin to help them be saved.

    surely it is required to judge in order to discern right from wrong? and if right and wrong exists, then there is a duty to our christian brethren to inform them that what they are doing leads to hell, so they can amend their ways and repent before it is too late? if someoen was putting their hand into a can of worms wouldnt you say 'stop that can is full of worms!'?
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    (Original post by shinytoy)
    The nature of christianity is that some things are right and good, some things are wrong and sinful. those who do wrong (sin) will be judged and will go to hell. the existance of hell shows that not everyone will go to heaven, and therefore, in the words of St Paul "everything is permissible but not everything is beneficial".

    now most christians seem to think that their beliefs entail 'love thy neighbour' and 'dont judge'. and thats it. so if i ask questions to other christians like:

    - why does your church allow remarriage when this goes against the bible?
    - how comes is your priest a woman?
    - how can you be fundamental christian and openly homosexual?
    - how can you reconcile living together unmarried and fornication with 1 Thessalonians 5:5 - 12
    - certain actions for catholics are mortal and venial sins, how can you be catholic but not believe in the idea that some things are sinful?
    - why do you recive catholic communion when you are openly in mortal sin, have no intention to go confession and do not even believe in God?

    then instantly, they reply with 'DONT JUDGE!!!!CHRISTIANS SHOULD LOVE ONE ANOTHER AND NOT JUDGE!!!' even if i am simply asking 'why do you do this XXX when the bible says this, how can you reconcile the two? why does your church teach X when actually the bible says Y?' the other response they use is 'EVERYONE SINS, LET HE WHO IS WITHOUT SIN CAST THE FIRST STONE' but they have no intwention to stop sinning, nor to explain why they are doing somehing which is not compatible with the bible or worse still, why their CHURCH is doing somenthing incompatible with the Bbible.

    I have found this response mainly from protestants.

    also i have heard many people say that christians are discriminatory and judgemental when they tell other chrisitans that something is a sin. but the bible says that we have a duty to inform other christians of their sin to help them be saved.

    surely it is required to judge in order to discern right from wrong? and if right and wrong exists, then there is a duty to our christian brethren to inform them that what they are doing leads to hell, so they can amend their ways and repent before it is too late? if someoen was putting their hand into a can of worms wouldnt you say 'stop that can is full of worms!'?
    why was this negged?
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    Fundamentally Christians are called to charity and, as St. Thomas Aquinas pointed out, informing someone that they're in a state of sin is charity. It might hurt their feelings but quite frankly if someone's about to walk into a burning building and they get pulled back it might hurt their shouler but at least they're saved.
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    (Original post by shinytoy)
    The nature of christianity is that some things are right and good, some things are wrong and sinful. those who do wrong (sin) will be judged and will go to hell. the existance of hell shows that not everyone will go to heaven, and therefore, in the words of St Paul "everything is permissible but not everything is beneficial".

    now most christians seem to think that their beliefs entail 'love thy neighbour' and 'dont judge'. and thats it. so if i ask questions to other christians like:

    - why does your church allow remarriage when this goes against the bible?
    - how comes is your priest a woman?
    - how can you be fundamental christian and openly homosexual?
    - how can you reconcile living together unmarried and fornication with 1 Thessalonians 5:5 - 12
    - certain actions for catholics are mortal and venial sins, how can you be catholic but not believe in the idea that some things are sinful?
    - why do you recive catholic communion when you are openly in mortal sin, have no intention to go confession and do not even believe in God?

    then instantly, they reply with 'DONT JUDGE!!!!CHRISTIANS SHOULD LOVE ONE ANOTHER AND NOT JUDGE!!!' even if i am simply asking 'why do you do this XXX when the bible says this, how can you reconcile the two? why does your church teach X when actually the bible says Y?' the other response they use is 'EVERYONE SINS, LET HE WHO IS WITHOUT SIN CAST THE FIRST STONE' but they have no intwention to stop sinning, nor to explain why they are doing somehing which is not compatible with the bible or worse still, why their CHURCH is doing somenthing incompatible with the Bbible.

    I have found this response mainly from protestants.

    also i have heard many people say that christians are discriminatory and judgemental when they tell other chrisitans that something is a sin. but the bible says that we have a duty to inform other christians of their sin to help them be saved.

    surely it is required to judge in order to discern right from wrong? and if right and wrong exists, then there is a duty to our christian brethren to inform them that what they are doing leads to hell, so they can amend their ways and repent before it is too late? if someoen was putting their hand into a can of worms wouldnt you say 'stop that can is full of worms!'?
    As far as I see it, and have always seen it, the Bible was written by men, not God. Therefore, whatever is in there isn't necessarily right or relevant these days. That's why I love everyone - divorcées, homosexuals, feminists included.

    I love God. I love my fellow humans. I love animals and insects and bad TV soaps. And, to quote the Bible, who are you to judge your neighbour? What makes your interpretation of right and wrong the correct interpretation?

    You're better to leave the judging to God and put your efforts in telling people they're wrong into loving other people instead.
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    (Original post by adamrules247)
    Fundamentally Christians are called to charity and, as St. Thomas Aquinas pointed out, informing someone that they're in a state of sin is charity. It might hurt their feelings but quite frankly if someone's about to walk into a burning building and they get pulled back it might hurt their shouler but at least they're saved.

    well thats the way i see it. in the book of 1 Corinthians, it says we have a DUTY to point out sin amongst our brethren.

    but i recently had a friend, catholic, who is getting married in catholic church with a proper mass. she is having fully prmaritial sex and livign with her partner and contracepting.

    i said to her, how comes are you doing these things but you have just told the priest you are a practicing catholic? she said 'oh well i think these things are all ok, everyone has different understandings and feelings about the catholic beliefs' .

    so i quoted her the catechism which is totally unambigous, and says 'fornication is sex between an unmarried persons....it is gravely disordered and deeply offends human dignity'. i then explained that it was a mortal sin (against the 9th and 6th commandments of adultery and coveting anothers spouse), and she should confess, do penance and repent, and stop doing it.

    she said 'we all have different feelings about those teachings' and i said 'yes, those different feelings, if you act on them, are called sin' she got all uppity and said 'thats soo judgemental and holier than thou, you shouldnt judge'.....

    it deeply offends me to see the abuse of the sacrament of marriage, people taking communion with no respect for being in a state of grace, and not caring about avoiding sin.
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    (Original post by shinytoy)
    The nature of christianity is that some things are right and good, some things are wrong and sinful. those who do wrong (sin) will be judged and will go to hell. the existance of hell shows that not everyone will go to heaven, and therefore, in the words of St Paul "everything is permissible but not everything is beneficial".

    now most christians seem to think that their beliefs entail 'love thy neighbour' and 'dont judge'. and thats it. so if i ask questions to other christians like:

    - why does your church allow remarriage when this goes against the bible?
    - how comes is your priest a woman?
    - how can you be fundamental christian and openly homosexual?
    - how can you reconcile living together unmarried and fornication with 1 Thessalonians 5:5 - 12
    - certain actions for catholics are mortal and venial sins, how can you be catholic but not believe in the idea that some things are sinful?
    - why do you recive catholic communion when you are openly in mortal sin, have no intention to go confession and do not even believe in God?

    then instantly, they reply with 'DONT JUDGE!!!!CHRISTIANS SHOULD LOVE ONE ANOTHER AND NOT JUDGE!!!' even if i am simply asking 'why do you do this XXX when the bible says this, how can you reconcile the two? why does your church teach X when actually the bible says Y?' the other response they use is 'EVERYONE SINS, LET HE WHO IS WITHOUT SIN CAST THE FIRST STONE' but they have no intwention to stop sinning, nor to explain why they are doing somehing which is not compatible with the bible or worse still, why their CHURCH is doing somenthing incompatible with the Bbible.

    I have found this response mainly from protestants.

    also i have heard many people say that christians are discriminatory and judgemental when they tell other chrisitans that something is a sin. but the bible says that we have a duty to inform other christians of their sin to help them be saved.

    surely it is required to judge in order to discern right from wrong? and if right and wrong exists, then there is a duty to our christian brethren to inform them that what they are doing leads to hell, so they can amend their ways and repent before it is too late? if someoen was putting their hand into a can of worms wouldnt you say 'stop that can is full of worms!'?
    I think I see why you're confused. You have got the fundamentals totally wrong. The nature of Christianity is not as you described it. We have all done wrong because nobody is perfect but we are save through God's love and Jesus Christ. So all those who do wrong (sin) are not automatically judged and go to hell because those who accept Jesus as their saviour are saved regardless of what they have done.

    People are imperfect and God knows it and (even Christians) will mess up and do wrong but God still loves us and we're still saved. There are a lot of Christians who do wong because it's convenient and will get defensive when you question them about it. It seems as though you have met your fair share of them. They're not being the christian they should be but they will still be saved regardless of their sins.

    The second thing to remember is that the Bible serves as a history book and a guide to live our lives through witnessing the actions of those in the Bible. Not everything they said or did was right and Jesus broke loads of these rules and regulations and angered many of the Jewish priests for doing so. What it all comes down to is love. You do good by someone you love for no reason other than because you love them and likewise, as we live our lives we do good because we love God since he loved us first.

    I hope that helps to clear up some confusion.
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    I'm not a christian, but I find it quite pathetic when you have religious person A saying "But [religious person B] isn't a proper christian/muslim/jew/etc! She does this and this and this, she's a worse christian/muslim/jew/etc than me!"


    ...I personally believe that faith should be a personal thing, that you should live your own lives in accordance with the morals that you believe in and that you shouldn't concern yourself with how well other people are sticking to their religious teachings, because really it's none of your business. OP, If you challenge other people on how well they stick with their faith, maybe you should stop. It doesn't really concern you, and really has no impact on your life. Maybe they come back with "Don't judge" because judging other Christians is against your faith, so you're invalidating your own challenge by actually making it.
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    (Original post by LisaBarron)
    As far as I see it, and have always seen it, the Bible was written by men, not God. Therefore, whatever is in there isn't necessarily right or relevant these days.

    do you believe the ten commandments were handed to Moses by God?
    do you believe that the Word and Works of the Christ are as per the Bible?
    Do you believe in Christ? If you do not believe in the Bible, how can you be sure He existed and indeed is the Son?
    How can you be Christian without believing in the Bible?
    If you think the bible is not relavent or true today anymore, do you think Christs death was in vain?


    That's why I love everyone - divorcées, homosexuals, feminists included.

    indeed, so do we Christians, the commandment is to love thy neighbour. we also love those individuals. but we hate sin and the pain it causes. love the sinner hate the sin.

    I love God.

    which one?

    I love my fellow humans. I love animals and insects and bad TV soaps. And, to quote the Bible, who are you to judge your neighbour?

    which quotation are yu referring to? you arent actually quoting anything

    What makes your interpretation of right and wrong the correct interpretation?

    if you believe in the authority of the Christian God, the Bible is clear in most areas as to right and wrong. if you do not believe in the bible, where does your notion of right or wrong come from? your own fallible conscience, which is easily silenced, influenced by your needs and desires, and constructed only from your very limited life experience and knowledge?

    You're better to leave the judging to God and put your efforts in telling people they're wrong into loving other people instead.
    if you love someone wouldnt you want to save them from hell? if someone was about to be punched in the stomach, if you love them wouldnt you want to warn them?

    are you actually christian?
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    (Original post by GrassRoots)
    I think I see why you're confused. You have got the fundamentals totally wrong. The nature of Christianity is not as you described it. We have all done wrong because nobody is perfect but we are save through God's love and Jesus Christ.

    this is true, nowhere did i say anyone was perfect.

    So all those who do wrong (sin) are not automatically judged and go to hell because those who accept Jesus as their saviour are saved regardless of what they have done.

    are you saying, once saved always saved?
    a man can believe in Jesus, go kill a bunch of people and he will not go to hell?

    what is the point of the ten commandments, the Bible or even the teachings of Christ to tell us right from wrong?

    do you agree that God hates sin, and if you love God you should avoid sin?


    People are imperfect and God knows it and (even Christians) will mess up and do wrong but God still loves us and we're still saved. There are a lot of Christians who do wong because it's convenient and will get defensive when you question them about it. It seems as though you have met your fair share of them. They're not being the christian they should be but they will still be saved regardless of their sins.

    are you saying, they shouldnt bother to live a right life, and the Bible is not relavent since they are saved anyway? who cares about sin, sin is fun, get baptised and you have a lifelong pass to do as you please?

    The second thing to remember is that the Bible serves as a history book and a guide to live our lives through witnessing the actions of those in the Bible. Not everything they said or did was right and Jesus broke loads of these rules and regulations and angered many of the Jewish priests for doing so.

    what Jesus did was entirely right
    What it all comes down to is love. You do good by someone you love for no reason other than because you love them and likewise, as we live our lives we do good because we love God since he loved us first.

    if you love someoen, and they are in sin but are christian, you should tell them.

    but you havent answered the other part of my OP post - why cant i ask other christians 'why does your church say this when the bible says that' without them pulling the 'dont judge card'


    I hope that helps to clear up some confusion.
    uhh not really.

    (Original post by Boobies.)
    I'm not a christian, but I find it quite pathetic when you have religious person A saying "But [religious person B] isn't a proper christian/muslim/jew/etc! She does this and this and this, she's a worse christian/muslim/jew/etc than me!"
    where did i say i was better than anyone?

    ...I personally believe that faith should be a personal thing, that you should live your own lives in accordance with the morals that you believe in and that you shouldn't concern yourself with how well other people are sticking to their religious teachings, because really it's none of your business. OP, If you challenge other people on how well they stick with their faith, maybe you should stop. It doesn't really concern you, and really has no impact on your life. Maybe they come back with "Don't judge" because judging other Christians is against your faith, so you're invalidating your own challenge by actually making it.

    uhh there is a DUTY to judge in order to discern right from wrong. if you think killing is wrong, are you wrong for judging it to be so? if you think muerder is wrong, are you judging another persons lifestyle?

    1 Corinthians 5:12 BBE
    Bible in Basic English
    For it is no business of mine to be judging those who are outside; but it is yours to be judging those who are among you;

    "Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment." (John 7:24)

    "If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother. (Matthew 18:15)

    "Be on your guard! If your brother sins, rebuke him; and if he repents, forgive him. (Luke 17:3)

    Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you keep away from every brother who leads an unruly life and not according to the tradition which you received from us. (2 Thessalonians 3:6)


    also nobody has answered, why can i not ask the protestants WHY their church teaches or does certain things without them pulling the 'dont judge card?

    also, if we each have our own standards of right and wrong, ie i think murder is wrong, by implication that means i think a person who murders is wrong for doing so. is that a bad thing to believe? or should i 'live and let live' (or not as the case may be)? why do we have a legal system? can christians not work in law?
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    As a non-christian, my understanding of it is that christians seem to hold the view that there is a definite right and wrong, as written in the bible, and that if you commit wrong, you are in sin and [depending on the extent of your beliefs] will go to hell. However I think they also often believe that it is not for them to judge who is right and who is wrong, it is for God to judge. I think that's why a lot of Christians would be tolerant of a homosexual, say, because it's not their job to persecute them, it is God's job.

    Just to point out I don't personally hold this belief.
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    In theory humans can only see 3 choices rationally, yet what if there is a 4th one
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    (Original post by shinytoy)
    uhh not really.




    uhh there is a DUTY to judge in order to discern right from wrong. if you think killing is wrong, are you wrong for judging it to be so? if you think muerder is wrong, are you judging another persons lifestyle?

    1 Corinthians 5:12 BBE
    Bible in Basic English
    For it is no business of mine to be judging those who are outside; but it is yours to be judging those who are among you;

    "Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment." (John 7:24)

    "If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother. (Matthew 18:15)

    "Be on your guard! If your brother sins, rebuke him; and if he repents, forgive him. (Luke 17:3)

    Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you keep away from every brother who leads an unruly life and not according to the tradition which you received from us. (2 Thessalonians 3:6)


    also nobody has answered, why can i not ask the protestants WHY their church teaches or does certain things without them pulling the 'dont judge card?

    also, if we each have our own standards of right and wrong, ie i think murder is wrong, by implication that means i think a person who murders is wrong for doing so. is that a bad thing to believe? or should i 'live and let live' (or not as the case may be)? why do we have a legal system? can christians not work in law?
    are you saying, once saved always saved?
    a man can believe in Jesus, go kill a bunch of people and he will not go to hell?

    what is the point of the ten commandments, the Bible or even the teachings of Christ to tell us right from wrong?

    do you agree that God hates sin, and if you love God you should avoid sin?
    Technically yes. God's love is perfect and unending. If you accept Jesus as your saviour then you are saved no matter what you do. It's a bit like a father who loves their child no matter what they have done, only stronger.
    However I believe it is possible for someone to accept Jesus and then later reject him (backslide as people call it). If someone no-longer accepts Jesus as their saviour then I don't believe they will sitll go to heaven. Correct me if I'm wrong.

    If we accept and love Jesus then it should be our natural instinct to do what pleases him and love one and over. If someone then goes on to kill people, we have to ask two questions.
    1. Was he in the right frame of mind/suffering with some mental issue? In this case I believe that he would still go to heaven as the murder was not intentional.
    2. Does that person really accept and love Jesus? If they genuinely do, I cannot see how it would be humanly possible to commit such an act out of their own will as the two contradict. If they did do this out of their own will I would question whether they hav backsliden or not. It is impossible for anyone but that person to know whether they have or haven't so I wouldn't be able to judge on any particular case.

    The ten commandments

    These were given to the Jews as a basic ruleset for living. As you read through the bible you see tat as God's relationship with his people strengthens and becomes more intimate, these rules are less important as they would all be automatically adhered to if we lived through love. That is why Jesus says the most important is to love God and love your neighbour. Being a christian isn't just about going to heaven. We have a living relationship with God so that us and those we do life with can live a fulfilled and fruitful life hear on Earth. That is where the teachings of the Bible come in. These are things we should be applying to our lives now, not a scorecard to go to heaven.

    are you saying, they shouldnt bother to live a right life, and the Bible is not relavent since they are saved anyway? who cares about sin, sin is fun, get baptised and you have a lifelong pass to do as you please?
    Hopefully much of the above would have answered this. We follow the teachings of Christ because it is a guide to living a perfectly fulfilled life. Maslow put self-actualisation at the top of his hierachy of needs (google it) and the only way I know of getting anywhere near that kind of fulfilment is to live a Christlike life in a living relationship with God. Again we follow these teaching not because we are saved but because we love God and our neighbours.
    Also a baptism is a public declaration of your love of God. It is leaving the old behind in the water and being reborn into a new life. You don't need to be baptised to go to heaven.

    what Jesus did was entirely right
    Agreed! Jesus got it spot on. Some of these pharisees were following rule after rule (often made up by themselves) thinking that they can become holier and holier to please God. Jesus basically said "you're missing the point". It's not about doing all these "good" deads and looking good in public. It's about actually going out there and doing love (yes the christian definition of love, as a fruit of the spirit, is a verb. You do love. you don't just feel it.) In revelation God also says to the Church (paraphrasing here) "I can see you're doing these things to be good but your missing the point."

    Finally to answer your original question. You absolutely should be able to bring up christians on what they are doing wrong and they shouldn't be defensive. Remember you are doing it to help them live a better more fulfilled life so do it as the bible says. Do it in private and not just to confront them. I find that people who use that defense know that they are doing wrong but are trying to convince themselves otherwise.

    I hope this has actually cleared up some confusion.
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    (Original post by LisaBarron)
    As far as I see it, and have always seen it, the Bible was written by men, not God. Therefore, whatever is in there isn't necessarily right or relevant these days. That's why I love everyone - divorcées, homosexuals, feminists included.

    I love God. I love my fellow humans. I love animals and insects and bad TV soaps. And, to quote the Bible, who are you to judge your neighbour? What makes your interpretation of right and wrong the correct interpretation?

    You're better to leave the judging to God and put your efforts in telling people they're wrong into loving other people instead.
    And you're saying that people who point it out if they're doing wrong don't :curious: I hate it when liberal Christians use this straw man.
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    (Original post by abc:))
    As a non-christian, my understanding of it is that christians seem to hold the view that there is a definite right and wrong, as written in the bible, and that if you commit wrong, you are in sin and [depending on the extent of your beliefs] will go to hell. However I think they also often believe that it is not for them to judge who is right and who is wrong, it is for God to judge. I think that's why a lot of Christians would be tolerant of a homosexual, say, because it's not their job to persecute them, it is God's job.

    Just to point out I don't personally hold this belief.
    I'm not sure where you got that from but the bible clearly says that you go to heaven if you accept Jesus into your life, regardless of right or wrong because Jesus died to save us from our sins.

    We have all done some wrong (God doesn't quantify it so all sin is equally wrong) so if that was the case we'd all be going to hell because heaven is perfect and sinless.
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    (Original post by shinytoy)
    well thats the way i see it. in the book of 1 Corinthians, it says we have a DUTY to point out sin amongst our brethren.

    but i recently had a friend, catholic, who is getting married in catholic church with a proper mass. she is having fully prmaritial sex and livign with her partner and contracepting.

    i said to her, how comes are you doing these things but you have just told the priest you are a practicing catholic? she said 'oh well i think these things are all ok, everyone has different understandings and feelings about the catholic beliefs' .

    so i quoted her the catechism which is totally unambigous, and says 'fornication is sex between an unmarried persons....it is gravely disordered and deeply offends human dignity'. i then explained that it was a mortal sin (against the 9th and 6th commandments of adultery and coveting anothers spouse), and she should confess, do penance and repent, and stop doing it.

    she said 'we all have different feelings about those teachings' and i said 'yes, those different feelings, if you act on them, are called sin' she got all uppity and said 'thats soo judgemental and holier than thou, you shouldnt judge'.....

    it deeply offends me to see the abuse of the sacrament of marriage, people taking communion with no respect for being in a state of grace, and not caring about avoiding sin.
    Exactly and you did the right thing with your friend. You weren't judging her either (judging her would be saying she's a bad person as opposed to saying she's doing something bad). The best thing you can do with your friend it to be the perfect example to her and to remind her that it's not a buffet. Point out the logical flaws in her reasoning and essentially point out that artifical contraception essentially makes the sexual act mutal masterbation. Maybe introduce her to NFP as well, it's within the teachings of the Church, more open to life as a mentality and actually works as well.
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    (Original post by GrassRoots)
    I'm not sure where you got that from but the bible clearly says that you go to heaven if you accept Jesus into your life, regardless of right or wrong because Jesus died to save us from our sins.

    We have all done some wrong (God doesn't quantify it so all sin is equally wrong) so if that was the case we'd all be going to hell because heaven is perfect and sinless.
    Then why, on a denomination by denomination basis, do the majority of Christians disagree with that. Besides, if you sin what you're simply doing is putting yourself ahead of God. Breaking the first commandment.
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    (Original post by Boobies.)
    I'm not a christian, but I find it quite pathetic when you have religious person A saying "But [religious person B] isn't a proper christian/muslim/jew/etc! She does this and this and this, she's a worse christian/muslim/jew/etc than me!"


    ...I personally believe that faith should be a personal thing, that you should live your own lives in accordance with the morals that you believe in and that you shouldn't concern yourself with how well other people are sticking to their religious teachings, because really it's none of your business. OP, If you challenge other people on how well they stick with their faith, maybe you should stop. It doesn't really concern you, and really has no impact on your life. Maybe they come back with "Don't judge" because judging other Christians is against your faith, so you're invalidating your own challenge by actually making it.
    This pretty much
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    (Original post by LisaBarron)
    As far as I see it, and have always seen it, the Bible was written by men, not God. Therefore, whatever is in there isn't necessarily right or relevant these days. That's why I love everyone - divorcées, homosexuals, feminists included.

    I love God. I love my fellow humans. I love animals and insects and bad TV soaps. And, to quote the Bible, who are you to judge your neighbour? What makes your interpretation of right and wrong the correct interpretation?

    You're better to leave the judging to God and put your efforts in telling people they're wrong into loving other people instead.
    I don't see why you can be Christian if you believe that the bible is the product of man.

    You accept that it is heavily edited and contrived with an agenda to push... yet you still believe in life after death, a magical creator deity etc, purely from it's authority.

    I don't mean to be offensive, but I can't see how that works.
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    (Original post by GrassRoots)
    I'm not sure where you got that from but the bible clearly says that you go to heaven if you accept Jesus into your life, regardless of right or wrong because Jesus died to save us from our sins.

    We have all done some wrong (God doesn't quantify it so all sin is equally wrong) so if that was the case we'd all be going to hell because heaven is perfect and sinless.
    By that logic so long as we say 'Jesus exists' we can do what we like.
    I didn't get it from any particular source it's based on what I've witnessed.
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    (Original post by adamrules247)
    Then why, on a denomination by denomination basis, do the majority of Christians disagree with that. Besides, if you sin what you're simply doing is putting yourself ahead of God. Breaking the first commandment.
    Yes but we don't go to heaven because we have kept the commandments. We got to heaven because Jesus died to save us from our sins. We do good and in turn follow the commanments because we love God.

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