current medics, applicants - st john ambulance?

Count yourself lucky. Maybe you're too old for them.

However, for access to networking opportunities SJA is very good once you are a student HCP and you can have opportunities to developed your clinical experience and managerial skills that you are unlikely to find anywhere else...

You have to walk around with at least one hip pouch stuffed full of useless kit, so you have the John Wayne effect going on.

I resigned from SJA.

I thought that as a student doctor my options were crap, to be honest. The old timer Johnnies looked down upon me and were positively obstructive on occasion.

It is the most rigid, inflexible organisation ever to have graced this earth, run by a select few Johnnies who are all mates with each other.

There is extremely questionable clinical governance in place. Basically, there is a tiny amount of regular doctors so the whole thing is propped up by nurses. Now, I don't know about you, but newly qualified nurses making clinical decisions such as diagnosing and whether to send to hospital or discharge, is extremely suspect.

The LINKS units are the worst. You have to walk around with at least one hip pouch stuffed full of useless kit, so you have the John Wayne effect going on.

The training is a joke, it took me years to get inducted, let alone a FA qualification.

Aye, as said above the medics only tend to go to the big duties, so as you say, the nurses prop the organisation up, not necessarily a bad thing, as it's more their kind of thing, it's alot about care rather than treatment (if you get me). The governence issue has improved with CQC (though it's only affected ambulance work and the role of the HCP). I think it depends on the nature of the casualty and what the nurse is competent in.



The first is a common issue with LINKS, they're very poorly stocked, but you should have a shoulder bag not a hip pouch (that's part of the cadet uniform). The training again is a problem with LINKS, it's not too bad in a "normal" division. Most of my adults were trained and inducted within 12 weeks of first visiting the division (they couldn't do anything for the first 6 weeks due to CRB clearance, which seems to take ages)

I resigned from SJA.

I thought that as a student doctor my options were crap, to be honest. The old timer Johnnies looked down upon me and were positively obstructive on occasion. The management didn't care. It is the most rigid, inflexible organisation ever to have graced this earth, run by a select few Johnnies who are all mates with each other.

There is extremely questionable clinical governance in place. Basically, there is a tiny amount of regular doctors so the whole thing is propped up by nurses. Now, I don't know about you, but newly qualified nurses making clinical decisions such as diagnosing and whether to send to hospital or discharge, is extremely suspect.

Especially in London, SJA seems to be stuffed full of failed medics and paramedics. The LINKS units are the worst. You have to walk around with at least one hip pouch stuffed full of useless kit, so you have the John Wayne effect going on.

The training is a joke, it took me years to get inducted, let alone a FA qualification.


Avoid SJA like the plague. I have a great idea for those who want to improve their clinical and managerial skills-join the TA and do it properly.

as we've said before - i think that must be a London district problem as it's simply not the case elsewhere.

Unless they've weeded out the idiots in TA management then the TA is even worse for cliques and the like - but they do love to circle jerk with medical students and will do almost anything to keep them including actions which lead to the resignation of a significant numbers of other HCPs when these actions include rushing the med student's fiancee to commissioning boards for the benefit of something to do with OTC ( rather than the Unit)

However, I think one of the reasons why nurses are so abundant in SJA is that they get to do **** they don't do in their day job. How often does a ward staff nurse get that level of responsibility? Frankly, I think it's ****ing dangerous and probably illegal.

It's an investment. They know the value of medical students, unlike SJA.

Come back when you've got your CCT Dig and you can argue the toss with County Medical officers over that particular issue. If emergency departments admitted or scanned everyone with a 'head injury' in case they have a bleed the average DGH would require an additional ward or two solely full of people on Neuro obs ....

Your lack of actual clinical experience is now showing, along with the usual issues surrounding Junior doctors and their lack of understanding of the competencies of Nursing Staff.

I'd be interested in what you think is illegal about providers other than Doctors completing an episode of unscheduled care ?

especially if, in the case of head injury, assessment has concluded there are no features requiring Imaging and /or admission in line with NICE guidelines and NICE 'compliant' Discharge advice is given ....

http://www.nice.org.uk/nicemedia/live/11836/36257/36257.pdf

Yawn.

Nothing to do with NICE guidelines or the other distractors you threw in there. Fact is, no staff nurse should be diagnosing and treating, period. Nurses are not doctors zippy. If they wanted to be doing all of that jazz, go to medical school. End of story.

odd then that NICE are perfectly happy for Nurses, Pharmacists, Dentists and Ambulance crew to give advice on minor head injuries following that advice and that the guidelines refer to the generic 'Clinician' except when mentioning the 'Supervising Doctor' which in NICE- speak generally means Consultant or Ass Spec - but can mean middle -grade resident on call.

Odd then that one of main targets or Nurse led Clinical Decisions Unit guidelines is Head Injury Observation and after it;s completed by the junior Doctor / Nurse practitioner in the department the care pathway then does not refer to Junior Doctors again - instead referring to the Senior Emergency Physician on Duty for any review ( admittedly they can delegate back to Junior if necessary ...