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The I-SOC (Islamic Society) (IV)

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    Asalamualikum

    Check this out ! What are your views ??
    JazakhAllah

    http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?desktop...qrzkFp_4&gl=GB
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    (Original post by HeavyTeddy)
    Halal loans could always be an option.
    What do you mean by a halal loan?
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    (Original post by Tpos)
    but I was talking about it being a necessity. Do you think it's ok for Muslims to not become doctors, teachers etc? Would that not be bad for us?
    If it's that much a necessity, we should be fighting (not necessarily literally) to create a state where we can do all these things without problems.
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    (Original post by HeavyTeddy)
    Halal loans could always be an option.
    Alhamdulillah, if there is no interest, why not?
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    (Original post by fruitfan)
    Asalamualikum

    Check this out ! What are your views ??
    JazakhAllah

    http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?desktop...qrzkFp_4&gl=GB
    OOoooh I saw this earlier, I quite liked it I liked his idea of "wearing the cross even though it's what you claim your lord was killed on" etc.
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    I realize that Islamic banks are just playing an annoying game with the interest by changing it's name and proposing Islamic alternatives, but scholars have agreed most are quite dodgy. But I was think more unproffesional halal loans.
    For example: Ethnic women (mostly somalis) have a system whereby each contribute a fixed sum of money every month. Each person has a prescribed month where they take all the sum of money that has been contributed by everyone in the system. It could be 9,000 or less. And so once the person has taken the amount of money, he/she must keep contributing till the 'round' of loans is over (normally a years time). So everyone benefits really.
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    (Original post by mel0n)
    OOoooh I saw this earlier, I quite liked it I liked his idea of "wearing the cross even though it's what you claim your lord was killed on" etc.
    Yes yes ! I agree ! Are u by any chance a fan of pearl daisy ? If not, then ignore this random question. Hehe
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    (Original post by HeavyTeddy)
    I realize that Islamic banks are just playing an annoying game with the interest by changing it's name and proposing Islamic alternatives, but scholars have agreed most are quite dodgy. But I was think more unproffesional halal loans.
    For example: Ethnic women (mostly somalis) have a system whereby each contribute a fixed sum of money every month. Each person has a prescribed month where they take all the sum of money that has been contributed by everyone in the system. It could be 9,000 or less. And so once the person has taken the amount of money, he/she must keep contributing till the 'round' of loans is over (normally a years time). So everyone benefits really.
    Ooooh this, asians have it too, they call it "kamehti/kameyti". They set it at the start and say "it's gonna be £2000 so everyone needs to contribute this much per week/fortnight - your name will come up eventually so you can take the money when your name comes up" or something. I never thought of that!
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    (Original post by fruitfan)
    Yes yes ! I agree ! Are u by any chance a fan of pearl daisy ? If not, then ignore this random question. Hehe
    Do you mean the videos or the store?
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    (Original post by S'Class)
    If it's that much a necessity, we should be fighting (not necessarily literally) to create a state where we can do all these things without problems.
    Muslims need unity before they can go around fighting for khilafa! atm there's too many people going around calling others kafir or "no you're not following the ahlus sunnah, I am" and all that.

    And then you'd need to think about how exactly it would work - who would be the leader, how it would be decided, how exactly it would be fought for etc etc etc
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    (Original post by mel0n)
    Do you mean the videos or the store?
    videos and/or facebook page
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    (Original post by Tpos)
    Muslims need unity before they can go around fighting for khilafa! atm there's too many people going around calling others kafir or "no you're not following the ahlus sunnah, I am" and all that.

    And then you'd need to think about how exactly it would work - who would be the leader, how it would be decided, how exactly it would be fought for etc etc etc
    If the Muslims are serious about it, they would do it. It wouldn't be easy - they would be called terrorists straight away. Maybe there already is such a group/s.
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    (Original post by S'Class)
    If the Muslims are serious about it, they would do it. It wouldn't be easy - they would be called terrorists straight away. Maybe there already is such a group/s.
    Have you not heard of Hizb ut Tahrir?

    And it's not easy because there's no real substance to the idea, people can't answer those questions of what it will actually be like, and how to attain it. It seems very dreamy.
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    (Original post by Tpos)
    Have you not heard of Hizb ut Tahrir?

    And it's not easy because there's no real substance to the idea, people can't answer those questions of what it will actually be like, and how to attain it. It seems very dreamy.
    I meant groups that are taking action.
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    (Original post by S'Class)
    I meant groups that are taking action.
    you're not getting my point, it's being 'attempted' by the Hizb ut Tahrir, that's what they're group is for but it's not possible/real action isn't taking place because people don't know what to do/how to go about achieving it/ and what exactly the 'it' is! imo
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    (Original post by rupertj)
    What is your definition of 'going forward'?
    Joining the modern world. Turkey has a growing economy, and actually has respect around the world, unlike Iran and Saudi - which are both governed by fanatics who care about getting personally wealthy and god. Turkey has two main problems - the treatment of the Kurds and achieving a healthy balance between secularism and non-secularism; I think it is on track to resolving these. It has a stable government, is becoming a great power and is evolving into a proper democracy. Places like Saudi are miserable places, and the world thinks they are, I'm sorry but this whole idea of a caliphate based on the Quran is never, ever going to happen. Mention Turkey to a non-muslim and they will say positive stuff, mention Saudi and they will shudder.

    (Original post by getoom)
    are you shia by any chance?
    My parents are, I'm not religious myself.
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    (Original post by Ferdowsi)
    Joining the modern world. Turkey has a growing economy, and actually has respect around the world, unlike Iran and Saudi - which are both governed by fanatics who care about getting personally wealthy and god. Turkey has two main problems - the treatment of the Kurds and achieving a healthy balance between secularism and non-secularism; I think it is on track to resolving these. It has a stable government, is becoming a great power and is evolving into a proper democracy. Places like Saudi are miserable places, and the world thinks they are, I'm sorry but this whole idea of a caliphate based on the Quran is never, ever going to happen.



    My parents are, I'm not religious myself.
    The problem is that lots of Muslims will agree that the governance of Saudi Arabia is corrupt- the monarchy are unelected elites who arose to power thanks to the western world, and the 'caliphate' will be restored with the overthrow of these dictators (hence why there has been overwhelming support for the arab spring by many Islamist groups)- what they don't believe in is liberal democracy and its corrupt moral framework that heralds individualism, selfishness, the deconstruction of traditional social values etc that the caliphate is supposed to instill.

    the problem is that no group has actually detailed the mechanism to which this social justice can be instilled, which is an issue that is inherent with anything that claims prophecy.
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    (Original post by Tpos)
    Muslims need unity before they can go around fighting for khilafa! atm there's too many people going around calling others kafir or "no you're not following the ahlus sunnah, I am" and all that.

    And then you'd need to think about how exactly it would work - who would be the leader, how it would be decided, how exactly it would be fought for etc etc etc
    there have already been groups which have talked about these practical measures, as you have mentioned, Hizb is a good example. The problem is that such groups fail to take into account the psychological concepts of the individual, and instead fall for the same type of romanticism that shaped the earlier communist vision that was heralded by Lenin. Yet at the same time they denounce socialism as a means of political or social organisation.
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    (Original post by Phantom_X)
    The problem is that lots of Muslims will agree that the governance of Saudi Arabia is corrupt- the monarchy are unelected elites who arose to power thanks to the western world, and the 'caliphate' will be restored with the overthrow of these dictators (hence why there has been overwhelming support for the arab spring by many Islamist groups)- what they don't believe in is liberal democracy and its corrupt moral framework that heralds individualism, selfishness, the deconstruction of traditional social values etc that the caliphate is supposed to instill.

    the problem is that no group has actually detailed the mechanism to which this social justice can be instilled, which is an issue that is inherent with anything that claims prophecy.
    The caliphate will morph into a dictatorship.
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    (Original post by In2deep)
    Should we blame ourselves as implementers or should we blame the system?





    Very true, especially your last point, we as Muslims except more from a country that claims to implement Islamic Law, its shortcomings are clear for everyone to see especially in oppression and corruption.
    omg noone is blaming the system... wtf are you talking about?? we're just saying there are alrenatives
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