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[Daily Mail] Daily Mail - Muslims 'are more patriotic than most British people'

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Original post by noisy06
Yes, they have to marry according to Islamic law, if they don't then the marriage will not be recognized by God. It all boils down to if someone cares for their religion or not, the overwhelming majority of Muslims clearly do because practically every Muslim marries according to Islamic law in both the UK and elsewhere.


A marriage is a marriage.

Whether or not it involves religion has no effect on its validity in the eyes of the law.

Original post by noisy06
I have to hand it to you, you did a good job researching the opinions of the Hanbalis, Malikis and Shafi'is. But all three schools of thoughts and also by consensus of all scholars of Islam, the marriage contract becomes invalid if a girl objects to the marriage after the contract is finalized without her presence. In other words, the Hanbalis say that a girl can be given in marriage without her consent (something that is wrong and is disputed anyway) but even the Hanbalis agree that the contract becomes invalid after the girl's objection becomes apparent.


That still doesn't change the fact that it's possible to justify forced marriage under Sharia law.

Read about a 15 year old girl forced to marry a 40 year old man:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/7783627.stm

"He said he knew of a 15-year-old girl in Pakistan who was tricked into marriage over the telephone with a 40-year-old man from Sheffield, who had the mental age of a four-year-old child.

"The Home Office refused to recognise the validity of the marriage but the Islamic Sharia Council in Britain accepted it," said Dr Al-Alawi."

This is the tip of the iceberg.

Back in August, the government tried to launch an enquiry into these courts but it had to be abandoned since these courts wouldn't co-operate.

What are they trying to hide I wonder?
Reply 101
Original post by Grim_the_Reaper
A marriage is a marriage.

Whether or not it involves religion has no effect on its validity in the eyes of the law.

That still doesn't change the fact that it's possible to justify forced marriage under Sharia law. Read about a 15 year old girl forced to marry a 40 year old man:
What are they trying to hide I wonder?

That is laughable to any sane Muslim. The marriage might be valid in the eyes of UK laws but if it isn't an Islamic marriage then this is fornication and the marriage is non-existent, God will not recognize such a marriage. A Muslim couple have to undergo an Islamic marriage contract and also sign up as married in accordance with UK laws, they have to do both.

Well, that BBC story was disturbing, forced marriages are part of the cultural norms of some Muslim countries, there is no question that the practice is invalid and the marriage is invalid. I know a few scholars on a personal level at the Shariah council of Britain and I know for a fact that they wouldn't recognize such a marriage, this is in fact what they teach themselves so I'm quite confused as to how the council was reported to have accepted the marriage, especially as the marriage contract wasn't even done in the UK, that's not even possible. There is inconsistency in that report. How can a UK imam comment on anything happening in Bangladesh or Pakistan? That's crazy.
Original post by Kolya
Isn't it a little unbritish to be proud of being british? some would say so. I'd certainly be shocked if a Brit was optimistic about the future of the country - it's just not the done thing.
Simply isn't cricket.
Original post by noisy06
That is laughable to any sane Muslim. The marriage might be valid in the eyes of UK laws but if it isn't an Islamic marriage then this is fornication and the marriage is non-existent, God will not recognize such a marriage. A Muslim couple have to undergo an Islamic marriage contract and also sign up as married in accordance with UK laws, they have to do both.


The British legal system is based in reality and around the rights of the individual, not what mystical sky fairies think.

Original post by noisy06
Well, that BBC story was disturbing, forced marriages are part of the cultural norms of some Muslim countries, there is no question that the practice is invalid and the marriage is invalid. I know a few scholars on a personal level at the Shariah council of Britain and I know for a fact that they wouldn't recognize such a marriage, this is in fact what they teach themselves so I'm quite confused as to how the council was reported to have accepted the marriage, especially as the marriage contract wasn't even done in the UK, that's not even possible. There is inconsistency in that report. How can a UK imam comment on anything happening in Bangladesh or Pakistan? That's crazy.


I can't say I'm surprised they'd allow it after some of their other statements and rulings:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/rape-impossible-in-marriage-says-muslim-cleric-2106161.html

http://www.islamic-sharia.org/general/on-the-testimony-of-women-2.html

It's obvious that these Sharia, and Sharia law itself, organisations have no respect for gender equality.

When it comes forced marriage, Sharia law is part of the problem rather than the solution.
(edited 12 years ago)
Reply 104
Original post by Grim_the_Reaper
x

You're opinion with regards to shariah law is just none of my business and has no value to me. If you think Muslims won't marry and divorce according to Sharia law you are basically insane. Keep dreaming.
Original post by noisy06
You're opinion with regards to shariah law is just none of my business and has no value to me. If you think Muslims won't marry and divorce according to Sharia law you are basically insane. Keep dreaming.


At one time you were deemed insane if you thought Christians wouldn't marry and divorce according to ecclesiastical law.

The religion of the bride and groom is irrelevant under English/Scots/Northern Irish law.

it's just plain daft to have seperate religious courts/tribunals/councils exercising jurisdiction over the marriages, inheritances, divorce etc. of these groups.

Allowing this would lead to anarchy.
(edited 12 years ago)

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