See this is my problem with feminists. You think that other people's problems are less urgent. I cannot believe you genuinely think that women being paid less in some jobs is actually more important than a father playing a role in his child's life. I also thoroughly disagree with your communal upbringing idea and your ideas that children should be brought up in a community are not relevant to the fact that the oppression of some groups of men are just as/more pressing than some of those issues facing women. I study history and had to do a lot of reading on women's history and obviously a lot of staunch feminists write about it. Their approaches are so biased and even say that men's history isn't even worth mentioning alongside female history. This seems to be the approach you take here. I don't understand the selfish attitude of only wanting to help a particular group of people. Why not everyone who is oppressed? Why does it have to be women under the name of feminism? Why do you not care about those men who are oppressed in society and want to play a part in their child's life but gender constructs don't allow them to? Men are oppressed by gender constructs as well, not just women. While you may feel that men seem to be superior in society, as at least one male in this thread has already mentioned, he (and I'm sure many others) feel that women are superior within society. I understand that everyone sees the world differently and women have every right to feel oppressed, as do men, but I think it is thoroughly offensive to say that male oppression is less urgent. It's ignorant and obnoxious, like you feel that women deserve more than men. We both oppress each other in different ways and maybe you should be a little bit more sensitive to that and male issues and not just think that women have always been oppressed and should be emancipated immediately. Why not work for greater equality for every sex/race/religion etc? It seems a lot more fair to me, I just don't understand why everyone fights for things based on their wants and not looking at other people's wants/needs as well as their own.
(Original post by When you see it...)
That is just one issue which obviously needs to be addressed. There is no point in basing a comprehensive political viewpoint (i.e. 'masculinism') on such individual viewpoints. Once women are paid the same as men (the statistics don't lie regardless of your personal experience - if someone said to you 'I have shot a lot of heroin in my time and have never been harmed, therefore it is stupid to say that heroin is harmful therefore drugs education should not exist', you would think that they are an obnoxious moron - that is exactly how I have reacted to your post) then we can concentrate on these microcosmic
issues of men being 'oppressed' (IMO it is a moot point as I disagree with family values and believe children should be raised communally, eliminating the need for fathers and mothers, making this a non-issue). Anyway, I respect your viewpoint but strongly
disagree with just about everything you have said here. Feminism is just a word to describe a set of opinions on a set of issues. Believing in feminism doesn't mean that I don't sympathise with male concerns, I just think that male concerns are less urgent.
Can I just say that in your comment you seem to be implying that women have the same opportunities as men. This is not true and there is no debate there - look at employment/salary statistics and compare them to qualifications statistics. It is a joke to suggest that 'in the past it was worse, so therefore we have improved enough already'. What is your opinion on the black emancipation in the US in the 1960s? Do you think that the likes of Malcolm X and Rosa Parks were wrong to try to give blacks the same opportunities as whites? If you were around in those days, would you have said 'blacks were slaves in history, therefore it is stupid to complain about having to stand up for whites'? You can't deny that gender inequality still exists and that it is worse for women than for men.
Also, I just want to add that female oppression is nowhere near the scale of black oppression in the 1960s and I completely endorse what they did and think they are amazing people for bringing about such changes. But the thing is that there wasn't equivalent white oppression, which also needed to be conquered. They were fighting for equality with a race that saw themselves as superior. I have never met a man who would force a woman to give up his seat for him on a bus etc. I don't think you can compare the 'problems' of women today to the black emancipation in the US in the 1960s.
Last edited by moomin_love; 24-12-2011 at 14:06.
Every single feminist i have met both at college and elsewhere have and told me to f*** off cos im a man and men are just stupid, idle and lazy. And they probably do behind your back, feminsts had issues to complain about 100 years ago and i agree with equal rights on that, but not now, its simply not true. Ever thought about your own genders issues and oppression?
(Original post by Aleandcynicism)
Care to back ANY of this up?
And yes, those feminists I'm friends with must laugh and ridicule me so much for being a feminist man. And obviously hate me. After all, they hate men
Last edited by the mezzil; 24-12-2011 at 23:34.