The Pupillage Interview/Acceptance/Rejection Thread 2012

On a practical note, is anyone else having trouble with the applications for Stone and Falcon? Bits keep disappearing on Stone's app, and the window that pops out in the Falcon one doesn't correlate to the lines on the PDF...this is not helping me think fondly of these chambers!

I had the same problem with Falcon - I just typed away anyway, ignoring the fact that the lines do not line up.. Ah well.

Reply 21

nearmiss

another year of applications begins...

I imagine that this never happens, but on the off chance, does anyone know whether a set would ever be permitted to allow an earlier start date than 2013 for a pupillage advertised to begin in 2013? This of course depends on actually getting an offer in the first place!

Original post by nearmiss

I imagine that this never happens, but on the off chance, does anyone know whether a set would ever be permitted to allow an earlier start date than 2013 for a pupillage advertised to begin in 2013? This of course depends on actually getting an offer in the first place!

I'm going to assume from your question that you've finished the BPTC, and therefore any time in between getting an offer and actually starting the pupillage would be time you'd rather spend in your first six rather than in your current job. In which case there have been several instances that I'm aware of where a pupillage has commenced earlier than advertised. In fact, the circumstances in which I've seen it happen would lead me to believe that Chambers have a fairly free choice as to when a pupillage starts, notwithstanding the regulation in place for the procedure leading up to the offering of the pupillage.

Whether or not that would be possible would very much depend on the approach of the individual Chambers. If a pupil has been taken every year and always starts in September, for example, I expect that the Chambers would want to stick to staggering its pupils in the same manner. On the other hand, if the Chambers hasn't taken a pupil in a year or two, or will be taking two or more at one time with a view to tenancy (i.e. not a 'competitive' pupillage), it may well be that they would want you to start as soon as possible.

So the short answer is that as far as I am aware yes, Chambers can and do start pupillages earlier than advertised.

Reply 23

Isherwood100

Could anyone offer an opinion on what this Chambers is trying to find out with this question:
(a) give information which demonstrates your current knowledge and experience of law

This is after one's results at LLB/GDL and BPTC level have been listed, as well as mini-pupillages - any thoughts?

Reply 24

younglawyer

10

Original post by Isherwood100

Could anyone offer an opinion on what this Chambers is trying to find out with this question:
(a) give information which demonstrates your current knowledge and experience of law

This is after one's results at LLB/GDL and BPTC level have been listed, as well as mini-pupillages - any thoughts?

They're probably checking to see how much you know about your relevant area of law or maybe your legal experience in general? - Testing your dedication to law and indeed a career at the Bar.

Reply 25

Kessler`

11

Original post by Isherwood100

Could anyone offer an opinion on what this Chambers is trying to find out with this question:
(a) give information which demonstrates your current knowledge and experience of law

This is after one's results at LLB/GDL and BPTC level have been listed, as well as mini-pupillages - any thoughts?

Ideally, they're after work experience. This can be paid or voluntary, usually including citizen's advice burea work, FRU and so on. Have you got any of this? I found that this aspect of the application has become more and more important in app forms.

It can also mean published writing, presentations and seminars that you have led.

Think 'law in action' as a heading for this section.

Reply 26

Hell_to_pay

Original post by Isherwood100

Could anyone offer an opinion on what this Chambers is trying to find out with this question:
(a) give information which demonstrates your current knowledge and experience of law

This is after one's results at LLB/GDL and BPTC level have been listed, as well as mini-pupillages - any thoughts?

I would have thought that chambers would like most to see how your knowledge of the law has informed and enhanced your experience in the law.

You may favour an answer structured along the following lines:

(1) this is what I'm interested in (if there is anything in particular + give any relevant successes)
(2) this is how I've used that knowledge in terms of practical, on your feet experience (this might be CAB, FRU etc...)

H2P

(edited 12 years ago)

Reply 27

Isherwood100

I don't have any FRU/CAB experience, sadly - this is the trouble with working and studying part-time (however I didn't get the impression during interviews last year that commercial/Chancery sets are necessarily expecting candidates to have done FRU, though I'm sure it's always a plus). I guess I can talk about experience gained through preparing for moots, and through my work. The perils of being a non-traditional student!

For those making repeat applications, are you talking in detail about why you're applying again and why you think your application is better this time round? I had one chambers tell me they wanted to see this, but the others don't seem to indicate either way.

Reply 28

younglawyer

10

Original post by Isherwood100

I don't have any FRU/CAB experience, sadly - this is the trouble with working and studying part-time (however I didn't get the impression during interviews last year that commercial/Chancery sets are necessarily expecting candidates to have done FRU, though I'm sure it's always a plus). I guess I can talk about experience gained through preparing for moots, and through my work. The perils of being a non-traditional student!

For those making repeat applications, are you talking in detail about why you're applying again and why you think your application is better this time round? I had one chambers tell me they wanted to see this, but the others don't seem to indicate either way.

I haven't really come across this tbh, although I did hear sometimes it can be a positive since you'll say why now you're a better candidate than others and the steady/quick development you've made.

Reply 29

Hell_to_pay

Original post by Isherwood100

I don't have any FRU/CAB experience, sadly - this is the trouble with working and studying part-time (however I didn't get the impression during interviews last year that commercial/Chancery sets are necessarily expecting candidates to have done FRU, though I'm sure it's always a plus). I guess I can talk about experience gained through preparing for moots, and through my work. The perils of being a non-traditional student!

For those making repeat applications, are you talking in detail about why you're applying again and why you think your application is better this time round? I had one chambers tell me they wanted to see this, but the others don't seem to indicate either way.

Personally speaking, if chambers are silent on the issue, I would hesitate before drawing attention to the fact that I was applying again.

My reasoning is as follows:

- Be honest with yourself and only include details that are positively advancing your application.

- If you've undertaken a lot more work experience since last year's application, what is the benefit of saying: last year I didn't have this experience? In my opinion that would be an imprudent use of words as it draws attention away from your success to dwell on a prior insufficiency.

- I find it difficult to imagine chambers taking the time to check whether you've applied in the past, and then taking the time to draw inferences (positive or negative) from that fact. Recognising your face at interview is perhaps a different story, but you can have an answer prepared for that to demonstrate your tenacity and focus.

Reply 30

honest john

Dear all,

I have been passed the details of a new blog that is starting which may be of interest. The blog is called "Baricitor" and is by a current solicitor who was offered training contracts and pupillages, and decided to go with the former. Apparently it is in the early stages but Baricitor is happy to answer questions.

Thought it might be of interest!

Reply 31

honest john

whoops- the link is http://Baricitor.blog.co.uk/2012/01/13/welcome-12441349/

Reply 32

Kessler`

11

I would be interested to know if this blogger were offered pupillage and turned it down in favour of going through another set of exams. That would be very unusual. His introduction states that he "passed the bar" and then decided to qualify as a solicitor. In the old days, that's what many people did after being not obtaining pupillage, i.e did the cross-qualification course. Sadly, that option is no longer available.

Reply 33

san202

You can still cross qualify, but it involves doing a reduced LPC and reduced training contract. Although I just finished the BPTC last summer, I was offered a position to put me through the new conversion. I didn't think it was possible but did the research. The last I read, it wasn't fully agreed exactly what BPTC grads would be exempt from, but would most likely include the litigation and advocacy elements. There was less information on the training contract side of things.

Reply 34

A007

Has anyone had a first round interview at East Anglian Chambers???? I desperately need to some guidelines pleaseeee

Original post by honest john

whoops- the link is http://Baricitor.blog.co.uk/2012/01/13/welcome-12441349/

My initial response to that blog would be one of caution, because to be perfectly honest I don't think the initial post makes things particularly clear. The opening paragraph is riddled with things that someone who has never practised as a solicitor or barrister (which seems to be the 'target audience' for this blog) could very easily misinterpret. I picked out five ambiguous and/or potentially misleading statements within the first paragraph alone. Considering that target audience, I think he needs to be a lot clearer and/or more detailed going forward than he is now. He also needs to be very careful that he doesn't inadvertently misrepresent his position given the limited knowledge of many who will read that blog.

Obviously he has only made two posts so far, and to be fair to him the second does not suffer from the same issues as the first, and makes points that are far clearer. I just hope that as and when he returns to the issues that he touched upon in his first post, he deals with them with a suitable level of clarity and detail given the nature of those people that he seemingly wants to be reading the blog.

Reply 36

nulli tertius

21

Original post by Kessler`

I would be interested to know if this blogger were offered pupillage and turned it down in favour of going through another set of exams. That would be very unusual. His introduction states that he "passed the bar" and then decided to qualify as a solicitor. In the old days, that's what many people did after being not obtaining pupillage, i.e did the cross-qualification course. Sadly, that option is no longer available.

I'm not sure whether this man is in the position you describe. It is now possible for a barrister who has undertaken pupillage to conduct litigation and perform advocacy as an employee of a solicitors' firm and provided the firm is an LLP or company, to be a member of that firm.

Reply 37

Kessler`

11

Original post by nulli tertius

I'm not sure whether this man is in the position you describe. It is now possible for a barrister who has undertaken pupillage to conduct litigation and perform advocacy as an employee of a solicitors' firm and provided the firm is an LLP or company, to be a member of that firm.

I agree that's a possibility, he could be an in-house advocate. I confess to being led a little by the claim that he was "offered training contracts and pupillages and decided to go with the former", albeit I recognise that claim is not sourced from the blog. However, with that in mind, are you not still entitled to hold yourself out as an employed barrister, rather than a "higher rights advocate" as he labels himself? It seems an odd choice of words for an in-house barrister.

Reply 38

nulli tertius

21

Original post by Kessler`

I agree that's a possibility, he could be an in-house advocate. I confess to being led a little by the claim that he was "offered training contracts and pupillages and decided to go with the former", albeit I recognise that claim is not sourced from the blog. However, with that in mind, are you not still entitled to hold yourself out as an employed barrister, rather than a "higher rights advocate" as he labels himself? It seems an odd choice of words for an in-house barrister.

The whole thing is riddled with ambiguities.

I think you can call yourself an employed barrister in this situation but equally those advocates with higher rights who are not barristers tend to go by the title "solicitor" :smile:

Personally my interpretation of the blog was that he was actually offered neither pupillage nor a training contract, but joined a solicitors firm either as an in house advocate or a paralegal after finishing the BVC (as I expect it was when he did it). My understanding is that in neither of those positions would be be able to hold himself out to be an 'employed barrister', nor indeed would he be able to obtain higher rights. I expect he has cross qualified at a time when that was more easily done than nowadays, and then secured his higher rights after cross qualifying. He would technically be a solicitor, though given his clear desire to put himself across as 'part barrister' by emphasising the advocacy, he has actually not labelled himself as either a solicitor or barrister, preferring 'higher rights advocate'.

As has already been said, it's ambiguous whichever way you spin it. That's my guess, but I could very well be wrong.

The Pupillage Interview/Acceptance/Rejection Thread 2012

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