GOGSoc Episode V: The GOG Strikes Back

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Reply 1120

Socrates

Original post by m:)ckel

Yeah, I recently got negged for a maths question I answered six and a half years ago.

no respect for the elders these days :no:

Reply 1121

kka25

Hi there

I usually will start around 9:00am - 5:30pm, just like a normal office setting (sometimes 10:00am/10:30am - 5:30pm :tongue:

). And since I'm still doing my literature review, I'm at the moment would read one or two papers a day; how many papers do you read per day or per week? :smile:

I'm planning to have a no-work-day during the weekends; just to relax because I don't want to get burnt out when I reached 3rd year :eek:

I would think that managing the PhD is very important since I don't want to get too stressed out and I would really like to get the best outcome as possible.

How do you manage yours? :smile:

Original post by obi_adorno_kenobi

We had to do it at the institution I was at for my PhD (it's a pile of **** as a piece of software though). It wasn't done at undergraduate nor at master's over the water.

What do you say it's that? I'm going to use it soon =/

(edited 12 years ago)

Reply 1122

flying plum

Original post by Athena

I think the problem is that she would like to penalise much more harshly than the university marking scheme will allow her (or possibly she's asked 'how much should I penalise?' and the university said 'not at all'). I think if I'd ever plagiarised for an essay and been caught, I would have been in unbelievably deep **** :/

I'm surprised at what I've heard actually - I only had contact once with anyone who got into any sort of trouble for this, but it was his first essay in our first year, and he forgot to reference three sources (as in, the little 'number' was there in the text, but he didn't complete the footnote in his haste) and he was pulled up before an internal plagarism committee.

I think adorno has a point though - is it possible to mark the essay without taking the plagarised part into account, and then they are only marked for what they have written. If they've stolen a key argument, then presumably their essay is going to do badly and they are not rewarded for cheating?

Reply 1123

Craghyrax

I had my final session this morning on teaching undergrads. The focus was on marking. It was really encouraging! I was worrying, after Cirsium's experience, that UEA would be even more of a pushover for undergrads. However they're actually pretty fair and strict, from what I saw. So hopefully I won't spend the next two years bashing my head on my keyboard.
Although I shouldn't speak too soon...

Reply 1124

the_alba

Original post by Craghyrax

That's good, but what is said in inductions and what happens in practice can be very different things (theory v. practice, etc). My management induction was very heavy on plagiarism and how 'seriously' it is taken. This wasn't borne out over the year of teaching, though :s-smilie:

In other news, no news on the NC job :frown:

They said end of Feb, and they clearly meant it. Very anxious-making, as our long experience of post-interview rejection suggests the longer the wait the more likely you're in for bad news.

(edited 12 years ago)

Reply 1125

Craghyrax

Original post by the_alba

True.

In other news, no news on the NC job :frown:

They said end of Feb, and they clearly meant it. Very anxious-making, as our long experience of post-interview rejection suggests the longer the wait the more likely you're in for bad news.

Reply 1126

Hylean

Original post by obi_adorno_kenobi

The examples you provide here are crimes against other people, that's the major difference. Plagiarism in an undergraduate essay isn't a crime against anyone in particular, it's a failing of the individual to do their work properly. Some may not realise that they're doing it; others will do it deliberately because they have left their essay to the last minute or they're simply too lazy to reference properly. In the end the infraction is against their own success.

Actually, it's a crime against the scholar who wrote the original piece. Someone is taking their work and claiming it as their own. It's on the same level as internet piracy, ultimately. Moreover, if someone is taught at undergrad level that plagiarism isn't that bad, they are quite likely to plagiarise throughout their entire academic career, which is hardly good practice.

Original post by obi_adorno_kenobi

Well other people's jobs is what I had in mind but it doesn't really matter in the grand scale of this discussion.

Of course it matters, as it sends out the wrong message to undergrads! It teaches them completely the wrong methodology and leads to sloppy work, research, etc. which will impact the department when such students get to postgrad degrees, etc.

The only issue with plagiarism is whether or not it was intentional. If it is just forgotten to reference, then that's fine and this is usually obvious through the nature of the student's referencing in the first place. I have myself been called up on missing references, and it was accepted as unintentional because my work was well referenced on the whole.

If it's intentional, it should be a straight 0 marks for that essay. I wouldn't kick them out, but probation a definite and if they continue to plagiarise, then kick them out.

Reply 1127

Craghyrax

I broadly agree, except that international students should be given a second chance, and some very clear explanation and training, since 'plagiarism' as we understand it is positively encouraged in some other learning contexts.

Reply 1128

Hylean

Original post by Craghyrax

I did not know that, and then that makes sense if we allow certain cultures a second chance in that regard.

Reply 1129

Craghyrax

Original post by Hylean

I did not know that, and then that makes sense if we allow certain cultures a second chance in that regard.

Its to do with the emphasis on 'critical thinking' and originality that is predominant in the Anglo-centric/European world. In the Asian system copying, rote learning and repetition are strongly encouraged which puts them at a disadvantage to English students if they enter the UK education system at University level.
I've been doing some conversation classes with three Taiwanese students doing Masters here, and we've been discussing different learning priorities, cultures and expectations here and there, and its been quite interesting! :smile:

I'll report back once I've actually read up on relevant research. They asked me to get some for them, so we'll cover it anyway.

Reply 1130

Hylean

Original post by Craghyrax

Hmm, interesting. I can see how that would be a problem. It should be a compulsory course for all first years, and such students, to take a module on how to write an essay, reference, etc. unless they can show they've taken a similar course elsewhere which teaches the right standards, I guess.

Reply 1131

The Lyceum

Cambridge AHRC interview. Two professors I wouldn't mind work with either (well one very young but ideologically speaking similar to me, the other uber famous and scary).

I believe the correct phrase is "noice und toight".

Need accommodation suggestions, Craghy? Not wallet raping preferably.

Reply 1132

Socrates

Original post by Craghyrax

That's a very important point, and Hylean's solution about essay writing and what is to be expected is more important than we might take it to mean. I was shocked myself here in the seminary in Iraq we are actually expected to memorise sections of the text and be able to read them out verbatim when asked to in oral tests or even written papers.

Reply 1133

sj27

Original post by The Lyceum

Ooh, good luck!

Back to the other subject: I went and checked my old uni's policy. "Mild" first time plagiarism (forgetting to reference etc), warning and/or 5 marks docked. Serious cases (wholesale lifting of paragraphs or more) and repeat offender of mild cases: 15-20 mark dock (so one could feasibly fail an assignment as a result I guess). Repeat of serious cases - referral and possible exclusion. In all instances records kept against student's name. Whether or not any of this happened in practice, I have no idea.

(edited 12 years ago)

Reply 1134

hobnob

Gah. I was so pleased with myself for having written half of my introduction in draft form yesterday, and now that I'm typing up my notes I'm rapidly discovering that most of it is unusable rubbish. :frown:

Reply 1135

QHF

Original post by The Lyceum

Ooh! Good luck, I hope it goes well!

Reply 1136

Craghyrax

Original post by The Lyceum

What Athena said. All the hotels are expensive, although there is a youth hostel.
The X5 bus goes between Oxford and Cambridge for £1 a ticket if you book in advance on the megabus website. If you've not been before, it is a bit queasy as it goes round something like 40 roundabouts. But most people are absolutely fine with it, and it will save you loads of money.

The X5!

Original post by The Lyceum

Best of luck :biggrin:

Reply 1139

The Lyceum

Thanks guys. I thought about asking the dept but I figured that since it's for one day they'd just tell me to get up really early and get down there or something.